solidsnake279

Since the Ralliart is just an upgraded lancer and not a de-tuned EVO.. would it be possible to swap the engine from a ralliart into a manual transmission GTS?

kalpakiotis

iTrader: (1)

I would say that it is probable. While your at it, u could just drop in the evox engine in. Its the same dimensioned engine, just better built. Not sure how well the tranny would hold up to the power increase though...clutch would def need to be replaced.

constantlehigh

iTrader: (1)

The engine is the same 4B11 for the entire Lancer lineup, so theoretically yes an engine "swap" could take place between a lancer and a ralliart, lancer and evo, ect. However, there's a lot more that comes into play than just swapping motors. There's a big difference when engineering components for a naturally aspirated engine and a turbo'd engine. Adding a turbo to a stock lancer will require some serious modifications to the entire powertrain. The added heat from the turbo will require things like a new catalytic converter, intercooler, etc. Also keep in mind that you'll be adding a lot of power to the front wheels without the luxury of all wheel drive, so that means that the car will probably handle worse than it did before unless you upgrade your brakes and suspension.

By the time you do all the upgrades to have a safe and stable turbo'd lancer, you will have spent thousands. Considering that the base ralliart is only a couple thousand more than a GTS, i'd highly recommend just trading in your car for the ralli, with a warranty.

turbotime

iTrader: (16)

except for him since his is a 4b12 engine... best bang for your buck man, run the stock caliber srt4 pistons and rods. do a custom turbo kit with a ecu flash. You'll have spent a few grand but have a car which is now faster then the evo.

around here the ralliart is more then an extra $100 more a month for finance for me - $1200 a year.. even over say 4 years that would pay for the mods to the gts which is now putting out more power then even the evo.

constantlehigh

iTrader: (1)

You can put all the power you want into a lancer, but there is such a thing as TOO much power especially with FWD. You gotta keep in mind that the two front wheels are responsible for steering as well as the power output, so the more power you add the more difficult it is going to be to control. Sure, you could probably make a GTS as fast if not faster than an evo. but i'm sorry I don't see the point with FWD. And its a lot more work than just piston, rods, and a ecu flash. you'll need a new exhaust system, intercooler, wastegate with bov, you'll need to reposition the battery and wiper fluid container to the trunk, etc. This is A LOT of customization, and it leaves a lot of room for error and failure with no warranty. It will be a hassle and expensive even for a professional.

maybe i'm alone in this but i just don't see the reasoning behind wanting to turbo a lancer. if you're going to put that much money and effort into it, why would you prefer to have all that power at the two front wheels, rather than possibly pay a small amount more for mitsu to do it for you and throw in the S-AWC handling (or the evo VIII's in the ralli)?

A complete turbo kit for the 2009 gts from rrm will run you 4,300, not including a new exhaust system or suspension upgrades...so let's say 5,000 total. So, assuming your GTS cost around, lets say, 20k? base price for the ralliart is about 27,000 before incentives, so for an extra 2k you'll get the evo 8 awd and a solid warranty. IMO the best bang for your buck is obvious.

turbotime

iTrader: (16)

I see what your saying.. but first off I would never spend 4300 on a turbo kit for a gts. You can build your own for much less and include the exhaust, intercooler ect. into that price. Maybe even suspension if your lucky.

The whole fwd is useless is just silly. There are plenty of 800hp fwd hondas, and what not that do just fine. if your taking about auto x then yes I would agree the evo awd system is probably one of the best but again your paying top dollar for it.

Also the guy just bought a 09 GTS so saying to buy a ralliart, evo whatever is not going to help since he doesn't have the option.

talking about warranty is irrelevant because no matter what you drive evo, lancer, ect. as soon as you mod it, majority of the time your warranty is gone anyway.

GiLizILL

iTrader: (5)

or you could just buy a Ralliart.

EngRWW33

^^Well, Myra just doesn't feel like the real thing.... transmission wise at least.

If the Ralliart came with a manual tranny, I would be all over it.

JRR

iTrader: (19)

i turboed my 03 lancer and tell you the truth i wont look back at it. it turns heads. as ROCK posted in the general section with the video "it takes a lot to turn heads now a days with an evo, but a turbo lancer...."

these cars turboed are a lot of fun and still keep some great fuel economy. im now at 11psi and still with 28 mpg.

josh

constantlehigh

iTrader: (1)

sure, I get what you guys are saying. Turboing my lancer would definitely put a smile on my face, but it just isn't practical. and turbotime - as far as the warranty goes, it is ILLEGAL for a dealership to void a warranty due to aftermarket modifications, unless the dealer can specifically prove that the aftermarket product caused failure to the part of the car, i.e. you buy a turbo and blow a piston head, that's your dollar. but if you do it all the right way and everything's fine, the dealer can't void you. there was a federal court case on this, I forget the name, but dealers will never tell you that. my dealer is cool with my mods, they don't give me a hard time.

ambystom01

iTrader: (7)

Wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, it isn't illegal for them to deny you warranty work if they suspect the car has been modified, is modified, or has been driven excessively hard.

borievoinitialD

iTrader: (12)

800hp fwd honda's that run solid blocks for 10 sec at a time on slicks... they would never drive that great in the street... i had a 300hp b18b on a teggy and it was alright... but traction is a problem..

