AlwaysinBoost

iTrader: (17)

This topic is really beating a dead horse but I just wanted to point out the problem with that analogy. A dvd/movie is made from scratch. It's not someone taking an already existing movie, modifing it, and calling it their own. How someone can 'steal' a map from change a couple of cells and then say its theirs is beyond me.

Stew

iTrader: (11)

Well, would you consider it illegal to download and burn CD's sold by a cover band? They did not create the music, but modified existing music. Howerver, that is still illegal. Existing product + modifications = new product. There are a ton of grey areas, but that is the main idea.

andenbre

iTrader: (4)

the way I under stand it is mitsu is the only entity that may have any rights to the maps unless there is some other copyrighted/patented software programed on to the ecu that is completely diferent than mitsus( not the data in the maps but the entire program that controls the ecu) other wise it is considered a derivetive work that falls under the originators ip rights, now when we buy our cars there is no contract or statement that says anything about the ip rights reserved by the manufacturor and I am sure that if they had any they would have shut down ecutek, techtom and others a long time ago just for the warrenty implications alone.

now I think that a particular method may be patentable if it can be proven that that organization/person can prove they originated the Idea and meet the other requirments , for eg changing all the fuel maps to the same map for the sake of stability and consistancy

If you bought a map think before you post it up. it is a slap in the face of the tuner. Illegal? probebly not. disrespectful ? yes.
your tuner is in it for the money, accept that. they have bills to pay and retirement to plan for.

yes i agree the stance evom has taken is the safe stance and probly best for the future of the forum for legal reasons but I see no reason not to discuss what is being done by tuners and learning from it

I could ramble on some more but this horse has been whipped and beaten enough and will leave it alone now

JohnBradley

iTrader: (30)

This is why tuners will undoubtedly start using some sort of encryption software (ala ECUtek) more and more. Because now we can tune by ourselves or based on their tunes, they have no choice but to do something to protect their intellectual property. One thread has already been completely destroyed because of this, lets try to not do it again. Everyone knows who has what because of what in their sig, if someone really wanted something they would simply PM for it, lets not clutter this forum with useless debates about legality. If you have a map that you want to post, THAT YOU DEVELOPED, then do it. Everyone else either benefits from the different point of view or can help the poster to see where corrections need to be made. Through this process everyone learns how to tune, and not how to debate.

MBaran

iTrader: (2)

actually a movie or song is legally licensed to be purchased by one, and viewed by many, so long as its not to stand to gain a monetary benifit.

technically, the aspect that the tuners have to go by is reverse assembly. Since they do not give us the tune as values, 15 @ 3000/260, but a rom upload, or in 1 case a HEX file, our fault in sharing them would be the reverse assembly (ecuflash).

but, this also means that the tuners must be in some violation of Mitsubishi copyright in cracking and reverse engineering the original ECU.

vboy425

iTrader: (19)

everyone on here are pretending to be a good child and acting like they have never copy or downloaded some illegally before. BS if you ask me. What do you think IPod is ? or MP3 ? If i paid for it i can do whatever T F i want to.

Evo_Jay

iTrader: (17)

I believe tuner SHOULD start encrypting the work, but with the user still having the ability to tune their car. The best idea that comes to mind would somehow involve the immobilizer code, but I'm not a programmer or anything, so I would know how.

But for now, just post any map you feel comfortable posting at...

http://www.osecuroms.org/

MalibuJack

iTrader: (5)

ECUTek does not encrypt their Roms, in fact, there is nothing unique about the roms other than the User License (likely partly based on their Immobilizer code)

If you get a "Do it yourself" reflash kit from ECUTek (not sure if its available in the states or for the Evo) then the roms are encrypted before their placed on the ECU and then locked.

Although I do agree they should protect their work, I disagree that the method used (Locking the ECU from changes, since it also infringes on the individuals right to work with his own hardware)

Tuners should embed a unique checksum in the roms, the checksum should be something that uniquely identifies the Tuner, Individual it was created for, and a CRC for the modifiable areas of the map, this would allow them to tell who tuned the car, who it was done for (what car and individual) and if it was altered.. Also, Tuners should place this data in different locations to thrwart users from just removing it.. This should discourage most from tampering with their rom and distributing it unless their really comfortable modifying their maps this would give tuners a little bit of protection..

1) It would discourage distribution because it can be identified
2) It would allow tuners to know its one of their Roms
3) It should allow some form of "Warranty" since they can then verify it was altered or not
4) It should discourage the inexperienced from altering the maps..

The truth is its not perfect, and I can guarantee that if you gave me a locked, Encrypted, or some sort of protection in any way on the ECU, that I could find it, remove it, and/or break it in a very short period of time.. but it should discourage most..



With all of this said.. THIS IS THE FORUM POLICY NOT TO POST TUNER MAPS, I have seen enough maps to be able to identify where some likely have originated from, so I'm sure the tuners can identify them too.. Please respect the Admins of the forum, even if you don't respect the tuner.

This won't stop any of you from really sharing, but it can at least indemnify EvoM because they have performed their due diligence..