evo8 5 speed gearbox - noises - what commonly fails ?
Sep 13, 2006, 08:03 AM
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evo8 5 speed gearbox - noises - what commonly fails ?
hi
I have a 2005 Evo 8 5 speed and I have major gearbox issues ! this may take a while as I am going to provide as much history as possible in the hopes that someone can figure out whats wrong with it
The OEM clutch gave up at 22k km and was replaced by a HKS twin plate GD Max I think, after about 5k km the gearbox picked up a slight noise (no not the sound of the twin plate clutch) this noise was literally a tick tick tick tick at idle with the box in neutral and foor off the clutch - pushing the clutch in made the noise go away - I think as the twin plate rattly noise would take over - this noise got worse and worse and worse and become a TICK TICK TICK TICK with a sound like straight cut gear whine also starting and being audible when driving in the car - not dependent on gear - the noise would be in all gears - tick at idle and whine noise on the move - so gearbox come out at 27k km - sent to gearbox specialist and was pronounced as a ok.....gearbox in and the noise is still there......so I drove it around some more as I thought well lets see what is actually broken at 32k km I decided it must be out again as the whine is much much worse and the TICK TICK is becoming a rattle - had the car on a lift with all 4 wheels off and listened to the box with a screwdriver and the noise is definetly coming from the gearbox the transfer case is silent - well apart from in action noises so the box is out and this time I am looking at it.
The areas I have found that seem to cause a concern are:
1) The big bearing on the non spline end of the inout shaft has some play not a lot but some - is this ok and normal or is any play bad - the bearing at the spline end has no play
2) the other shaft in the box - layshaft I think its called the bearing shells that support this and the outer half remains in the case are loose and can easily be turned by hand and removed - on other gearboxes I have delved into these were always tight tight tight and pressed in - however there is no scoring on the "fitted" side so I think once torqued up and installed with shafts there is no more play
3) the reverse idler gear thingy that bolts to the outer case is rough to turn by hand and there are slight rubbing marks evident on the "back" of the gear mount area - an area about 1 cm in length and very light scuffing - I have stupidly launched in reverse before and am wondering if this is not the cause ? but if I put the box together and turn by hand the roughness is not felt anymore ovbviously due to all the other bits and pieces turning now
4) all the internals in the gearbox shafts - like the synchros / dogs / gears are 100% the only gear to show wear is the second gear - slight slight wear on the teeth faces
5) all needle rollers are in perfect shape as well
6) The **** on the magnet was minimal
Where does this noise come from ? and what can I do to fix it ?
Help !!!!
I have a 2005 Evo 8 5 speed and I have major gearbox issues ! this may take a while as I am going to provide as much history as possible in the hopes that someone can figure out whats wrong with it
The OEM clutch gave up at 22k km and was replaced by a HKS twin plate GD Max I think, after about 5k km the gearbox picked up a slight noise (no not the sound of the twin plate clutch) this noise was literally a tick tick tick tick at idle with the box in neutral and foor off the clutch - pushing the clutch in made the noise go away - I think as the twin plate rattly noise would take over - this noise got worse and worse and worse and become a TICK TICK TICK TICK with a sound like straight cut gear whine also starting and being audible when driving in the car - not dependent on gear - the noise would be in all gears - tick at idle and whine noise on the move - so gearbox come out at 27k km - sent to gearbox specialist and was pronounced as a ok.....gearbox in and the noise is still there......so I drove it around some more as I thought well lets see what is actually broken at 32k km I decided it must be out again as the whine is much much worse and the TICK TICK is becoming a rattle - had the car on a lift with all 4 wheels off and listened to the box with a screwdriver and the noise is definetly coming from the gearbox the transfer case is silent - well apart from in action noises so the box is out and this time I am looking at it.
