tunermt

Recently i have had a lot of people asking about the Infinity ecu's and what sets them apart from the other ECU options on the market.

After tuning more than a few Infinity ECU's I wanted to share some details about the Individual cylinder knock control functions and cylinder trims. For the full write up and build details of the the engine from the data logs below check out the Blog. AEM Infinity 6 2jz tuning

The Infinity’s individual cylinder knock control coupled with a VE dual knock sensor kit delivers a clear “tune-able” frequency, flat response or “wide band knock sensor” knock signal. This high resolution engine noise data can then be fine tuned even further calculating precise ignition/fuel changes per individual cylinder.

VE dual channel knock kit with Coax shielded harness:


By using the VE wide band knock sensor kit and harness through a proper calibration we are able to fine tune each cylinder through the Infinity ems for peak performance and reliability. The Individual cylinder knock monitoring also allows us to monitor which cylinders are prone to problems, aka “unhappy cylinder”. By trimming fuel and ignition per cylinder we are able to keep each cylinder “happy” ensuring all cylinders get exactly the fuel/ignition timing they need for peak cylinder pressure without any pre ignition or detonation aka Knock. The data logs below clearly show a pull when the Infinity is picking up some knock from cylinders 1 and 5 and a pull where the tune/infinity have better balanced each cylinder and the knock control does not need to make any changes.

Cylinders 1 and 5 starting to pick up some noise:


All cylinders balanced, no engine noise from any cylinders:


Notice the first log you can see cylinder 1 & 5 just starting to pick up some engine noise while the other cylinders remain very quiet. In the second log after further tuning you can see where all cylinders are “quiet” and better balanced. This data is extremely useful and allows us to fine tune an engine further with more reliability than ever before. This same engine on another ECU without the flat response/wide band knock sensors would not have been able to pick up this small amount of engine noise let alone assign it to individual cylinders. Correctly setting up individual cylinder trims and fine tuning knock control to this level requires both Dyno and Track or “off road” driving data. All Brewed Tunes for Infinity ems Dyno or Etune cover this critical portion of the tune to ensure the best performance possible.

For more pictures and Infinity tuning details about this particular 2jz check out the blog: Infinity 6 2jz supra tune

Of course on the 4g63 only a single channel wide band or flat response knock sensor is needed. (easily replaces the stock resonant sensor that is prone to picking up engine noise and only pics up a set frequency/can not be tuned as well).

ronaldo9

iTrader: (2)

Very cool data. Thanks for sharing this!

EvilEvolution8

Hello,
Have you a link for flat response knock sensor for evo ?
Is p&p ?

Thanks a lot

Klaiceps

iTrader: (18)

Thanks for sharing. By any chance would you be able to explain how the knock sensor is able to differentiate knock between cylinders (how does it know which cylinder it's coming from)? I can't seem to find much info into how the ECU and knock sensor are able to do this.

tunermt

Here is the Wide band knock kit with harness i use on my 4g63 VE Knock sensor kit

In a nut shell: The ECU is able to calculate individual cylinder knock do to the very high sampling rate of the knock sensor/engine position sensor combined with the very high processing speed of the processor, a tricky algorithm and of course tuning. (knock window, frequency, etc.)

Picture of the knock sensor kit (single channel is all that is needed for a 4cyl.

EvilEvolution8

Thanks a lot!
The sensor is p&p with stock? The harness is for infinity 6 ? Can provide a calibration infos with kit ?

TheBoz

iTrader: (9)

How is that sensor better than stock?

tunermt

For full details on the difference between the "wide band knock sensor" and oem "narrow band knock sensor check out the blog article Knock sensor set up and tuning


In a nut shell a wide band or flat response knock sensor like the VE knock sensor kit uses a 2 pin sensor that is very sensitive and able to pick up or "listen to" a wide range of frequencies. **very important to use the correct wiring harness for an aftermarket knock sensor to avoid a "noisy signal"**
The stock resonate sensor "narrow band" sensor is mechanically tuned for a set frequency which greatly limits how the ECU can tune/calculate knock control or knock feedback data.

tunermt

fixed broken pics and links**
Also recently tuned a couple r34 GTR's on Infinity ecu's using individual cylinder trims/knock control, i'll post up some details soon as i have time to sort through the pictures!

