EvilDSM97

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So this is my first time ever using E85. Using a Tephramod v7 rom. Idle seems really choppy compared to how the car ran on the stock rom using E85 but I'm sure there is something within the Tephra rom that needs changing.
My friend is helping with the tuning. He has tuned quite a few DSMs in the past including one of his last first gen DSM's with a Precision 6262 to 565whp on a Mustang dyno. We are both learning a bunch every day using Ecuflash.
Tonight we actually started doing some third gear logs in my car since the LTFT's are dialed in pretty well.
We haven't even touched timing tables yet. We did a good amount of work to the high octane fuel table and got the a/f's pretty smooth but before we could finish up, one of my heater hoses burst at the end of the pull shooting coolant on my windshield so we were done for the night.

Timing advance is negative in the majority of the pull. I can't wait to start adding timing and seeing the gains. Virtual Dyno estimates 305whp/312 ft-lbs torque in Mustang dyno format with all the correct values put in as of right now. I'm not sure how accurate that is, but it feels about right. Boost spikes around 28-29 psi and slowly falls off throughout the powerband to around 24-25 psi.

One weird thing I notice in all my logs that puzzles us both is that my 1byte load goes up to 288 at 3600rpm and then out of nowhere drops to 1.2 until 4900rpm, and then shoots back up to 304 and then drops off slightly throughout the pull. The slight drop off through the power band seems normal considering it is a stock Evo 8.5 turbo, but why the sudden drop off at 3600? Is there a reason that would happen? It's pretty concerning.

Also feel free to go over my logs and graphs and lend some advice, I appreciate any help. Thanks!

ridenrunwv

You need to raise your 2byte to 1 byte Load Factor. Your load isn't actually dropping but is just surpassing the limit of the default 1.2 load factor used in Tephra.

306 is the max that allows I believe.
255 x that load factor is how high you can log.

You must also change your formula in EvoScan to match the load factor used in Tephra for thw load logged to match the load used in your maps.

EvilDSM97

iTrader: (4)

You are the man.

EvilDSM97

iTrader: (4)

Is there something in the Tephramod rom that causes horrible idle? My car doesn't like to stay running at idle with that rom loaded in the car. Should I adjust the maf scaling?

ridenrunwv

Nothing I can think of unless maybe a compensation table is causing timing to be pulled on cold start and it's not leaving enough timing to idle properly. Compare the idle tables between your stock and Tephra ROM. You also might want to log and and see what your timing at idle is compared to before. At least try flashing back to the stock ROM and confirming the idle is still good before doing too much hinting for a solution though. You could have had O2 sensor go bad or something.

MAF scaling will just change your AFR so don't mess with that for idle if you had your car idling good on the same Injector and MAF scaling on a different ROM find out what's different causing the idle to act up.

EvilDSM97

iTrader: (4)

We did a lot of tuning yesterday. Actually was out street tuning until 2am.
It was unseasonably freezing here last night.....around 38-43 degrees.
I ended up doing a boost leak test on the car earlier in the day and found a couple of large leaks at the intercooler piping so I took care of those.
After that the car still was breaking up. I pulled out the spark plugs (brand new bpr8es plugs gapped at 0.020) and I regapped them to 0.018. That got rid of the breaking up problems.

We were then able to work on the AFR's and got them to 11.8-12.1 throughout the power band. Still for some reason we were getting 3+ counts of knock at the beginning of my logs when rolling into the throttle and it seemed like it would carry into the entire pull when it did knock.
Sometimes it would knock, other times it wouldn't. It was so unpredictable. We tried pulling timing out but nothing seemed to help. Our last pull of the night resulted in knock at the beginning of the pull and then as much as 8 counts of knock at the end of the pull. At that point we were so tired and completely frustrated that we gave up the night. It felt like we were chasing a problem that we were never going to find. It made no sense that the car would knock so randomly the way it was with the air fuel the way it was unless my NGK AFX was giving us incorrect readings.

