Bad Bish gets some suspension/chassis work from Robispec
Jul 19, 2011, 09:33 AM
#1
Bad Bish gets some suspension/chassis work from Robispec
Yada yada yada, as you guys know I am doing my best to build a bad *** multi-purpose EVO. Trying to run 8's and autocross the car in the same configuration is tough. It's hard to do both things to their fullest and not ruin the other, actually, it's impossible but I keep trying.
After the BR Sport Compact Race in May it was obvious the Bad Bish had some issues. Traction being a huge issue and it doesn't corner as well as it could. The biggest issue with the cornering is the alignment, it is set up to go in a straight line, not turn.
I contacted Robert Fuller/Robispec and since he was coming in to help set up the Eclipse for the road racing I do in it I asked if he could suggest some things for the Bad Bish and do then while he was here.
I couldn't get the rear alignment right where I wanted it which was 0 toe/0 camber. Robert suggested I did his bushings throughout the chassis. I told him whatever he thought was fine, just bring the parts.
Well I was surprised to see him show up with a complete hard bearing kit. The last I saw all of the bushings used were polyurethane. The site of 14 different locations being changed over to hard bearings worried me. I told him I didn't want the noise associated with that and it wasn't acceptable. He assured me I was on crack and to not worry about it.
I had aligned and corner weighted the car myself, it takes me nearly an entire day to do it and that is why I don't offer the service to customers. It's a huge PITA when you don't do it very often. I wanted Robert to go over it all and just do the entire job.
We got the car on the lift and about 3 hours later it was done. An hour of him laying under the car and the alignment was done and the corner weights were dead on from where I had them already.
Robert wanted me to drive the car and make sure it all felt good so we hopped in it. I was sure, in the back of my mind the suspension was going to be unbearable and noisy. As I drove away from the shop I was paying close attention to the noises.............there were none. Now my car is obviously not whisper quiet, but I am running two mufflers and I can say without a doubt, these 14 hard bearings in the suspension are no louder than it was, I could tell no difference, that was a relief. Robert wanted me to launch the car, told me there should be a big difference in how the car leaves when I launch it after these changes. I explained launching was impossible as the car just tags the rev limiter on the RE01's. I chose instead to just slow down to a 5 mph roll in 1st and hit it, showing him the instant rev limiter pounding it was going to do in 1st, 2nd and part of the way into 3rd. We slowed down and I hit it......hmmm very odd, it spun but didn't just tag the rev limiter. I made a hard fast shift to 2nd and there was only a slight controllable amount of wheel spin and when I hit 3rd the car hooked dead and was gone. WOW! THAT is impossible! I pulled onto the next road which was smoother asphalt and did it again.........same result. Incredible. This isn't what I was looking for, I was looking for increased cornering (which I am sure is there but nowhere to push the car yet) I didn't expect a big change in traction.
Robert explained to me that with the soft bushings in the stock suspension/chassis the tires move back and forth and keep the car from hooking up. This is a more than reasonable explanation if any of you have seen the slow motion videos done from the shootout and the EVO/DSM's launching. Whatever the reason, the car hooks up at least twice as good as it did before the bushings. I'm anxious to get it out and autocross it now and see how much improve it is there too.
For anyone interested here is what was done to the car with pricing:
Robispec Hard bearing kit parts:
1. Toe links
2. Trailing arms
3. Lower front arms with anti lift and roll center correction.
The DIY pricing on the complete kit, which replaces 14 stock bushings with spherical bearings is $1400.
The Installed "Exchange" price is $1800. This means Robert shows up with replacement parts with his bushing kit already in and then installs them and keeps your parts.
Personally, I am overly impressed as I had no idea it was going to increase the traction at all, let alone this drastically.
After the BR Sport Compact Race in May it was obvious the Bad Bish had some issues. Traction being a huge issue and it doesn't corner as well as it could. The biggest issue with the cornering is the alignment, it is set up to go in a straight line, not turn.
I contacted Robert Fuller/Robispec and since he was coming in to help set up the Eclipse for the road racing I do in it I asked if he could suggest some things for the Bad Bish and do then while he was here.
I couldn't get the rear alignment right where I wanted it which was 0 toe/0 camber. Robert suggested I did his bushings throughout the chassis. I told him whatever he thought was fine, just bring the parts.
