Don't use mobil 1, it will ruin your journal turbo
Sep 15, 2010, 07:37 AM
#31
I heard something about the different Mobil 1 a while ago. A friend of mine runs a Napa store and his dad works at Mobil. He said the regular Mobil 1 is not the same as it used to be but that the high milage Mobil 1 is actually the original full synthetic formula, or something to that effect. Never really concerned me before, but maybe i'll ask him to elaborate on the subject.
Sep 15, 2010, 07:42 AM
#32
Sep 15, 2010, 07:47 AM
#33
In other words, all the M1 15w-50 on the shelves right now the "Extended Performance" formula. But again, unless you have a shim/bucket engine (e.g. 2JZ GTE) or Chevy with a flat tappet valvetrain, it's not that big a deal.
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For those who remain confused, I'll repost:
ALL contemporary oils that carry the SM specification contain reduced ZDDP. Mobil 1 10w-30 is one such oil. This does not apply to all grades within any single brand, nor does it really affect 99% of cars on the road (including factory spec EVOs).
Avoiding oil-related issues means choosing an oil with the desired properties. This can be distilled down to three major criteria:
1) Choose an appropriate viscosity
Factory fills are chosen to satisfy longevity requirements while delivering best fuel economy, which I interpret as the lowest acceptable viscosity. If you're going to take it out and beat on it, I recommend moving from 20-30 to 40-50 respectively.
2) Choose an appropriate additive package
Best possible engine life depends upon an appropriate additive package. IMO, that means ~1200ppm ZDDP with sufficient detergents and pH stabilizers. Don't be dazzled by terms such as 'racing oil', which may not contain the additives that your engine needs. Racing engines get oil changes after every race and are rebuilt every few thousand (or less) miles. Your street engine has different needs, unless of course you're planning on frequent rebuilds.
3) Synthetic is superior
Conventional oils bring only disadvantages to the picture, and no advantages other than being cheap. Synthetics possess superior thermal stability, better resistance to chemical attack, better shear stability, etc. A better synthetic can be run for 10k miles or more with proper filtration. As for the functional difference between Group III and IV synthetics, IV has a superior cold pour point, which means if you live in a climate that gets ***-biting cold, a boutique Group IV oil is your best choice.
There is really little mystery in this. It's governed by chemistry, not black magic. And I'll venture to say that 8 out of 10 oil related failures are the fault of the user, not the oil, even if it's as simple as choosing the wrong viscosity.
Last edited by Ted B; Sep 15, 2010 at 07:49 AM.
Sep 15, 2010, 07:50 AM
#34
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Honestly i think its the materials, user= anything. you can get them cheaper from else where but it'll have its different effects and reliabilty. especially when companies claim they make their material by themselves. I doubt its the viscosity because they need to be as precise. especially when their a big company. you would think that they'll have a machine that calculates to the mil. We test our adhesive at intervals, either it'll climbs up or go down. at the end it looks like a dyno sheet, varrying from room temp, adhesive temp, viscosity, shear viscosity, rpm to measure. Now with their machine i'd hope they have something that would read a bunch of other things. their hasnt been a good enough reason not to still use it in our everyday car.
this reminds me like when the big macs use to be big. all the sudden they just got smaller. also like when the fish filet from BK was a whopper size now its only a jr whopper size. <--This i know this for a fact because it happened to me.
this reminds me like when the big macs use to be big. all the sudden they just got smaller. also like when the fish filet from BK was a whopper size now its only a jr whopper size. <--This i know this for a fact because it happened to me.
Last edited by downshift411; Sep 15, 2010 at 08:02 AM.
Sep 15, 2010, 08:02 AM
#36
Evolving Member
yea, cant speak for you BUILT motor guys, but im still stock except for the 35r and essential components to go along with it, pushin a nice steady 400+, been using mobil1 since day 1, and seeing how its RECOMMENDED by Mitsu Corp i'm content with it, but of course im not out draggin it or trackn it, so like i said can't speak for aftermarket motors, but i guess to each his own...
Sep 15, 2010, 08:07 AM
#37
I just remembering him telling me something about the different oil, and it was brought up here which made me remeber the conversation. It didn't really seem like a big deal then, and thanks to the info you posted Ted, it doesn't seem like a major concern now either. I'll still use Mobil 1.
Sep 15, 2010, 08:19 AM
#40
Its sorry how these thread get convoluted by opinion and more opinions.
I would venture to say that up to date the best conclusion has been given by you Ted, you spelled it how it is without talking over heads,
I would venture to say that up to date the best conclusion has been given by you Ted, you spelled it how it is without talking over heads,
No need to ask, because the facts are right here. When the progression was made from 'SL' to 'SM', Mobil created the "Extended Performance" range to continue offering certain oils in the 'SL' classification for those who specifically wanted them. Mobil has since decided to return the 15w-50 blend to the original 'SL' formulation since newer cars generally don't use that grade anyway, and that allowed them to discontinue the separate "EP" version.
In other words, all the M1 15w-50 on the shelves right now the "Extended Performance" formula. But again, unless you have a shim/bucket engine (e.g. 2JZ GTE) or Chevy with a flat tappet valvetrain, it's not that big a deal.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
For those who remain confused, I'll repost:
ALL contemporary oils that carry the SM specification contain reduced ZDDP. Mobil 1 10w-30 is one such oil. This does not apply to all grades within any single brand, nor does it really affect 99% of cars on the road (including factory spec EVOs).
Avoiding oil-related issues means choosing an oil with the desired properties. This can be distilled down to three major criteria:
1) Choose an appropriate viscosity
Factory fills are chosen to satisfy longevity requirements while delivering best fuel economy, which I interpret as the lowest acceptable viscosity. If you're going to take it out and beat on it, I recommend moving from 20-30 to 40-50 respectively.