So I wake up this morning, decide to log another 3rd gear pull.
Not a single count of knock. Timing slowly ramps up to 13 degrees by the end of the pull and virtual dyno shows 398whp/373tq (mustang dyno perimeters) That was a 30whp/20wtq increase over what we were seeing last night. The car felt REALLY good. So I did a couple more pulls after that. Some show knock, others show none.
We're both a bit confused at this point. I don't know if I'm dealing with some kind of phantom knock, or maybe I should change the plugs to bpr8es' and try that as the weather is getting colder here now? It almost seems like the more consecutive pulls you make induces knock.

I included my logs/graphs from this morning. Also included a screenshot at my timing and fuel maps if anyone wants to take a look at those. Lean spool is NOT disabled, not sure that would have anything to do with my problems nor do I know what it does lol.

EvilDSM97

iTrader: (4)

Turned off lean spool, retuned, Got the af's in line with some street tuning....or so I thought!

I wanted to do my timing on a dyno so I rented an hour of dyno time on a local shops Mustang Dyno tonight.
Well to my dismay I found out that my air fuels are almost a full point richer than what the dyno's wideband was reading. So rather than 11.9's- 12.1's, my af's were actually at 12.6-12.8. Due to that my entire hour that was suppose to be used for timing advance was used to get my air fuels in check on a wideband that actually reads correctly. I guess that explains why my logs showed inconsistant AF's with my NGK AFX logging. I copied a formula to use in evoscan someone else used with their AFX but perhaps it was the wrong formula. Some pulls the car still shows 3 degrees of knock, other pulls I don't get a single count. It's odd.

I had no time to really touch the timing map.
I'm running 3* at peak load and 18* by redline.
Unfortunately I'm going to have to rent the dyno again to dial that in.
My last pull of the night netted 345whp/355tq which is a bit lower than I was expecting but it is a Mustang dyno after all.

Abacus

iTrader: (9)

My .02
I'd keep the tuning on the dyno. A few hours is well spent when you can listen for knock, have a controlled environment and see the exact changes you make have an effect on the graph. The last thing you want is more pulls/load then you need to dial it in and break something. I'd also turn the boost down and get a good baseline at 20lbs and xxx timing and work your way back up. Most agree that more boost less timing is the way to go. You can tune out false knock ( in your case its probably real) while you are on the dyno once the tune up is solid/safe. Figure out what you gain by adding timing at low boost levels. If you are only picking up small amounts I would back it down . Timing needs to be smooth . 3,4,5,6,7 etc..Just because you are on E85 doesn't mean you can go full cowboy mode.

If this is an evo engine on stockish cams, I would back the timing down. 3-5* below 5000, 6-8* at 5500 and gradually moving up to 13-15 at 8000 is ok. Sometimes less is more man. Again, being on the dyno you can see what timing changes do. AFR should be 11.5-11.8 IMO Sure it can be run leaner but its not worth a hotter cylinder. Its a street car engine that needs to live awhile. Also if it is a stock evo engine then keeping the torque below 400 dynojet is a good idea.

EvilDSM97

iTrader: (4)

Thanks for the reply!
HKS 280 cams
I'm going to a street night at the local drag strip to see how the car does. Will likely take down timing a notch like you suggested.

desiromeo812

iTrader: (13)

As the person above suggested, drop the timing down in the low and mid areas of the map. As soon as you hit full boost aim for about 2-3* of timing. Slowly add 6/8 by 5k and then you can start increasing one degree every 250RPM. Top it out up top about 15=18 degrees depending on if the car keeps making power.

You might also want to lean it out slightly on spool.

EvilDSM97

iTrader: (4)

Here's a timing map that I have been working on. I added dots to the cells to display my load curve. White dots are spoolup. Green dots start at peak Load.
Keep in mind I haven't flashed this to my car yet. I'm running 18* of peak timing at my current timing map though. I do not rev past 7k. Actually usually never past 6500.
I need to get some more dyno time scheduled because I do not trust virtual dyno, it is too inconsistent.
After pasting this screenshot in MS paint I realized the large in my 5500rpm/ 280 load cell from the previous cell, so I brought that 5500/280 down to 12 degrees.

Also to update on my last post the car ended up going 12.3@116mph with a 1.9 60' (Track was cold as hell that day)

desiromeo812

iTrader: (13)

work on that transition from 10 - 14* degrees. Thats a huge jump!!

Luckystryke

iTrader: (3)

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