List of stuff to run Forced Induction
Feb 4, 2010, 09:10 AM
#1
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List of stuff to run Forced Induction
A lot of people have asked so I decided to do a quick writeup on what you need to properly run a forced induction application on a '04-'06 Ralliart. This applies to turbo and superchargers.
1) Larger fuel injectors. Required to supply the extra fuel. The stockers are 330cc. That's about enough to make 180hp-200hp. Adding an extra injector to the intake doesn't work because it doesn't distribute the fuel properly between cylinders.
2) Larger fuel pump. On higher boost applications this is necessary because the stocker can't supply enough fuel flow. 200-250hp the stocker should be OK.
3) 3bar-4bar MAP sensor. The EVO sensor works just fine. This is necessary to get the fuelling correct and allow for overboost protection. The MAF sensor on this car is used for fuel but so is the MAP sensor so if it can't detect boost it can't provide the needed fuel.
4) Reflash. Computer needs to be reprogrammed to handle the extra fuel, boost cut and larger fuel injectors so it starts in the cold and runs/idles properly.
Things you don't need...
1) Larger MAF. The MAF installed has no problems measuring 300hp of air.
2) larger fuel rail. Stock unit is more than sufficient for anything under 400whp.
3) larger throttle body. Stock unit is large enough to support most applications. Yes you can upgrade it but the gains won't be very significant on a boosted application.
Hope this answers a few questions for those interested in boosting their cars.
-Michael
1) Larger fuel injectors. Required to supply the extra fuel. The stockers are 330cc. That's about enough to make 180hp-200hp. Adding an extra injector to the intake doesn't work because it doesn't distribute the fuel properly between cylinders.
2) Larger fuel pump. On higher boost applications this is necessary because the stocker can't supply enough fuel flow. 200-250hp the stocker should be OK.
3) 3bar-4bar MAP sensor. The EVO sensor works just fine. This is necessary to get the fuelling correct and allow for overboost protection. The MAF sensor on this car is used for fuel but so is the MAP sensor so if it can't detect boost it can't provide the needed fuel.
4) Reflash. Computer needs to be reprogrammed to handle the extra fuel, boost cut and larger fuel injectors so it starts in the cold and runs/idles properly.
Things you don't need...
1) Larger MAF. The MAF installed has no problems measuring 300hp of air.
2) larger fuel rail. Stock unit is more than sufficient for anything under 400whp.
3) larger throttle body. Stock unit is large enough to support most applications. Yes you can upgrade it but the gains won't be very significant on a boosted application.
Hope this answers a few questions for those interested in boosting their cars.
-Michael
Feb 22, 2010, 10:39 AM
#6
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The MAP sensor from an EVO is a direct swap but you must make sure it's the 3 bar sensor. It also needs the reflash to run that - otherwise it will throw a BARO Correlation code. The car also gets its base fuel values from the MAP sensor and TPS which is one of the things that took hundreds of hours to figure out in the ROM.
-Michael
-Michael
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Feb 24, 2010, 04:22 PM
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Supercharger?
What specifics with a supercharger? I was looking into the one from RIPP Mods, basically because I can't find another one anywhere. I actually went to the site to look for it and the page is blank now, any ideas?
Feb 27, 2010, 05:40 AM
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email or call them might be a good start ... or find the post about the guy that had one done and the fuel line ruptured in the engine bay and the car burnt to the ground in a ball of fire ...
Jun 8, 2010, 06:12 AM
#11
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Yes head work helps and the IM is pretty restrictive.
One further point about the MAF. I've done a lot of testing in the past 2 weeks. The factory MAF will handle about 300bhp or somewhere around 265whp. It's in about a 2.35" pipe. Most CAIs and turbo setups relocate the MAF into an aluminum pipe. With a piece of 2.5"OD pipe it is really close to the factory MAF size.
On a forged engine I tried increasing the size to 2.75" OD - maybe 2.6" ID and this one ran out of airflow at about 310whp. So if you're going to shoot for big power you will need a larger MAF sensor.
As for MAF placement I've also found that suck through and blowthrough both work. You need to make sure the MAF has a straight run of pipe and placement of the BOV is critical.
-Michael
One further point about the MAF. I've done a lot of testing in the past 2 weeks. The factory MAF will handle about 300bhp or somewhere around 265whp. It's in about a 2.35" pipe. Most CAIs and turbo setups relocate the MAF into an aluminum pipe. With a piece of 2.5"OD pipe it is really close to the factory MAF size.
On a forged engine I tried increasing the size to 2.75" OD - maybe 2.6" ID and this one ran out of airflow at about 310whp. So if you're going to shoot for big power you will need a larger MAF sensor.
As for MAF placement I've also found that suck through and blowthrough both work. You need to make sure the MAF has a straight run of pipe and placement of the BOV is critical.
-Michael
Jun 8, 2010, 05:08 PM
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IIRC:
MAP is the manifold air pressure - measures the pressure in the manifold before it goes into the engine
MAF is the manifold air flow - usually on a pipe before it gets to the manifold to measure how much air is going to the manifold
but dont quote me on that ...
MAP is the manifold air pressure - measures the pressure in the manifold before it goes into the engine
MAF is the manifold air flow - usually on a pipe before it gets to the manifold to measure how much air is going to the manifold
but dont quote me on that ...
Jun 12, 2010, 03:05 AM
#15
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stevox got it right.
On the ralliart the MAP, MAF and TPS are all involved in the fuel calculations. This is what made the car so difficult to crack for turbo - the fuel calculation strategy is setup only for running NA.
the MAF is a little sensor that measures the amount of airflow given a diameter of pipe it's installed in. So if you increase the size of pipe you increase the airflow capacity of the sensor. Personally, i feel that if you've got a forged engine and are looking for lots of power then you should be going with a 3" MAF tube.
-Michael
On the ralliart the MAP, MAF and TPS are all involved in the fuel calculations. This is what made the car so difficult to crack for turbo - the fuel calculation strategy is setup only for running NA.
the MAF is a little sensor that measures the amount of airflow given a diameter of pipe it's installed in. So if you increase the size of pipe you increase the airflow capacity of the sensor. Personally, i feel that if you've got a forged engine and are looking for lots of power then you should be going with a 3" MAF tube.
-Michael