The areas I have found that seem to cause a concern are:
1) The big bearing on the non spline end of the inout shaft has some play not a lot but some - is this ok and normal or is any play bad - the bearing at the spline end has no play
2) the other shaft in the box - layshaft I think its called the bearing shells that support this and the outer half remains in the case are loose and can easily be turned by hand and removed - on other gearboxes I have delved into these were always tight tight tight and pressed in - however there is no scoring on the "fitted" side so I think once torqued up and installed with shafts there is no more play
3) the reverse idler gear thingy that bolts to the outer case is rough to turn by hand and there are slight rubbing marks evident on the "back" of the gear mount area - an area about 1 cm in length and very light scuffing - I have stupidly launched in reverse before and am wondering if this is not the cause ? but if I put the box together and turn by hand the roughness is not felt anymore ovbviously due to all the other bits and pieces turning now
4) all the internals in the gearbox shafts - like the synchros / dogs / gears are 100% the only gear to show wear is the second gear - slight slight wear on the teeth faces
5) all needle rollers are in perfect shape as well
6) The **** on the magnet was minimal
Where does this noise come from ? and what can I do to fix it ?
Help !!!!
Sep 13, 2006, 09:19 AM
#2
Originally Posted by evo3barboost
hi
I have a 2005 Evo 8 5 speed and I have major gearbox issues ! this may take a while as I am going to provide as much history as possible in the hopes that someone can figure out whats wrong with it
The OEM clutch gave up at 22k km and was replaced by a HKS twin plate GD Max I think, after about 5k km the gearbox picked up a slight noise (no not the sound of the twin plate clutch) this noise was literally a tick tick tick tick at idle with the box in neutral and foor off the clutch - pushing the clutch in made the noise go away - I think as the twin plate rattly noise would take over - this noise got worse and worse and worse and become a TICK TICK TICK TICK with a sound like straight cut gear whine also starting and being audible when driving in the car - not dependent on gear - the noise would be in all gears - tick at idle and whine noise on the move - so gearbox come out at 27k km - sent to gearbox specialist and was pronounced as a ok.....gearbox in and the noise is still there......so I drove it around some more as I thought well lets see what is actually broken at 32k km I decided it must be out again as the whine is much much worse and the TICK TICK is becoming a rattle - had the car on a lift with all 4 wheels off and listened to the box with a screwdriver and the noise is definetly coming from the gearbox the transfer case is silent - well apart from in action noises so the box is out and this time I am looking at it.
The areas I have found that seem to cause a concern are:
1) The big bearing on the non spline end of the inout shaft has some play not a lot but some - is this ok and normal or is any play bad - the bearing at the spline end has no play
2) the other shaft in the box - layshaft I think its called the bearing shells that support this and the outer half remains in the case are loose and can easily be turned by hand and removed - on other gearboxes I have delved into these were always tight tight tight and pressed in - however there is no scoring on the "fitted" side so I think once torqued up and installed with shafts there is no more play
3) the reverse idler gear thingy that bolts to the outer case is rough to turn by hand and there are slight rubbing marks evident on the "back" of the gear mount area - an area about 1 cm in length and very light scuffing - I have stupidly launched in reverse before and am wondering if this is not the cause ? but if I put the box together and turn by hand the roughness is not felt anymore ovbviously due to all the other bits and pieces turning now
4) all the internals in the gearbox shafts - like the synchros / dogs / gears are 100% the only gear to show wear is the second gear - slight slight wear on the teeth faces
5) all needle rollers are in perfect shape as well
6) The **** on the magnet was minimal
Where does this noise come from ? and what can I do to fix it ?
Help !!!!
