Appauldd

iTrader: (22)

I see that the patch works very well at keeping the car from stalling. I, like you, have not had a chance to "play around" with it.

One thing I did notice though is that often when attempting to get moving again if I try to do it too fast the car goes super lean +20, then catches itself, and all is normal again.

Since I am far from understanding all this this patch is capable of I was in hopes that you could explain a in detail how the VE and Calabration maps affect the over all MAF operation. You initial explanation rather confused me.

I too have hard pipes and a K&N cone, but I am running revolver cams. My car is so much more drivable now.

Thank you for putting this all together.

Maybe MFred and TouringBubble can chime in and tweek with it a bit.

evoredy

iTrader: (7)

later tonight or this week i will post the code and all mods to the ECU here. i'm sure the experienced guys already took a loot at it.

basically, the patch takes the MAF signal and multiplies it. using a modified maf correction, the code decides when to use the VE table. if the multipled signal is lower than the actual MAF signal, the ECU will use the MAP sensor based VE table. in a nutshell, that what happens. its very, very simple and could use some revamping. the basic idea works and could allow full SD if more tuning ability was available/better load reference/ve table/etc.

i actually have yet to fully custimize the code as it is basically an exact dupe of BEZ's code applied to the other ECU renditions with addressing changes. i just wanted to see how/if it works. thats done, but i am not nearly as active as others in testing/tuning/modifying as time is never on my side lol. i used this port to familiarize myself with disassembling and reassembling the ecu for later projects. thank you for your input.

on a side note, when i use tephra's averaged MAP value, the patches emulated MAF output is a little more stable/less spikes. i will mod the other patches to use that soon as it has no adverse affect and will move the maps closer to the beginning or end of free rom space. i think the stock MDP/1bar MAP has reached its limit and i have yet to wire up my motorola 4bar.

i have noticed the tip-in lean too and decided that a better approach in tuning the sgnal may be required. the ECU may be switching too fast between the values. ultimately, i want to be able to use SD for vacume conditions with a good transition into low boost. i don't want to blow up my motor in the process though .

Appauldd

iTrader: (22)

Going off of your latest settings my car will hold idle well when rolling to a stop. The problem is that it goes super rich 10s and 11s and pretty much stays that way.

Any suggestions on what I should change on the VE map?

My idle is set at 1000 RPM. The car idles great on start up with 14.7 AFR. My STFT anfd LTFT mid and low are all +/- 5 so I know my fuel settings are spot on.

evoredy

iTrader: (7)

my car does the same thing. after a while, the AFR's stabilize. i think this issue is mechanical. the VE table doenst offer correction in that are as of now. when i get time, i'll post the code and aspects.

running this patch with a 3" GM maf and translator zeroed out, the afr's are a little better/13ish before they stabilize. probelm is maf/maf code related while having substantial airflow mods. sorry...don't have a discreet answer. consider this a WIP .

Appauldd

iTrader: (22)

I turned on the MAP Smoothing. I will install it in the AM and get back later with the results.

Can you please explain the VE to me. I think I know what it is supposed to do....but I don't know how or what it really means.

RoadSpike

iTrader: (5)

VE - Volumetric Effeciency

Its precisely how effective the engine is as drawing air into its chambers as a percentage of the engine's total mathematical volume. If a 2.0L engine is only sucking in 1.0L of air at 1 atmosphere then its VE is 50. If its sucking 2.0L of air then its 100.

evoredy

iTrader: (7)

thank you roadspike.

hey the MAP smooting won't do anything with the posted ROM. I have to tell it to use Tephra's MAP smoothing output rather than the stock output. It's in the code. Sorry for any miscommunication. It's an easy mod an I will correct the roms later...ETA sunday or monday. To add, the MAP smooting smotths out the emulated MAF signal and doesn''y really help with the AFR swings/doh.

Good luck.

Charlie_B

iTrader: (1)

+1 on going rich upon clutch in for a bit. At least it doesnt die anywhere near as much.

Anyone else have any experiences with sub 3k rpm full rich conditions when slightly cruising?

Also, what effects should tuning the maf scaling have now that the cpu is supposedly using the MDP under vaccumm?

Appauldd

iTrader: (22)

What can we do to the settings to get the car to idle more like stock?