Hydrolikz

If everyone thought that way no one would ever turbo an N/A car, they would just say buy a car that comes with a turbo already. And where would the tuning world be if that was the case? I understand that it "may" not be worth it for the general tuner, but if you have the cash and the imagination then go ahead let's see how it holds up.

constantlehigh

iTrader: (1)

NOPE, you just don't know the law. Mainly from SEMA Online:

"What's the lie?

"A manufacturer's new-vehicle warranty is automatically voided once an aftermarket part (that means a part not put on or sold by the vehicle manufacturer) is installed on the vehicle."

"What's the truth?"

"Rarely does the use of a part that's not from the vehicle manufacturer violate a new-vehicle warranty. Period. Here's the only situation in which a warranty can be voided: If a vehicle owner installs a replacement part or accessory that isn't from the vehicle manufacturer, and either the installation of the product or the product itself is responsible for a problem that results in a warranty claim, the vehicle manufacturer is not responsible for the claim."

If you are having you warranty claim denied because of an aftermarket modification, please read SEMA's Steps to Take if Your Vehicle Warranty Claim is Denied.

In 1979, the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act made it illegal for a manufacturer to void a new vehicle warranty if the consumer uses non-OEM parts. The below information is reprinted from the Alternative Auto Web Site:

"In today's market, even the most ardent enthusiast might pause before making any performance modifications to a late-model, emission-controlled vehicle. One of the first considerations before "bolting-on" is the legality of any such modification."

"Almost everyone has heard that the mere installation and/or use of aftermarket parts will void a vehicle manufacturer's warranty. That claim appears to know no limitations and is heralded from coast to coast with no lack of certainty. In spite of having unbridled support, however, one basic problem remains: It's not true!"

"A second warranty required under the Clean Air Act is the performance warranty. Under this warranty the vehicle is required to maintain certain emission performance standards throughout its "useful" life. If the car fails to meet those requirements, the vehicle manufacturer is required to make repairs. What could void this warranty? The only circumstance under which the vehicle manufacturer may void the emission warranty is where the aftermarket part is responsible for the warranty claim. The vehicle manufacturer cannot void the warranty merely because aftermarket equipment has been installed on the vehicle."

"The law relating to the other types of warranties is similar. Federal law, regulating to one extent or another, expressed and implied warranties is very clear: That warranties may not be conditioned upon the use of the manufacturer's parts or services unless those parts or services are provided free of charge. Therefore, the expressed and implied warranties cannot be voided merely because aftermarket parts are installed on a vehicle. The warranties can be voided only where the installation of an aftermarket part is DIRECTLY responsible for that failure which gives rise to the warranty claim."


If that's not enough to convince you, go here:
http://www.keystonekrawlers.com/Docu...agnusonAct.pdf

In the case of what's legal, I think US Code - Title 15, Chapter 50, Sections 2301-2312 is pretty clear and you can't argue with it. If the law says its illegal, then I tend to believe its illegal.

ambystom01

iTrader: (7)

SEMA is an organization centered around modified cars, of course they're only to tell people to mod. I'll go over the key areas, that I've also highlighted.
What this first part is saying is that if you don't use OEM equipment, the part or installation has to directly cause the problem. Well that's great but the term direct is itself subjective. As an obvious example, it quite possible for an exhaust to cause a blown motor if its not tuned for (car runs too lean, overboosts, etc). The installation clause causes many issues as well, what if while uninstalling the stock exhaust, you don't properly torque down the bolts, you get a leak and some wires melt?
The second bold section covers emission claims, namely your catalytic converter. Just because they are obliged to fix these issues by law does not mean they are obliged to fix all issues.
The original aim of the act was to stop manufacturers from creating a monopoly in the market, which they would effectively be doing if they forced people to only buy OEM equipment. It was never intended to cover performance modifications. Performance modifications are, by their nature, designed to change the way the car operates. Manufacturers did not agree to warranty vehicles making 50 more HP than stock, with spring rates double stock, etc.
You're welcome to try to "beat the system" but it'll be a very expensive lesson. Manufacturers are getting smart, they're starting to either make it very difficult to mod or they're installing systems to monitor the car more thoroughly.