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FreeFuel ECU patch - a flex fuel implementation to Evo ECU

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Old Sep 18, 2012, 01:14 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by Boltz. View Post
Also, since no one can get 100% ethanol, unless they produce it themselves or are getting it illegally, shouldn't the 'ethanol value' that you noted at 100% actually be 85%? Is that end user adjustable?
This should be possible by changing Ethanol Sensor Fuel/Injector/Primer Setting. It changes the behavior of injector scaling, fuel maps and cranking initial primer pulse maps.

With ECA + GM sensor if you set sensor voltage 0.25V (equals to 5% ethanol) to to match 0% ethanol content and 4.25V (equals to 85% ethanol) to match 100% ethanol content then your gasoline maps will be for gasoline containing 5% ethanol and your ethanol maps will be for E85 containing 85% ethanol. I'm not sure how the ECU behaves if sensor output goes outside this range.

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Originally Posted by 99EclipseGSX View Post
I’m going to suggest this support the 96531706 ROM as this seems to be one of the more popular ones. Just a few comments/ideas/suggestions from my experience with Flex Fuel control on other ECUs:
It depends on what memory areas the additions in this ROM are using. Nobody I know uses the ROM you mention, everybody who has SD uses Donner's port of Speed Density 2.0 + Livemap which should work fine as there are no overlapping memory areas.

So it may work as is but I haven't disassembled that ROM so I don't know.

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Originally Posted by 99EclipseGSX View Post
The GM Flex Fuel sensor outputs a frequency signal for content (50-150hz, 0-100% content). It would be VERY cool if this could be run into the ECU directly to avoid having to buy the Zeitronix unit. The only frequency-based ECU input I can think of would be the Vehicle Speed input (or MAF freq if running speed density). This might take some pretty hardcore code but think of how great it would be if we could read the sensor’s frequency output directly. If not, I’m sure one could make a cheap digital to analogue converter module.
I have tought connecting directly to ECU but haven't really done any research if it would be possible or not. I agree that 200 USD for something that converts frequency to voltage is bit too much. I don't use Zeitronix ECA myself, but it's the only commercial converter I know so I made the default settings for it and mention it in the posts.

You could make cheap analog converter with LM2914. I experimented with that earlier but it was not as accurate or linear as the microcontroller solution I have now.

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Originally Posted by JohnBradley View Post
How fast is the feedback from sensor to ECU for the interpolation?
Sensor itself is very fast and power on delay is not significant. So it depends on the frequency-to-voltage converter. The converter I use has some signal filtering but still if I have been using gasoline and fill up with E85, engine runs perfectly from the start. It takes few seconds until the new mixture gets to the fuel rail but you really can't hear or feel the change at all.

Unfortunately I have nothing to do with development of the converter that I use so I can't give any details about it.
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Old Sep 18, 2012, 05:40 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by ast View Post
Sensor itself is very fast and power on delay is not significant. So it depends on the frequency-to-voltage converter. The converter I use has some signal filtering but still if I have been using gasoline and fill up with E85, engine runs perfectly from the start. It takes few seconds until the new mixture gets to the fuel rail but you really can't hear or feel the change at all.

Unfortunately I have nothing to do with development of the converter that I use so I can't give any details about it.
Thank you for the answer. That was what I was hoping to hear but it never hurts to ask

Aaron
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Old Sep 18, 2012, 05:45 PM   #18
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Amazing work, awesome to see stuff still being developed for this car
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Old Sep 19, 2012, 03:56 PM   #19
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It looks that GM is again using sensor in it's newest Flex Fuel vehicles instead of software solution. Sensor part numbers seem to be 13577379 and 13577394. I found one reference with google which suggests that the output could be the same 50 Hz - 150 Hz as the older sensor.

Why is this interesting? These sensors are 66 USD online...

Unfortunately this is all I know at the moment. Hopefully someone can give more information about these new sensors.
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Old Sep 19, 2012, 04:00 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by ast View Post
It looks that GM is again using sensor in it's newest Flex Fuel vehicles instead of software solution. Sensor part numbers seem to be 13577379 and 13577394. I found one reference with google which suggests that the output could be the same 50 Hz - 150 Hz as the older sensor.

Why is this interesting? These sensors are 66 USD online...

