BR double pumper video, facts and information
BR double pumper video, facts and information
Well I got a bug to do some more testing and make some changes. Which resulted in another video.
My RS (formerly referred to as the BadBish-but everyone's copied that now so......it's just my RS to keep things straight) has run 93 octane, Q16, VP Import, E85 and E98 in it. Through the years I've seen posting of how this fuel or that fuel ruins your lines, ruins you fuel pumps, destroys your gas tank etc. I can say with 100% certainty at this point that what I've read has all been bullsmit.
I remember reading a post about Import causing the entire of a fuel tank to turn to rust......never happened to me and it was in my car for over a year. I've read about E85 ruining the pumps, rust, rubber deteriorating and such, also hasn't happened to me.
What this tells me is either other fuel systems are being built using poor quality parts or the user is not making sure he is putting quality fuel in his tank. You can put water in fuel and expect things not to rust and I think that's been the case in some of these threads/pictures/videos.
My car has been through the ringer with changes, experiments and testing. Many parts of it have paid the price too, like my fuel lines. Developing the double pumper and then the twin feed lines resulted in cutting some lines, then trying to replace them etc. to make the kits what we wanted them to be. I've had my pumps out of my tank more times than I can remember. All to check to see how things have held up, change something to a new idea, test a change to the system to flow more etc. All of this work has resulted in a double pumper that has powered more fast EVO's than any other and proven itself to flow enough for well over 800 hp. In my car it's ran 9.0 at 159.6 at 2950 pounds of vehicle weight, on the single stock line. In Brian's car it's gone 159.5 mph on a single stock line on E85 and has fuel left over!
Through fuel pressure testing we've found that the pressure of our system DOES NOT DROP OFF UP TOP, EVEN AT 80+ PSI OF FUEL PRESSURE AND 10,000 RPM. I think we've proven ourselves enough but for some reason that's never quite good enough for me.
After the Shootout in August of last year I decided I had enough of buying $25/gallon VP Import and put my car on E85. We did Brians about the same time. Both of us are running the ID2000cc injectors. My car broke around September sometime I think and I decided to dump E98 in the tank and let it sit to see what effects it would have on the system components.
So this week we finally pulled the car back in the shop to start the build and such for 2010. I took the fuel system apart and shot a quick video of it all.
I think after viewing this all the comments/posts and such should be solved for good. You will see the inside of the fuel tank is 100% factory new, the pumps, rubber hoses, fuel socks are all pliable, not swollen, not deteriorating or anything else.
Also, as a side note. While doing all this I decided it was time to fix my fuel lines that I had bent up/cut and repaired. For anyone who has tried to repair/replace the factory fuel lines you know it's a PITA. I took the time to do it right. I ordered SS 3/8" line and yesterday spent the entire day removing the factory feed and vent line (which I was using for the twin feed system). I then bent the SS 3/8" line like the factory original and replaced the entire line from the front to the rear. The job came out SWEET as I used all the factory mounts, clips and brackets, it's that close to stock that I could do that. Now I will run just a single line again to the front and be able to feel safer about how nice it's all done. It was getting pretty cobbled up from all the changes made in the front and rear.
I used a tubing cutter to cut the factory lines after I had them removed. Upon inspection of the inside of the lines I found them to be 100% factory fresh in appearance too, just like the inside of the gas tank that you will see in the video.
One last thing. The cobbled up mess I am describing does NOT happen to you guys as an end user with our double pumper or twin feed line kit because the home work is done and it's a bolt on simple affair.
Here's the video, enjoy:
Buschur Racing Double Pumper Video - *click*
My RS (formerly referred to as the BadBish-but everyone's copied that now so......it's just my RS to keep things straight) has run 93 octane, Q16, VP Import, E85 and E98 in it. Through the years I've seen posting of how this fuel or that fuel ruins your lines, ruins you fuel pumps, destroys your gas tank etc. I can say with 100% certainty at this point that what I've read has all been bullsmit.
I remember reading a post about Import causing the entire of a fuel tank to turn to rust......never happened to me and it was in my car for over a year. I've read about E85 ruining the pumps, rust, rubber deteriorating and such, also hasn't happened to me.
What this tells me is either other fuel systems are being built using poor quality parts or the user is not making sure he is putting quality fuel in his tank. You can put water in fuel and expect things not to rust and I think that's been the case in some of these threads/pictures/videos.
My car has been through the ringer with changes, experiments and testing. Many parts of it have paid the price too, like my fuel lines. Developing the double pumper and then the twin feed lines resulted in cutting some lines, then trying to replace them etc. to make the kits what we wanted them to be. I've had my pumps out of my tank more times than I can remember. All to check to see how things have held up, change something to a new idea, test a change to the system to flow more etc. All of this work has resulted in a double pumper that has powered more fast EVO's than any other and proven itself to flow enough for well over 800 hp. In my car it's ran 9.0 at 159.6 at 2950 pounds of vehicle weight, on the single stock line. In Brian's car it's gone 159.5 mph on a single stock line on E85 and has fuel left over!
Through fuel pressure testing we've found that the pressure of our system DOES NOT DROP OFF UP TOP, EVEN AT 80+ PSI OF FUEL PRESSURE AND 10,000 RPM. I think we've proven ourselves enough but for some reason that's never quite good enough for me.
After the Shootout in August of last year I decided I had enough of buying $25/gallon VP Import and put my car on E85. We did Brians about the same time. Both of us are running the ID2000cc injectors. My car broke around September sometime I think and I decided to dump E98 in the tank and let it sit to see what effects it would have on the system components.
So this week we finally pulled the car back in the shop to start the build and such for 2010. I took the fuel system apart and shot a quick video of it all.