2) Choose an appropriate additive package
Best possible engine life depends upon an appropriate additive package. IMO, that means ~1200ppm ZDDP with sufficient detergents and pH stabilizers. Don't be dazzled by terms such as 'racing oil', which may not contain the additives that your engine needs. Racing engines get oil changes after every race and are rebuilt every few thousand (or less) miles. Your street engine has different needs, unless of course you're planning on frequent rebuilds.
3) Synthetic is superior
Conventional oils bring only disadvantages to the picture, and no advantages other than being cheap. Synthetics possess superior thermal stability, better resistance to chemical attack, better shear stability, etc. A better synthetic can be run for 10k miles or more with proper filtration. As for the functional difference between Group III and IV synthetics, IV has a superior cold pour point, which means if you live in a climate that gets ***-biting cold, a boutique Group IV oil is your best choice.
There is really little mystery in this. It's governed by chemistry, not black magic. And I'll venture to say that 8 out of 10 oil related failures are the fault of the user, not the oil, even if it's as simple as choosing the wrong viscosity.
In other words, all the M1 15w-50 on the shelves right now the "Extended Performance" formula. But again, unless you have a shim/bucket engine (e.g. 2JZ GTE) or Chevy with a flat tappet valvetrain, it's not that big a deal.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
For those who remain confused, I'll repost:
ALL contemporary oils that carry the SM specification contain reduced ZDDP. Mobil 1 10w-30 is one such oil. This does not apply to all grades within any single brand, nor does it really affect 99% of cars on the road (including factory spec EVOs).
Avoiding oil-related issues means choosing an oil with the desired properties. This can be distilled down to three major criteria:
1) Choose an appropriate viscosity
Factory fills are chosen to satisfy longevity requirements while delivering best fuel economy, which I interpret as the lowest acceptable viscosity. If you're going to take it out and beat on it, I recommend moving from 20-30 to 40-50 respectively.
2) Choose an appropriate additive package
Best possible engine life depends upon an appropriate additive package. IMO, that means ~1200ppm ZDDP with sufficient detergents and pH stabilizers. Don't be dazzled by terms such as 'racing oil', which may not contain the additives that your engine needs. Racing engines get oil changes after every race and are rebuilt every few thousand (or less) miles. Your street engine has different needs, unless of course you're planning on frequent rebuilds.
3) Synthetic is superior
Conventional oils bring only disadvantages to the picture, and no advantages other than being cheap. Synthetics possess superior thermal stability, better resistance to chemical attack, better shear stability, etc. A better synthetic can be run for 10k miles or more with proper filtration. As for the functional difference between Group III and IV synthetics, IV has a superior cold pour point, which means if you live in a climate that gets ***-biting cold, a boutique Group IV oil is your best choice.
There is really little mystery in this. It's governed by chemistry, not black magic. And I'll venture to say that 8 out of 10 oil related failures are the fault of the user, not the oil, even if it's as simple as choosing the wrong viscosity.
Sep 15, 2010, 08:21 AM
#41
I am not saying it won't work or will cause issues, but it isn't the best choice for their turbos when they are being pushed.
Sep 15, 2010, 08:23 AM
#42
Would it be worth it to just use some of my remaining oil analysis sample packs that I have from Blackstone and test a few oils to see their overall detergent and additive content? I would really like some facts, also, as there is way too much speculation going on in here.
Sep 15, 2010, 08:30 AM
#43
Would it be worth it to just use some of my remaining oil analysis sample packs that I have from Blackstone and test a few oils to see their overall detergent and additive content? I would really like some facts, also, as there is way too much speculation going on in here.
i have some kits for Analyzers that i can pitch in.
its is very well know that Mobil and other oil are trying to comply more and more with the poitical agenda of GO GREEN and in order to do this zinc and phos and other additives mus be reduced, while this is not an issue for my wifes 2010 camry V6 but it is an issue for the evo running 30 psi 420whp.
Last edited by apagan01; Sep 15, 2010 at 08:35 AM.
Sep 15, 2010, 08:48 AM
#44
of course it would, it would re-proof the facts that Ted and many of us have stated for years.
i have some kits for Analyzers that i can pitch in.
its is very well know that Mobil and other oil are trying to comply more and more with the poitical agenda of GO GREEN and in order to do this zinc and phos and other additives mus be reduced, while this is not an issue for my wifes 2010 camry V6 but it is an issue for the evo running 30 psi 420whp.
i have some kits for Analyzers that i can pitch in.
its is very well know that Mobil and other oil are trying to comply more and more with the poitical agenda of GO GREEN and in order to do this zinc and phos and other additives mus be reduced, while this is not an issue for my wifes 2010 camry V6 but it is an issue for the evo running 30 psi 420whp.
By then there will be 20 more oil threads. On top of that a lot can happen in an engine in 9k.
Best advise to anyone is to run oil of your choosing in your car and send it out for UOA test. Test will tell you what's right for your car. Which can vary greatly than what is best for someone else's
There are different builders in this world that build to different tolerances. Whats good for the goose is not always good for the gander. If your running a built engine follow the builders recommendation and back that up with UOA.
Sep 15, 2010, 09:01 AM
#45
sorry my point was for higher boost engines
not stock guys, im running mobile 1 in my 05 EVO from day one with 32xxx miles never a problem.my evo x same thing with 6k miles.
once you start to boost past 28psi regular mobile 1 is no good.
I spoke to "Brian" at FP, call and tell him you want to only use mobile 1 in your fp turbo and see what he says.