Unfortunately this is all I know at the moment. Hopefully someone can give more information about these new sensors.
Wow $66 is cheap! Definitely a lot better than the usual price of like $400 new...


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Old Sep 19, 2012, 08:49 PM   #21
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I'm already working with these new sensors on evo flexfuel application but no news yet, will tell you when testing is done.
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Old Sep 20, 2012, 04:00 PM   #22
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all very cool.
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Old Sep 20, 2012, 11:12 PM   #23
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is this for evo 9 too?
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Old Sep 21, 2012, 03:50 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Huy's Evo View Post
is this for evo 9 too?
Not at the moment.

I haven't done much research but it seems that Evo IX doesn't have a single ROM that could be used in US and EUR without issues.

So it would need to be ported to 88580714 and 88590715. I will probably do that some day but for the next month or so I'm going to be extremely busy so it's not going to happen overnight unless somebody else wants to do it.
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Old Nov 3, 2012, 07:05 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by ast View Post
Not at the moment.

I haven't done much research but it seems that Evo IX doesn't have a single ROM that could be used in US and EUR without issues.

So it would need to be ported to 88580714 and 88590715. I will probably do that some day but for the next month or so I'm going to be extremely busy so it's not going to happen overnight unless somebody else wants to do it.
Hey, I used Donners SD 2.0 88586714 rom on my usdm evo IX. Im very interested in this lmk!

I dont use livemap though because I dont have a cable for that yet, but I do have an op 2.0 currently. Im trying to pick one up second hand!

as long as this code wont disable any of the SAS function Im ok.

Last edited by 211ratsbud; Nov 3, 2012 at 07:07 PM.
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Old Dec 9, 2012, 05:47 PM   #26
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bump for any updates
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 12:38 AM   #27
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Been following this and the other flex fuel thread mrfred and then donner were contributing to. Very interested in a 88590715 ROM even w/o boost interpolation since I'm on stock turbo and intercooler anyways.

Been getting cabin fever this winter and need a project like this. I hope this is still being worked on and thanks for your contributions in advance.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 04:25 AM   #28
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Okay, I gotta ask especially now that there seem to be guys who have finally really gotten down SD and now we're delving in Flex fuel. Maybe this needs to go in another thread, and if so, please direct me to it.

Is anyone on SD also running the flex fuel and making big power (650+ whp)? If so, how is the drivability? Have there been any issues with tuning and scalibility of injectors and such, especially when running say a 2000cc injector? Also, any weird glitches or hiccups s far?

The reason I ask is because now that this is finally a reality, and now that there are tuners out there who have mastered speed density on the stock ecu, I'm considering making the switch back from standalone.
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Old Dec 11, 2012, 01:58 PM   #29
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It has been quiet in my front. but I hope to find some time to research what would be needed for Evo 9 ROM port and boost interpolation. I do have already some Evo 9 ROMs disassembled but I don't have any commented disassembly from some other developer so it will take some time to understand the differences to Evo 8 ROM. It would be also good to find a test car as I don't have anybody locally with Evo 9 who would be interested.

My car is running MAP EF2 and 1100cc FIC inejctors. No problems tuning with those.
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Old Dec 11, 2012, 06:23 PM   #30
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It has been quiet in my front. but I hope to find some time to research what would be needed for Evo 9 ROM port and boost interpolation. I do have already some Evo 9 ROMs disassembled but I don't have any commented disassembly from some other developer so it will take some time to understand the differences to Evo 8 ROM. It would be also good to find a test car as I don't have anybody locally with Evo 9 who would be interested.

My car is running MAP EF2 and 1100cc FIC inejctors. No problems tuning with those.
I'm currently running a 2.3 HTA 35r with 2000cc injectors. I'm about to switch to a 2.4 with the same turbo and a CNC head. I'm working on this motor as we speak. I've been running dedicated e85 but have wanted to be able to run true flex fuel. As far as stand alone setups go, the only one that does that is ProEFI which I was prepared to buy. However, if this works as well or better than that in conjuction with SD, then it would make a lot of senseto go with this rather than a new stand alone setup.

However, in times past in the infancy of new roms there have been unexpected "hiccups" that have had to be worked out. Thus, my curiosity if any has yet to run in to any running a comparable or larger setup. I REALLY want to do this. I just don't want to be a guinea pig in the large HP territory.
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