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Old Oct 15, 2012, 09:03 PM   #1
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TransferCase Failure

I am looking for some input on some potential causes of what could have happened. Some history on the car its a 06 evo 9 GSR stayed stock until 64k miles(only owner, mainly driven by my wife). I put a fp black on it and made 500 whp, recently upgraded to a built motor and made a bit more. The car has maybe been launched a total of 30 times in its life, slipping the clutch w/ horrible 60's.

after getting the car back recently after fixing a cylinder head issue, a total of 1300 miles on the new motor and 300 on the built head, i hit the gas about 60mph in 4th, car spun a bit and i changed to 5th and proceeded to cruise, roughly 2 miles later, i feel a hesitation and then all of a sudden a loud crunch and screeching noise. i pull off the freeway and decide to attempt to drive off the freeway since it was busy. once i stop the car will not reverse.. the rear wheels are locked up. So from there i have it towed home, no leaking oil no pieces no nothing..

i jack up the car the next day.. the rear wheels rotate?.. wierd.. then i notice a small quarter size leak up front. i didnt have a socket big enough to remove the drain plug so i removed the inspection plate.. expecting alot of fluid to drop.. i barely get anything...except
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and
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Evo IX GSR - fp black (ported), kelford 272s, ferrea springs&retainers, map compgate ewg, fp intake w/ perrin filter, synapse bov, spoolinup cop, megan exh mani, megan downpipe, unknown testpipe, , fic 1250s, jms double pumper, E85 535whp & 430tq TSComptuned

06 ZX10RR (traded and already crashed 10/2011)

93 Civic Coupe w/ ITR motor = slow

Last edited by jmcmill3; Oct 15, 2012 at 09:06 PM.
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Old Oct 15, 2012, 09:13 PM   #2
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im confused, since i thought quite a bit more fluid should have came out and that it was so dark. checking with others, im told it means the car was ran w/ little or no fluid.

i tow it back to the shop that did the work and we look inside the inspection plate and cant see anything wrong..? but they are unable to manually spin the drive shaft or the diff etc.

at this point the mechanic swears he filled the transfercase with new diaqueen fluid and that couldnt have been the issue. another states they would repair it, because there is no other explanation.

now today, they disassemble it and send me these pics
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now there story has changed, since the only thing they can find wrong is that behind the pinion gear it looks like the bearing came apart. now they are denying the possibility of low or no oil since "some" oil has come out after removing the diff and none of its bearing were bad.

personally im not 100% sold on this idea, because now they want to split the cost of replacement. i dont understand how a bearing could go bad all of a sudden without lack of oil (to this extent at least) or why my 1300 mile diaqueen would be black as charcoal?

any input would be appreciated
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Evo IX GSR - fp black (ported), kelford 272s, ferrea springs&retainers, map compgate ewg, fp intake w/ perrin filter, synapse bov, spoolinup cop, megan exh mani, megan downpipe, unknown testpipe, , fic 1250s, jms double pumper, E85 535whp & 430tq TSComptuned

06 ZX10RR (traded and already crashed 10/2011)

93 Civic Coupe w/ ITR motor = slow
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Old Oct 15, 2012, 09:43 PM   #3
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if you say no oil drained out other than the small amount of sludge, I don't see what else it would be. Either not filled, or left in a fast leaking state.
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Old Oct 16, 2012, 01:10 AM   #4
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did they fill it right? if you read you will find that when you fill it, it acts like its full but its not. theres a certain way to fill it. ask the shop how they filled it and how much oil it took and you will know right away.
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Old Oct 16, 2012, 03:18 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by sujinX View Post
did they fill it right? if you read you will find that when you fill it, it acts like its full but its not. theres a certain way to fill it. ask the shop how they filled it and how much oil it took and you will know right away.
The shop advised me from the beginning that they filled it from the fill hole until fluid came out.

i checked around and found this on jacks transmissions website:
http://www.jackstransmissions.com/pages/t-case-filling

"It is very important to know your Transfer Case is full! EVOs are especially sensitive to this and if it is not completely full you will burn up the expensive ring and pinion gears in the unit! If you fill the unit via the factory fill hole in the T-Case, it can fool you into thinking it’s full when it is in fact not. The small oil sump in the T-Case will make the fluid back up in the unit while you are filling it and come out of the fill hole to make it look like the unit is full! Do not believe this as it can cost you a T-Case!!"

the shop offered for us to split the parts.. after more research i declined, so I am sending the oil off to prove the obvious that the fluid burned up. which is "almost" impossible since i have only put 1300 miles on the car since they filled it.

once again talking to most of the reputable shops that primarily work on Evo's they have advised me they have not seen bearings "fail" without oil starvation.

so now after "working" with them when a bolt found its way into my engine after they installed it, having to pay for part of the repairs out of my own pocket, im left to defend myself yet again.
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Evo IX GSR - fp black (ported), kelford 272s, ferrea springs&retainers, map compgate ewg, fp intake w/ perrin filter, synapse bov, spoolinup cop, megan exh mani, megan downpipe, unknown testpipe, , fic 1250s, jms double pumper, E85 535whp & 430tq TSComptuned

06 ZX10RR (traded and already crashed 10/2011)

93 Civic Coupe w/ ITR motor = slow

Last edited by jmcmill3; Oct 17, 2012 at 05:16 PM.
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Old Oct 16, 2012, 04:07 PM   #6
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wow. sounds like attention to detail is their strong suit. Good luck with the situation
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Old Oct 16, 2012, 10:03 PM   #7
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Jason!