I think after viewing this all the comments/posts and such should be solved for good. You will see the inside of the fuel tank is 100% factory new, the pumps, rubber hoses, fuel socks are all pliable, not swollen, not deteriorating or anything else.
Also, as a side note. While doing all this I decided it was time to fix my fuel lines that I had bent up/cut and repaired. For anyone who has tried to repair/replace the factory fuel lines you know it's a PITA. I took the time to do it right. I ordered SS 3/8" line and yesterday spent the entire day removing the factory feed and vent line (which I was using for the twin feed system). I then bent the SS 3/8" line like the factory original and replaced the entire line from the front to the rear. The job came out SWEET as I used all the factory mounts, clips and brackets, it's that close to stock that I could do that. Now I will run just a single line again to the front and be able to feel safer about how nice it's all done. It was getting pretty cobbled up from all the changes made in the front and rear.
I used a tubing cutter to cut the factory lines after I had them removed. Upon inspection of the inside of the lines I found them to be 100% factory fresh in appearance too, just like the inside of the gas tank that you will see in the video.
One last thing. The cobbled up mess I am describing does NOT happen to you guys as an end user with our double pumper or twin feed line kit because the home work is done and it's a bolt on simple affair.
Here's the video, enjoy:
Buschur Racing Double Pumper Video - *click*
I like the solution of replacing the factory hard lines with larger SS hard lines in the same locations. Solves a number of down side issues, looks neater, saves any possibility of rubber degradation from fuel interaction, and probably makes the attachment in the engine compartment more secure.
That may be the best overall concept for upgrading fuel system capacity yet...
That may be the best overall concept for upgrading fuel system capacity yet...
Replacing the factory lines is a HUGE PITA and not for the average guy. As a matter of fact the single stock line kit is the way to go and would fill 99% of EVO owners fuel demands, proven from Brians car and flow rates we've had done by Kinsler and Weldon.
I did the line replacement ONLY becuase my lines were in poor shape from all the experiments and changes.
Running both pumps all the time with a stock regulator and without drilling the siphon tube makes the idle pressure to high.
In the video I said I was going to run both pumps all the time, that is not right and doing those videos is harder to do than it seems (for me atleast). The reason I am drilling the siphon is to attempt to eliminate the spike in fuel pressure when the second pump comes on.
I did logs and posted graphs of some of that testing last year. I tried putting an aftermarket regulator on the car and it had NO effect on it at all so then I assumed it was the factory fuel return line was too small. After some though, the hole in the siphon is the actual smallest part, not the return line itself, so my thought is by drilling it, it could drop or eliminate the spike in the fuel pressure when the second pump hits.
My second pump comes on through the AEM/Haltech.
I did the line replacement ONLY becuase my lines were in poor shape from all the experiments and changes.
Running both pumps all the time with a stock regulator and without drilling the siphon tube makes the idle pressure to high.
In the video I said I was going to run both pumps all the time, that is not right and doing those videos is harder to do than it seems (for me atleast). The reason I am drilling the siphon is to attempt to eliminate the spike in fuel pressure when the second pump comes on.
I did logs and posted graphs of some of that testing last year. I tried putting an aftermarket regulator on the car and it had NO effect on it at all so then I assumed it was the factory fuel return line was too small. After some though, the hole in the siphon is the actual smallest part, not the return line itself, so my thought is by drilling it, it could drop or eliminate the spike in the fuel pressure when the second pump hits.
My second pump comes on through the AEM/Haltech.
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Drilling the siphon works on the 2Gs as well i have been told.... 
So Dave are you modifying these 255HP pumps internally somehow or are you pushing in the pressure relief valves on your pumps to get them to not drop pressure above 80psi?
So Dave are you modifying these 255HP pumps internally somehow or are you pushing in the pressure relief valves on your pumps to get them to not drop pressure above 80psi?
The alternative is to run external walboro pumps has they have no relief valve.
-James
Interesting as I've seen a couple people document damage from VP Import left in the tank.
Is the stock hardline 5/16" or 3/8"?
Also, just out of curiosity, did you used the coiled hardline or straight hardline?
I ran 1/2" aluminum hardline for fuel and 3/8" stainless for nitrous in an older project back in '02 and it was a complete PITA because the was almost impossible to make that coiled **** straight.
Is the stock hardline 5/16" or 3/8"?
Also, just out of curiosity, did you used the coiled hardline or straight hardline?
I ran 1/2" aluminum hardline for fuel and 3/8" stainless for nitrous in an older project back in '02 and it was a complete PITA because the was almost impossible to make that coiled **** straight.
I used the coiled 3/8" stainless line, it is a PITA to get straight and without the proper bender impossible to bend nicely.
I am going to try to remember tomorrow to cut and de-burr a piece of the stock line so I can get a really good OD/ID measurement on it. If you remind me I can report back on that. I think the stock feed line will probably fit inside the new line, probably.
Definetely NO damage from the Import or any other fuel in the tank of this car, as can be seen, it looks as good as new inside.
We should be starting a new thread on the RS soon and this new build. I'll post some pics of how the line came out and how it's routed.
I am going to try to remember tomorrow to cut and de-burr a piece of the stock line so I can get a really good OD/ID measurement on it. If you remind me I can report back on that. I think the stock feed line will probably fit inside the new line, probably.
Definetely NO damage from the Import or any other fuel in the tank of this car, as can be seen, it looks as good as new inside.
We should be starting a new thread on the RS soon and this new build. I'll post some pics of how the line came out and how it's routed.
Last edited by David Buschur; Feb 14, 2010 at 06:12 PM.