you really are awsome dude, its people like you who make this forum great, thanks!

 

well... I could clamp it on a switch (i dont know how just clamping it would affect warm-up) so that when the car is nice and warm I flip a switch and -bang- the ECU sees a constant 180 degrees no matter what. (Also I would think this would be nice for when temps outside are quite cold and/or I am not driving agressively enough to want it on)
...that is my idea.... but I'm just an ME in training.... and one that is bad @ ciruits to boot.

Oh yeah, I have no problem w/ aquamist being so expensive, I mean hey, it's done right, and for quality you have to pay.... mine has 0 failsafes....

Thank you guys so much. (I'm really getting excited at the thought of 20whp for $1)

 

Hey Richard,

I'm planning on integrating my System 2D with my AEM EMS. I'm wondering if I can put the purple wire (FI% monitor) to use. Here's a run down of where I'll be connecting the various FiA wires:

Red: 12V switched at ign
Black: ECU ground
Gray: 806-162 switch & float switch (n/o)
Brown: HSV

Blue: Ordinarily this would go to 806-157 but I'll use one of the low side outputs on the AEM EMS to pull this to ground at a programmed load point to arm the FiA.

Green: Ordinarily this would be fed by one of the four low side injector outputs. Instead I'll drive this using a dedicated injector driver from the AEM EMS. This should allow me to map the water delivery in a similar fashion as your MF2.

Orange: I use this as a low side input into the AEM EMS to cut boost in the event of a system fault. Also I can use this to retard the ignition timing. What condition is this wire in the event of a general FiA fault?

Purple: What is the condition of the this output in the event of a water delivery fault? The reason I ask is that the AEM EMS has a 0-5V EGT sensor input. This input can be used to drive a fuel trim, either to add fuel or take it out. I'm thinking I could use this as part of a feedback loop into the EMS so it can trim fuel as the water injector pulse is recieved by the FiA. This would allow me to leave my fuel maps in a "rich" state of tune and then in the event of a fault, boost could drop back to 19psi instead of 22-23psi and the EGT fuel trim would add fuel back into the mix.

Note, I'm retaining the FiA2 instead of driving the whole thing directly using the AEM EMS so I don't loose the built-in fail safes.

To reiterate my questions:
1.) If the FiA faults or if power is interupted, does the orange wire go to ground?
2.) Does the purple wire go to 0V in the event of a water delivery fault? If not, can it be pulled to ground by the orange wire?

Any advice you can provide would be appreciated.

 

Richard, this log was done on 91oct gas. When/if i ever get the hybrid shurflo/aquamist system to work, and at a 15 to 20% water/fuel ratio, I can lean out the AFR and make those 11s and 10s to a solid 12.5? Maybe crank up the boost and timing more?

 

Hi Richard

I've heard much about the Aquamist range and have personally seem many units in use. The effectiveness and the sophistication of the Aquamist range puts it at the top of my list of Water Injection Systems. However, what has become a concern for me is the occurence of pump failures among my friends.

Out of about 8 of them, 3 have already encountered pump failure at around the 1 year mark. What do u think possibly caused these failures and are there any methods of preventive maintenance? Bad installation? Engine bay heat?

Thank you for your kind attention.

Cheers
Dennis

 

In my situation, my pump has held up quite well. My Aquamist pump was on my Eagle Talon for about 2 years and now I am running that same system on my Evo. I have always believed that the engine compartment is a harsh environment and I had my pump mounted in the fenderwell area away from the engine heat. On my Evo it is mounted in the trunk. It can get warm back there, but it is definitely cooler than the engine compartment.

 

hey fellow singaporean, ho sei bo?

 

I think you can use a switch to change the coolant sensor to a fix resistor, not sure the value but you can use a valiable type, it will cost a little bit more but well worth the investment. I guess a 500 ohm one will do nicely.

All you need to set it up is trim the variable to a voltage compariable to 0.47V (185F) after the engine is warm up. I am not sure that it will be a dollar but it will be close.

Richard

 

Better still, connect a 5-pin relay to your Shurflo pump and turn it into an "automatic" switch when the Shurflo pump is running.

It will be over a dollar for sure now.

 

PropelllerHead wrote:

I'm planning on integrating my System 2D with my AEM EMS. I'm wondering if I can put the purple wire (FI% monitor) to use. Here's a run down of where I'll be connecting the various FiA wires:

Red: 12V switched at ign
Black: ECU ground
Gray: 806-162 switch & float switch (n/o)
Brown: HSV

I think this will work very well together.


Blue: Ordinarily this would go to 806-157 but I'll use one of the low side outputs on the AEM EMS to pull this to ground at a programmed load point to arm the FiA.
Instead of pull to ground, you need to disconnect this junction to ground to activate the FIA2/WI.

Green: Ordinarily this would be fed by one of the four low side injector outputs. Instead I'll drive this using a dedicated injector driver from the AEM EMS. This should allow me to map the water delivery in a similar fashion as your MF2.

Perfect! what frequency is the AEM PWM output? The hSV work best between 50-80HKz.

Orange: I use this as a low side input into the AEM EMS to cut boost in the event of a system fault. Also I can use this to retard the ignition timing. What condition is this wire in the event of a general FiA fault?
When a fault occur, this wire to switch to 0v, can switch up to 1A.