That sucks man! You've had nothing but bad luck these past few months! The sludge would be a result from fluid getting cooked by heat , and to me the fact that you mentioned that your wheels were initially locked up but once it was at your house they spun freely confirms that something in the drive train (most likely obviously the transfer case) was so hot that the clearances were so tight not allowing parts to move freely as they were supposed to. Unless something moved out of place or into place... I don't know just throwing theories out there... From the pictures the gears don't look damaged or like they were run dry so that's good, hopefully everything is salvageable. So what exactly was damaged? Just the Pinion gear bearing?

Hopefully everything will get taken care and you can be back on the road. I'm considering getting an Evo my self.

Best of luck!
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Old Oct 17, 2012, 08:47 AM   #8
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Looks like it was never filled. If it was leaking that bad you would see it were you had parked over night. I have drove and Evo with no oil in the case "shop forgot to fill" and we could not tell for over 1000 miles.

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Old Oct 17, 2012, 09:22 AM   #9
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this seems to be a very common problem with Evo's... people think the TC is full and put the bolt back in, but you should go back every 2-3mins and you can get some more pumps of fluid in there. I always fill mine over about 30mins and at the end you let it sit for about 5mins then go back and that's when you know it's full.
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Old Oct 17, 2012, 10:45 AM   #10
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A professional should be able to see oil starvation due to bearing surfaces, how the gears look, etc. It's normally obvious.

A similar thing happened to me though. I bought a built car from a shop, he put no transmission fluid in it, 3rd gear exploded. Only a tiny bit of sludge came out, but weirdly enough, the rest of the gears and bearings looked alright. Luckily he covered it anyway. Best of luck to you.
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Old Oct 17, 2012, 11:27 AM   #11
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I experienced exact same problems in 2010. Wheels locked doing 80mph and same exact metal crunching noise. Missed my drivetrain warranty by 2 weeks when it happen. FML. Diagnosis : starvation. Turns out the local shop that did my transfercase service failed to add adequate fluid in her(they never drove around and top it off ) I hope all works out, I bite the bullet and bought a used stage 2 tc. If I was in your shoes would not reuse the case as I feel the transfercase is a critical/sensitive unit in the drivetrain.
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Old Oct 17, 2012, 01:41 PM   #12
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I say what they are offering is a fair deal. Take it. Here's why.

You discovered the problem because you found that the transfer case was leaking. I'd say it is there responsibility to fix the leak but your responsibility to check for leaks. Transfer cases once touched have a tendency to leak; there's just too many avenues the oil can take to get out if not perfectly installed. And, the case holds way less fluid than it should. It is a problem waiting to happen.

So, it is some part their fault and some part yours.

As for the clear oil in their photographs and the sludge you found - that's funny - but it doesn't change the facts.
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Old Oct 17, 2012, 04:58 PM   #13
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I say what they are offering is a fair deal. Take it. Here's why.

You discovered the problem because you found that the transfer case was leaking. I'd say it is there responsibility to fix the leak but your responsibility to check for leaks. Transfer cases once touched have a tendency to leak; there's just too many avenues the oil can take to get out if not perfectly installed. And, the case holds way less fluid than it should. It is a problem waiting to happen.

So, it is some part their fault and some part yours.

As for the clear oil in their photographs and the sludge you found - that's funny - but it doesn't change the facts.
There were no signs of it leaking, they admit that. As for me checking a transfercase after 1300 miles to see the oil is filled after paying someone to do it.. doesn't make sense to me. The engine is diff its a fresh build. Thanks for your input but I don't really agree
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06 ZX10RR (traded and already crashed 10/2011)

93 Civic Coupe w/ ITR motor = slow
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Old Oct 17, 2012, 05:17 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruzewski View Post
Looks like it was never filled. If it was leaking that bad you would see it were you had parked over night. I have drove and Evo with no oil in the case "shop forgot to fill" and we could not tell for over 1000 miles.
you are the second person i have heard confirming this.


to Quilem.. who's this?
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Evo IX GSR - fp black (ported), kelford 272s, ferrea springs&retainers, map compgate ewg, fp intake w/ perrin filter, synapse bov, spoolinup cop, megan exh mani, megan downpipe, unknown testpipe, , fic 1250s, jms double pumper, E85 535whp & 430tq TSComptuned

06 ZX10RR (traded and already crashed 10/2011)

93 Civic Coupe w/ ITR motor = slow
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Old Oct 17, 2012, 05:46 PM   #15
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I'd say this is 90% the shops fault, you should check the fluid just to be sure but in the end the shop clearly made a mistake.
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Old Oct 17, 2012, 05:46 PM
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