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A little tuning help please?

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Old Jul 23, 2015, 05:35 AM   #1
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A little tuning help please?

OK, so I am just getting started with tuning. I am hoping to get a little help getting started. I've done plenty of reading and watched the videos. The thing is, the stock timing maps on my Lancer (02 OZ Rally M/T) are a big mess. It's so far off from how I've seen it is supposed to look I'm not sure how to start. I will attach a couple of logs and a screenshot showing the fuel and timing maps. As you can see the timing map has big dips in timing at 50% load and up, this seems counter to everything I've seen.
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A little tuning help please?-stock-maps.jpg  
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File Type: csv EvoScanDataLog_2015.07.22_13.13.02.csv (581.0 KB, 0 views)
File Type: csv EvoScanDataLog_2015.07.22_13.59.31.csv (819.5 KB, 0 views)
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Old Jul 23, 2015, 09:50 AM   #2
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Those maps look normal to me. When logging try putting the RPM and "load calculated" beside each other. That way you can find the cell on the map easier.

Turn off the "load 1byte" and use "load calculated" instead. Currently I can't tell which cell you have knock in but you do have a little knock. Until you do this I would not recommend touching the maps.

Also put the "knock voltage" near "knock sum". Voltage over 1.0 is typically knock.

Also be sure to save a STOCK COPY OF YOUR ROM. Just in case things go crazy you can just restart.

The maps in recompiles videos are big maps. Since the lancer is NA it doesn't need anything over the 100 load. Your fuel maps only come into play during WOT pulls. The rest of the time the ecu is trying to keep the AFR stoich. For now I would just get the knock out in your maps. Thats a good start with tuning. Don't be afraid to edit the maps. GO SLOW WITH THE EDITING. Make changes, go back out and log, and see if it helped. Typically for knock anything over 3 degrees only needs about 1 degree of timing pulled. 1-2 counts of knock are ok unless its constant.

If you have anymore questions please ask.

Also, try to get a wideband. You'll eventually need it if you boost.
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Old Jul 23, 2015, 11:25 AM   #3
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Thanks for the tips! So it's OK that the timing does not scale up smoothly? Also, I wan't actually logging 1byte load. However, I can't log any load right now because I get an error stating Injector Scaling must be before Load in the list, but Injector Scaling is not on the list.

EDIT: I think ECULoad will work.

Last edited by dragunbayne; Jul 23, 2015 at 11:34 AM.
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Old Jul 23, 2015, 01:23 PM   #4
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Yes, the timing is fine like that. The ecu can "interpolate" between the small gaps of timing and fuel. Log the "load calculated" the regular lancer rom can't handle 1 to 2 byte load conversion. Basically you just need to move the Injector thing above whatever it tells you to in evoscan and the error will go away. Evoscaan can be finicky so move one item at a time, Save the settings then close evoscan. repeat with other items you move. You'll find they move on their own sometimes.
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Old Jul 23, 2015, 03:33 PM   #5
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I can't find Injector Scaling in the list. So I am using the ECULoad value and that seems to be working. Also, you mentioned about knock voltage. What does it mean if I have 2 or 3 counts of knock and the voltage is around .5?
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Old Jul 23, 2015, 10:07 PM   #6
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Can you post a screen shot of the error evoscan is giving you? I believe you can use "load calculated" for your load. Well if the knock is constantly in the same load and rpm range it most likely could be knock even if the knock voltage is under 1.0. What you're looking for is consistent knock.
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Old Jul 24, 2015, 05:02 AM   #7
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I was able to use load calculated until I changed the order of the values. Now even if I put it at the very bottom of the entire list it still gives the error. I have been able to tune out a good bit of knock so far. I think it might be as bad as it is because I have a 4g93 cam. So I am looking forward to finding out where I can raise timing to fit the cam better.
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Old Jul 24, 2015, 10:14 AM   #8
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I get huge amounts of knock in high load, low rpm acceleration. For example, I cruise around town at maybe 33 in 5th and hit a 35 zone and accelerate in 5th to say 37 or 38. I get 12+ counts of knock. Should I really be lowering timing in that zone or should I just stop doing that and be in 4th at those speeds?
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Old Jul 24, 2015, 12:45 PM   #9
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I would lower timing in that AREA. Sometimes the area around it just needs smoothing. Just keep logging and messing with it. Take baby steps. If you're retarding the area too much it might knock too. So keep that in mind. If it gets better than keep going in that direction. Too much gas can cause knock as well. As for evoscan try moving all your injector stuff above load calculated. Don't forget to press "save settings" and immediately close the program.
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Old Jul 24, 2015, 03:06 PM   #10
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I moved all 3 injector values above load calculated and it still won't work. I even tried moving it below all values and it still comes up with that. So far tuning is going well, especially with your help!

EDIT:
Let me grab some logs. The error comes up, but I think it's still logging it now.

Last edited by dragunbayne; Jul 24, 2015 at 05:33 PM.
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Old Jul 24, 2015, 07:55 PM   #11
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It's working! The error comes up but it does log now. I will continue to tune out the knock and I am working to tune my MAF scaling too. I knew I just needed to start working at it and it wouldn't be too hard. Once I sort out the MAF and get rid of the knock, how do I go about seeing where I can up my timing? I am thinking just add 1 degree across the ignition map, log, and adjust accordingly.
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Old Jul 24, 2015, 09:55 PM   #12
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Whoa, if you're using the stock lancer maf don't mess with the scaling. You could mess with the compensation though. When adding compensation you'll need to go thru various maf hertz values and get your actual afr to match up with "afr map". YOU WILL NEED A WIDEBAND for that. The lancer pulls best before 5k rpm so I would work on advancing those areas. I highly suggest you get a wideband installed. For now I would only work on getting the knock out of your tune.
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Old Jul 25, 2015, 03:16 PM   #13
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I'm hoping to get my wideband in a week or two. I will continue to work on the knock and I will get back to you once I have my wideband! Again, thanks for your time and knowledge.
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Old Jul 25, 2015, 10:42 PM   #14
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No problem
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Old Aug 4, 2015, 09:19 AM   #15
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OK, back for a little more advice. I got my hands on a 501 MAF. I may have to wait until I get my wideband to solve this. I am having a little issue getting my idle perfected, I think the idle is is probably higher than it maybe should be. Also with the Eclipse values entered and the 501 I am hitting over 100 load. I will post up a couple logs in a little bit, but wanted to get this out there.
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