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GSC vs. Supertech
so ive been doing some research lately and i keep seeing mixed reviews on a bunch of old threads. i have a brand new set of bc 280's and am getting ready to have the head PnP. my question is, do i go with the GSC single beehive springs with ti retainers and chro-molly seats or do i go with the Supertech Dual Valve spring kit. i would like to go with something that isnt going to give me a hassle down the road.
*the head is for evo ix TiA-Chris |
Either is fine. And do your self a favor and throw those BC cams as far away from your car as possible. Look in to GSC's, or cosworth's cams. Or dare i suggest it.. kelford over bc..
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lol no one is running bc's?
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More information is needed before making a decision.
*What rev are you planning to reach? |
personally i bought singles because they were fine on s3's to 11k and i didn't want to have to deal with break in on the outer springs then do a spring job again to install the inners.
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planning to rev somewhere between 8500 and 9k
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anyone else got any input? looking for someone with BC's (280's preferred) to chime in!
chris |
yea man don't get the BC's dude..
they are known for being way off time. GSC S2's for sure. |
Never heard anything bad about either set of springs. I have heard people say they have found the SuperTech Dual valve springs to be some of the most stable springs available though when used in their high rpm drag set ups. I'm not sure if GSC's were ever used in that equation though.
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BC's arent what you need
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OK so im running Cosworth M3 Cams and BC Springs and retainers. im going to be upgrading to some GSC beehive VS and Retainers with the Chro-molly Spring seats and titanium springs and retainers these are rated to 11,000RPMWhat I <3.
or i want to do the Supertech Dual spring kit that is $380. Of the two kits what one would you recommend. I will be doing a Pt6262 and reving to 9000RPM also.BTW my engine is fully built. thanks for the help Scott |
I got supertechs but if I had to do it over I would get the kiggly kit the best around!
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Originally Posted by evodude18
(Post 8718452)
so ive been doing some research lately and i keep seeing mixed reviews on a bunch of old threads. i have a brand new set of bc 280's and am getting ready to have the head PnP. my question is, do i go with the GSC single beehive springs with ti retainers and chro-molly seats or do i go with the Supertech Dual Valve spring kit. i would like to go with something that isnt going to give me a hassle down the road.
*the head is for evo ix TiA-Chris |
Originally Posted by CammedEvo
(Post 8718484)
personally i bought singles because they were fine on s3's to 11k and i didn't want to have to deal with break in on the outer springs then do a spring job again to install the inners.
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Originally Posted by evodude18
(Post 8718452)
so ive been doing some research lately and i keep seeing mixed reviews on a bunch of old threads. i have a brand new set of bc 280's and am getting ready to have the head PnP. my question is, do i go with the GSC single beehive springs with ti retainers and chro-molly seats or do i go with the Supertech Dual Valve spring kit. i would like to go with something that isnt going to give me a hassle down the road.
*the head is for evo ix TiA-Chris Supertech has 2 x beehives kits for Evo 8-9 available with different pressures. Buy the Supertech units as they are reknowned for making great and reliable products that work. |
I'll go ahead and say this. If you have a IX you had better only put GSC cams in your car! BC and HKS are the two WORST cams on the market!!! Trust me, I know. I when to a custom grind GSC and gained 150whp over my HKS 280 on same timing and less boost!!! GSC FTW. My friend only gained 6hp when he installed the BC and they woudn't idle worth a damn either.
Also don't put any springs in your car but Kiggly. They are the absolute BEST! Your car will hate you if you put anything else in it. Also when building your motor do it right the first time :D Saves you a lot of money in the long run. 1) GSC S2 2) Kiggly Springs 3) Kiggly HLA Your motor will thank you! :lol: Mikey |
Why are m3 cams so bad? iv only herd of 1 or 2 sets snaping
Originally Posted by BLKCarbonEVO
(Post 9025998)
I'll go ahead and say this. If you have a IX you had better only put GSC cams in your car! BC and HKS are the two WORST cams on the market!!! Trust me, I know. I when to a custom grind GSC and gained 150whp over my HKS 280 on same timing and less boost!!! GSC FTW. My friend only gained 6hp when he installed the BC and they woudn't idle worth a damn either.