Teal2nnr

iTrader: (7)

Did you just tie into the stock wiring for this sensor? And I'm assuming you need a new trigger wheel to get individual knock control, correct?

tunermt

Not 100% which sensor your referring to so i'll do my best to cover all mentioned above
- VE Wide band Knock sensor kit has a complete new coax harness so that is routed directly to the ECU. Only thing that gets T'd in is the sensor ground**
-the RB engines (gtr's) all got PRP RB engine trigger kits which use a new cam and crank (separate as apposed to both off the cam like stock)
-the Supra used all oem triggers
-OEM evo triggers can take advantage of the individual cylinder trims BUT i would expect to pick up a little more resolution with a crank trigger that has more teeth, very minimal though while the engine is rotating fast as the ECU will still be able to calculate cylinder position based on a few variables. (mainly crank sig/engine position vs rate of eng acceleration/time)
***I do have an EVO customer that will be using OEM triggers and AEM Infinity ecu this spring, as soon as that car is together and i start tuning i'll post up some details from the process.

hope that covers which ever sensor you were referring to if not please clarify and i'll do my best to answer.

Teal2nnr

iTrader: (7)

Thank you for the explanation. I was just referring to the knock sensor. I wanted to change mine to a flat response style sensor this year. Unfortunately I'm just on an old AEM S2 box, but it does what I need for now. I wanted to get a new infinity, but i'm really only interested in it if I can get the individual knock control working properly, and I was worried the stock trigger wheel wouldn't allow this.

tunermt

Ah ok understand what you are talking about now.
Yes the VE knock kit comes with a new harness for super easy install. (just ensures a clean signal from the new flat response sensor, some people don't like to deal with wiring and or don't know how to work with the Coax shielded wire or maybe just don't have the tools needed). I personally always recommend the VE knock kits as they have never given me any issue as a tuner regardless of who installed it.
As for the individual cylinder control with Infinity, stock EVO triggers and flat response knock sensor: I will make a note to get back in here and post up some details after the car is ready and i tune it. Feel free to send me an email as well if you like just in case i forget to post again i'm still happy to answer your questions. tuning@brewedmotorsports . com
One way to look at the individual cylinder trims would be to consider the ECU is always responsible for delivering accurate ignition timing to all cylinders at any given RPM. Even with a low tooth count on the crank shaft the ECU is able to determine accurate cylinder position and intern deliver accurate ignition timing per cylinder. Do to the ECU hardware and how the firmware was programmed we are able to set up/tune individual cylinder ignition trims. The ECU simply monitors engine position (similar to what the ECU does for ignition timing) and what the knock sensor or knock sensors are doing then based on the "knock window" you set the ECU determines which cylinder is knocking based on the current engine position and your "knock window" setting. Of course there are many other factors the ECU considers but i think that should help explain how it works based on a low tooth count crank trigger.

tunermt

Recently tuned a couple R34 GT-R's on AEM Infinity 506 ECU with Plug and Play harness using the VE dual channel wide band knock kit. A 3rd Korean GT-R I tuned on HKS Fcon last year is just waiting for the old corona virus to settle down so i can go back over and set up/tune his car on the R34 GT-R AEM Infinity kit.
Graph below is 93ron/mon pump gas RB26 with journal bearing HKS twin turbos and ~26psi. Personally i would always recommend using a good external waste gate NOT the internal waste gate flapper and single port actuator. Even an upgrade to a dual ports actuator for the internal waste gates would allow for much better boost control at high pressure. The stock single port actuators with soft springs are not ideal for this much boost BUT it's what the customer decided to use for now, i'm sure upgrades are coming soon.

whiteEvo08Y

iTrader: (5)

Thank you for posting the link for the sensor. I was told be Haltech I should replace thee OEM knock sensor with this setup and I found the kit easy to install and ready to drop in. So thanks for sharing. Comes with everything instead for trying to put it together.