Well I was surprised to see him show up with a complete hard bearing kit. The last I saw all of the bushings used were polyurethane. The site of 14 different locations being changed over to hard bearings worried me. I told him I didn't want the noise associated with that and it wasn't acceptable. He assured me I was on crack and to not worry about it.
I had aligned and corner weighted the car myself, it takes me nearly an entire day to do it and that is why I don't offer the service to customers. It's a huge PITA when you don't do it very often. I wanted Robert to go over it all and just do the entire job.
We got the car on the lift and about 3 hours later it was done. An hour of him laying under the car and the alignment was done and the corner weights were dead on from where I had them already.
Robert wanted me to drive the car and make sure it all felt good so we hopped in it. I was sure, in the back of my mind the suspension was going to be unbearable and noisy. As I drove away from the shop I was paying close attention to the noises.............there were none. Now my car is obviously not whisper quiet, but I am running two mufflers and I can say without a doubt, these 14 hard bearings in the suspension are no louder than it was, I could tell no difference, that was a relief. Robert wanted me to launch the car, told me there should be a big difference in how the car leaves when I launch it after these changes. I explained launching was impossible as the car just tags the rev limiter on the RE01's. I chose instead to just slow down to a 5 mph roll in 1st and hit it, showing him the instant rev limiter pounding it was going to do in 1st, 2nd and part of the way into 3rd. We slowed down and I hit it......hmmm very odd, it spun but didn't just tag the rev limiter. I made a hard fast shift to 2nd and there was only a slight controllable amount of wheel spin and when I hit 3rd the car hooked dead and was gone. WOW! THAT is impossible! I pulled onto the next road which was smoother asphalt and did it again.........same result. Incredible. This isn't what I was looking for, I was looking for increased cornering (which I am sure is there but nowhere to push the car yet) I didn't expect a big change in traction.
Robert explained to me that with the soft bushings in the stock suspension/chassis the tires move back and forth and keep the car from hooking up. This is a more than reasonable explanation if any of you have seen the slow motion videos done from the shootout and the EVO/DSM's launching. Whatever the reason, the car hooks up at least twice as good as it did before the bushings. I'm anxious to get it out and autocross it now and see how much improve it is there too.
For anyone interested here is what was done to the car with pricing:
Robispec Hard bearing kit parts:
1. Toe links
2. Trailing arms
3. Lower front arms with anti lift and roll center correction.
The DIY pricing on the complete kit, which replaces 14 stock bushings with spherical bearings is $1400.
The Installed "Exchange" price is $1800. This means Robert shows up with replacement parts with his bushing kit already in and then installs them and keeps your parts.
Personally, I am overly impressed as I had no idea it was going to increase the traction at all, let alone this drastically.
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Thanks for sharing.
Jul 19, 2011, 10:48 AM
#10
My updates and posting have been few and far between, the last 4 weeks have been nuts, a week of preparing for 2 weeks vacation, then 2 weeks vacation and last week we spent catching up and setting up the Eclipse for Mid Ohio. Today is my first normal day in a month!
Yes, you aren't kidding about the little things that make a difference. This is honestly a HUGE shocker to me. Like I said, I had NO expectations of it helping with traction. I requested parts that would help me autocross and get the alignment where I wanted it. I couldn't get the rear toe/camber dead on at 0/0. The car is now at 0 toe and just -.5 degrees negative in the rear.
The BadBish has never had S1's on it, it's been running N1's for years.
I am still waiting on some custom wheel spacers to be built.........if all goes well I will have them before the shootout and after I get done running in Max Effort we are going to swap tires and I'm going to hand the keys to Kevin, in hopes of that 8 second pass. Be at the shootout!!
Yes, you aren't kidding about the little things that make a difference. This is honestly a HUGE shocker to me. Like I said, I had NO expectations of it helping with traction. I requested parts that would help me autocross and get the alignment where I wanted it. I couldn't get the rear toe/camber dead on at 0/0. The car is now at 0 toe and just -.5 degrees negative in the rear.
The BadBish has never had S1's on it, it's been running N1's for years.
I am still waiting on some custom wheel spacers to be built.........if all goes well I will have them before the shootout and after I get done running in Max Effort we are going to swap tires and I'm going to hand the keys to Kevin, in hopes of that 8 second pass. Be at the shootout!!