Also don't put any springs in your car but Kiggly. They are the absolute BEST! Your car will hate you if you put anything else in it. Also when building your motor do it right the first time :D Saves you a lot of money in the long run. 1) GSC S2 2) Kiggly Springs 3) Kiggly HLA Your motor will thank you! :lol: Mikey |
Originally Posted by evoballer
(Post 9026783)
Why are m3 cams so bad? iv only herd of 1 or 2 sets snaping
I will never run anything other than GSC cams in my car and I will never recommend anything other than GSC. The only other cams that I like beside GSC are the FP Cams. Robert's and Greg's cams are very similar. :p Mikey |
Dual V-springs is old technology, beehives or Kiggly FTW. BC cams don't make power, do yourself a favor and don't install them. Maybe they would make some nice chair legs if you can't return them.
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Or you can mount them to your wall and use the "small" lobes as a coat rack behind your door :D
Mikey |
How about TOMEI PROCAM 280???
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Originally Posted by skyway69
(Post 9027139)
How about TOMEI PROCAM 280???
Mikey |
Supertech do Beehives as well :)
That's what I am about to use :) |
Originally Posted by evodude18
(Post 8718452)
so ive been doing some research lately and i keep seeing mixed reviews on a bunch of old threads. i have a brand new set of bc 280's and am getting ready to have the head PnP. my question is, do i go with the GSC single beehive springs with ti retainers and chro-molly seats or do i go with the Supertech Dual Valve spring kit. i would like to go with something that isnt going to give me a hassle down the road.
*the head is for evo ix TiA-Chris |
I would go with GSC Cams and either GSC or Kiggly beehive valve springs.
I am running GSC S2 cams and Kiggly springs in my personal car and cars in the past and have absolutely no complaints, they have always made nice power and never had valve float issues. Aside from the performance being very similar between the beehive springs and the Supertech duals I have always liked being able to use factory valve seals with the beehive springs and not having to worry about the inner and outer valve springs rubbing on each other. |
i run BR cams and Kiggly springs with no issues.
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Good info. Now I know which springs I'm going with
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Originally Posted by wizzo 8
(Post 9050212)
Good info. Now I know which springs I'm going with
Mikey |
I've been running gsc 272s with supertech springs for 30000 miles with no problem. The car put down 350 hp after the install.
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There were actually more M3 cam sets that broke than anything. The only broke IX set we saw were M3s.
aaron |
do you recommend GSC s2 for me? i have a evo9 with a bbk full with no cams and im making 385hp.. I was also thinking about getting the kiggly springs but this speed shop around my way told me that the spring rate on the kigglys were higher than the supertech and told me that it will be a noisy valvetrain.. is this true? need a little advice here.. On which cams and springs?? any advice would be greatly appreciated also im not thread jacking just didn't want to start another thread while this one already open... thanks...
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Originally Posted by BuBBasEVO
(Post 9052271)
do you recommend GSC s2 for me? i have a evo9 with a bbk full with no cams and im making 385hp.. I was also thinking about getting the kiggly springs but this speed shop around my way told me that the spring rate on the kigglys were higher than the supertech and told me that it will be a noisy valvetrain.. is this true? need a little advice here.. On which cams and springs?? any advice would be greatly appreciated also im not thread jacking just didn't want to start another thread while this one already open... thanks...
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The Kiggly valvesprings would be overkill for S2s and "normal" rpm that you would run with a stock appearing turbo. The GSC Beehives that use either the stock retainer or full replacement Ti retainer would be plenty for 385whp.