I like how it won't stall but it sure is sucking the fuel at 11 AFR when rolling to a stop.

evoredy

iTrader: (7)

i think we may have physical/mechanical issues related to our airflow mods. the settings and patch never take over until actually reaching the set VE RPMS (i said rpms lol). so the MAF is ALWAYS used otherwise when using any of my posted settings, whether it be decel, cruise, throttle, etc. the patch will noticably work say when an HKS SSQV valve is fitted and the driver lets off to neutral after a 5K cruise. the car will not die as usual. the *settings above will not work say if you disconnect a hose and try to drive around.

i don't want to use a linear MAP curve anywhere as i an dyno-tuned with my MAF. this code is *actually FULL SD capable but we're limiting it with our VE table/offset/mapcal table. the code is ready to go for linear MAP mode, it just doesn't account for finer tuning factors [brought up in other discussions] and MAF removal CEL's.

sorry for no 'straight' answer. looks like jcsbanks is hot on the trail though. i'll post up what i got sooner or later. thanks for all the replies/input/questions.

Appauldd

iTrader: (22)

I understand what you are saying, but I am confused in that the car won't stall now with this patch. This proves that is works at least a little bit. There has to be something that can be done to get it to not run so rich.

evoredy

iTrader: (7)

we're only making this patch work a little bit.

EDIT: if you're brave and a decent tuner, add VE resolution up to 2000 RPM. MAKE sure to ADD A 2500 RPM (you can add 2100 or 2200 or whatever WITHIN 500 or less RPM...get my drift?) after and put a 255 for that value--based on the offset of 128 given and the MAP CAL values, this will turn off the patch and use the real MAF value after 2500 RPM (or whatever you put). adjust the values a little lower than 255/try linear and then redo your fuel table in that area--because it will be all jacked up lol. ALWAYS HAVE A LIVE WB02 GAUGE when doing stuff like this. you may have some wacky numbers in the tables, but you might find a medium. this is something i never did or tried to do. i am happy with this thing not stalling my car .

report back. heh j/k

Appauldd

iTrader: (22)

Help me to understand how to log the changes we should see with this. Once I can see the changes that take place when VE comes into account, I can make appropriate changes to the table and make it work better for us.

Appauldd

iTrader: (22)

I get what you are saying about trying to go full SD but I am wanting to have this control fuel only durring coasting to a stop and idle. My car does great in the upper RPM.

So if I am correct I want to take the VE table and have a lot of resolution in the ranges my car idles so that I can make adjustments to the units to get it to stabilize. I know I need to have a "0" for the first value and "255" for the last couple (for safety).

If my car is running super rich at coasting to a stop (idle RPM 1000) then I need to RAISE the VE table units?????

evoredy

iTrader: (7)

i'm half asleep right now lol.

the 0 and 255 stuff you spoke of is ONLY for the MAP Callibration table, not the VE table.

you can use the addresses posted to log (MUT 2byte). i just used the MAF emulated value and the RAW MAF value after filter (REAL MAFSOURCE). scale them down so they're loggable. you will have to actively monitor the emulated MAFSOURCE value alongside the REAL MAFSOURCE value (mut logging) and adjust the VE table, map callibration, and possibly even the offset so that the two closely mimick one another. youre basically tuning a MAF emulator.

basically, you would want to adjust that stuff so that at your target PSI (say 2 to 3ish or whatever), the emulated MAFSOURCE value goes [rockets lol] above the REAL MAFSOURCE value thus switching back over to MAF mode. when that is successful, you can tune the regular fuel map in those load areas. the VE table allows also an RPM to where the emulation can stop--a second safety. the values within the rpm will directly affect the MAFSOURCE emulated output along with the offset. the math can be figured out in the code i'm sure easily-i haven't even really analyzed it, but it's right there.

the patch is simple, but there is A LOT of here and there work just to use it for MAP controlled off-idle vacume. thats why i strictly limit it to the idle areas in the VE table. if the MAFSOURCE emulated value stays lower than the REAL MAFSOURCE value under higher boost, you will go super lean as it throws an untuned/way off emulated MAFSOURCE value.

basically, first you callibrate the MAP sensor (SHOULD be simple/linear/i'm not a tuner). second, you adjust the VE table and offset value to emulate the MAF output value for the RPM you desire. like bez said, if you keep the EMULATED MAFSOURCE value around 10% lower than the REAL MAFSOURCE value, the ECU will use SD. keep it around 10% higher or more, the ECU will use the MAF. having the VE table values unscaled makes it a bit harder. i haven't played around with scaling either. BEZ got a nice emulated MAF curve side by side with the stock MAF curve with some magical values heh. it's gotta be possible...

i would think to do any of this with good results, you need at least a 3bar because you have a lot to work with. i'm still on the stocker 1bar and it sucks. gimme a few more days and i'll post what i have unless someone beats me to it...