I have a 2005 Evo 8 5 speed and I have major gearbox issues ! this may take a while as I am going to provide as much history as possible in the hopes that someone can figure out whats wrong with it
The OEM clutch gave up at 22k km and was replaced by a HKS twin plate GD Max I think, after about 5k km the gearbox picked up a slight noise (no not the sound of the twin plate clutch) this noise was literally a tick tick tick tick at idle with the box in neutral and foor off the clutch - pushing the clutch in made the noise go away - I think as the twin plate rattly noise would take over - this noise got worse and worse and worse and become a TICK TICK TICK TICK with a sound like straight cut gear whine also starting and being audible when driving in the car - not dependent on gear - the noise would be in all gears - tick at idle and whine noise on the move - so gearbox come out at 27k km - sent to gearbox specialist and was pronounced as a ok.....gearbox in and the noise is still there......so I drove it around some more as I thought well lets see what is actually broken at 32k km I decided it must be out again as the whine is much much worse and the TICK TICK is becoming a rattle - had the car on a lift with all 4 wheels off and listened to the box with a screwdriver and the noise is definetly coming from the gearbox the transfer case is silent - well apart from in action noises so the box is out and this time I am looking at it.
The areas I have found that seem to cause a concern are:
1) The big bearing on the non spline end of the inout shaft has some play not a lot but some - is this ok and normal or is any play bad - the bearing at the spline end has no play
2) the other shaft in the box - layshaft I think its called the bearing shells that support this and the outer half remains in the case are loose and can easily be turned by hand and removed - on other gearboxes I have delved into these were always tight tight tight and pressed in - however there is no scoring on the "fitted" side so I think once torqued up and installed with shafts there is no more play
3) the reverse idler gear thingy that bolts to the outer case is rough to turn by hand and there are slight rubbing marks evident on the "back" of the gear mount area - an area about 1 cm in length and very light scuffing - I have stupidly launched in reverse before and am wondering if this is not the cause ? but if I put the box together and turn by hand the roughness is not felt anymore ovbviously due to all the other bits and pieces turning now
4) all the internals in the gearbox shafts - like the synchros / dogs / gears are 100% the only gear to show wear is the second gear - slight slight wear on the teeth faces
5) all needle rollers are in perfect shape as well
6) The **** on the magnet was minimal
Where does this noise come from ? and what can I do to fix it ?
Help !!!!
Take the reverse idler out, button the transmission up and see if it still makes that tick tick tick.
Sep 14, 2006, 01:19 AM
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thanks for the advice guys will try it out
in the meantime are there any traders with boxes / used / new etc or upgraded internals - the only ones I can find are the shep racing ones and thats pricey
in the meantime are there any traders with boxes / used / new etc or upgraded internals - the only ones I can find are the shep racing ones and thats pricey
Sep 14, 2006, 03:09 AM
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Hey,
Must of been a real neck jerker launching in reverse!!!!
Hope you get it all sorted out, let us know what it was in the end...
One thing though you said in your post that the one bearing inner race spins on the shaft, but there are no signs of it spinning?
I wonder if there is not a side load on that bearing that is causing it to pick up on the shaft and stop it from spinning? Would need to see the bearing and shaft to know. is your car still at the garage?
Must of been a real neck jerker launching in reverse!!!!
Hope you get it all sorted out, let us know what it was in the end...
One thing though you said in your post that the one bearing inner race spins on the shaft, but there are no signs of it spinning?
I wonder if there is not a side load on that bearing that is causing it to pick up on the shaft and stop it from spinning? Would need to see the bearing and shaft to know. is your car still at the garage?
Last edited by Boosted GP; Sep 14, 2006 at 03:17 AM.
Sep 14, 2006, 05:44 AM
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Hey, fancy meeting you guys here...
Sorry to hear about the problem 3bar, was hoping to see you at ultimate street car this weekend, but good luck. and let us know what the problem was.
Cheers
Sal
.
Sorry to hear about the problem 3bar, was hoping to see you at ultimate street car this weekend, but good luck. and let us know what the problem was.
Cheers
Sal
.
Sep 14, 2006, 06:09 AM
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boosted gp its not the inner bearing race its the bit of the bearing that remains behind in the case - the outer bearing shell - the angled bit - outer race I think its actually called
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Sep 14, 2006, 11:28 PM
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Ah, so its the thrust bearing! makes sense now... that is normal, seen it many a time in lots of different applications/ machines. it will come up tight once the box is together.
Mike
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