Purple: What is the condition of the this output in the event of a water delivery fault? The reason I ask is that the AEM EMS has a 0-5V EGT sensor input. This input can be used to drive a fuel trim, either to add fuel or take it out. I'm thinking I could use this as part of a feedback loop into the EMS so it can trim fuel as the water injector pulse is recieved by the FiA. This would allow me to leave my fuel maps in a "rich" state of tune and then in the event of a fault, boost could drop back to 19psi instead of 22-23psi and the EGT fuel trim would add fuel back into the mix.
This output translate the PWM signal seen by the FIA2, it is quite close to the final stage of the FIA2's circuitry, so if this otuput reads 0V, it often means there is a general fault in the FIA2.

Note, I'm retaining the FiA2 instead of driving the whole thing directly using the AEM EMS so I don't loose the built-in fail safes.
You are very sensible in using every output signal from the FIA2.

To reiterate my questions:
1.) If the FiA faults or if power is interupted, does the orange wire go to ground?[/COLOR]
I am afraid the orange wire will not go to ground. Perhaps inserting a small 5-pin relay across the FIA2's supply and when the power is "lost" it will signal the AEM that the FIA2 is "not powered up". Use the "NC" set of contact for the relay.

2.) Does the purple wire go to 0V in the event of a water delivery fault? If not, can it be pulled to ground by the orange wire?
The purple wire can only see the PWM signal from the FIA2 translator, but beyond that stage, it doesn't see fault such as pump, HSV or output transistor failure. The Orange wire is the only output that covers all the faults except in "no power" conditions - it is a part of a large feedback loop covering all the mechanical part and electronic parts, require quite complex processing but essential for a reliable fault detection output.

Here is how it works: it detects the PWM signal driving the HSV (brown wire) and compares the PWM signal of the pump (grey wire), this is done in real time. If two two signal falls outside the limited set by the controller, it flags out a "fault" signal (buffered) to the orange wire.


Richard

 

10-15% water should cover the a/f ratio points - ensure you have "plan B" when water flow is interrupted.

What did you use to log the a/f ratio? Very impressive.

Richard

 

I'm running the utec + tuner pro w/ bosch LSU4 wb sensor. How much more can i push the boost and timing w/ 100% water injection?

 

Hey hey
Bo Ho Seh ley, car too slow, run too rich, petrol too expensive
Hopefully I can use WI to lower my fuel consumption, water cheaper than petrol, used to cool my combustion chamber anyway.

 

The failure rate is closely related to the installation, especially the location of the water tank in relation to the position of the pump. We have received many return pumps and found that they are in perfect working order - return it to our customer and within a few months, it was returned again and surprisingly, no fault was found.

I can safely put the preceived pump failure as follows:

1) Loss of prime: The pump heats up (loss of central cooling by running water). When the thermal cut out kicks into operation, the pump works intermittantly as the hystersis loop swung into action. This condition often been mistaken by the user as pump failure - often being subjected to the physical abuse with a heavy metal object, a hammer or a 50mm spanner is used. I love to post some pictures to show you all but I think this is not the place to incriminate people or bashing our customers.

2) Dry internals, this is often a result of water tank running dry or clogged inlet filter. When the pump runs dry, the pump tube can reach as high as 100-120C after 5-10 minutes or so, if the pump is close to a heated component in the engine bay, it arrives at this temperature sooner.

As far as the pump is concerned, it can withstand it. Since water boils at 100C, (without methanol), gaseous water is formed. It tends to push the water out of the pump during a re-priming session by the user upon refilling the water tank. The pump will not prime, it just makes a great deal of noise. In such cases, heavy physical abuse soon follows. In order to achieve a speedy re-prime, we often ask user to physically inject a small amount of water through the pump (20cc syringe)and wet the internal parts and follow by a quick prime - with the engine running (good voltage). This works every time except when the user repeatly run the pump dry so that the piston seal is worned. In this circumstances, the pump needs a re-seal - we often send popel the seal fo free if they are prepare to do it themselves. It is a 30 minute job.

3) Wrong alcohol: Not as frequent now. More and more people are aware of adding alcohol other than methnoal will swell up the aquamist pump seal.
Just in case, here is the correct concentration recommended:

Methanol: 50% long term and 7%% short term (1 week) with standard seal. teflon seal and run 75%-85% long term - Not recommending 100% methanol due to fire hazard although the seal can run that concentration.
Isopropyl: 25% maximum
Ethanol: 5% maximum

4) Freezing up: Without methanol, the pump tube will break upon freezing and often the end tube cracks and splits open. Hair line Cracks often shows up as the pressurised water line is full of bubbles.

The least problem the aquamist pump encountered was the WRC teams even when the car is driven at pace with incredible vibrations and water tank surging conditions. A well thought out installation is the key to a reliable system.

BakZamGai, thank for bring up this very important topic and gave me a chance to explain some common pitfall.

Richard

 

Hi Richard

Thank you for that highly informative post. I had suspected that the pump 'failures' were due to bad installation or misuse or in some cases, as you've mentioned, plain abuse. It is reassuring to have a clear and concise explaination from Aquamist.

Cheers
Dennis