aaron |
If me, GSC springs, retainers, and no tick lifters. Leave seals alone too
As far as bc Í find the name weird |
Consider the latest info from GSC on valvespring design and use-
GSC Power-Division 4G63T Single Beehive Spring set for Evo 8/9 Click to enlarge Click to enlarge GSC Power-Division Beehive springs feature some of the most impressive manufacturing techniques in the industry. Our beehive spring uses an ovate wire which utilizes advanced material heat treatment methods for superior load loss capabilities. What this means to you is our spring has the highest level of spring load retention while still maintaining good fatigue threw out the life of the spring. Only the best materials go into the GSC Power-Division Beehive valve spring. Each batch is scrutinized for tensile strength properties, ductility, inclusion content, and fatigue toughness. The beehive valve spring shape has become the buzz lately. Some have enquired as to the benefits of a beehive spring vs the dual springs that are sold by others. While some might find that the beehive spring design is new it has been used commonly in many OE engines as well as in all of the NASCAR and F1 engines of today. Why? The beehive shape is more stable than standard single or dual cylindrical springs. The beehive design which incorporates an ovate wire is more than capable of the performance demands that were previously only matched by a Dual Springs. With the smaller and lighter retainer used on the beehive valve spring allow for higher RPM and more valve control. So beehive valve springs, with there lighter weight retainers allow for engine's to rev quicker and maintain a more stable valve motion than the traditional cylindrical springs of yesteryear. Beehive Spring Benefits: * Rev faster * Lighter components * More durable design * Less stress on valvetrain components * Lower spring frequency for more precise valve control. * More valve control equals more aggressive cam profiles * All of these items help to return more power for you to enjoy! The GSC 5039 Beehive spring is a factory replacement and will use your stock OEM retainer and valve seat to ensure an easy and inexpensive upgrade for your upgraded camshafts. 5039 Beehive spring pressure: * 1.56"=68 lbs /.300" =160lbs / .400"=190lbs / .450"=210lbs / .625"= Coil bind. 5039 Beehive Rev and Boost range (using an S2 profile camshaft set) * Max RPM: 9000 * Max boost: 30psi 5039 Beehive Max lift * Do to stock retainer max lift is 11.3mm at the valve or .259" cam lobe lift. |
Why do they recomend limiting max boost to only 30 psi. I was running 33 psi on S2's with my stock springs!
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Originally Posted by Silk
(Post 9062556)
Why do they recomend limiting max boost to only 30 psi. I was running 33 psi on S2's with my stock springs!
aaron |
Originally Posted by BLKCarbonEVO
(Post 9025998)
I'll go ahead and say this. If you have a IX you had better only put GSC cams in your car! BC and HKS are the two WORST cams on the market!!! Trust me, I know. I when to a custom grind GSC and gained 150whp over my HKS 280 on same timing and less boost!!! GSC FTW. My friend only gained 6hp when he installed the BC and they woudn't idle worth a damn either.
Also don't put any springs in your car but Kiggly. They are the absolute BEST! Your car will hate you if you put anything else in it. Also when building your motor do it right the first time :D Saves you a lot of money in the long run. 1) GSC S2 2) Kiggly Springs 3) Kiggly HLA Your motor will thank you! :lol: Mikey |
Originally Posted by bac
(Post 10683806)
Brilliant post going with GSC S2 cams, what I want to know, if I run the kiggly springs do I pair it with the stock oem retainers?
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Ok cool thanks :). If going with the gsc springs I notice they give 2 options, they sell just the beehive springs alone and springs+retainers. If I purchase just springs alone will it be fine to pair up with the stock retainers, and run the S2 cams?
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There are 3 options actually.
Springs with stock retainers (5039) Springs with Ti retainers (5040) HD Springs with Ti retainers (5041) I have seen a few stock retainers fail at high rpm so we no longer sell "just" the spring. The extra $170 is worth it compared to a potential $5000 for a motor. |
Gsc 5041 hi rev spring are back ordered so I cancelled my order after waiting a whole month for a shipout date, I'm going to go with kiggly now and add the hla in on the order.
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Originally Posted by bac
(Post 10683992)
Ok cool thanks :). If going with the gsc springs I notice they give 2 options, they sell just the beehive springs alone and springs+retainers. If I purchase just springs alone will it be fine to pair up with the stock retainers, and run the S2 cams?
i run the S2s with beehive springs and stock retainers and have no problems what so ever for 4000 plus miles. but im still on stock block so i dont rev it much past 7k. and they fit great. i love my S2s! plus the idle lope is sick with great all around gains{thumbup} |
Originally Posted by JohnBradley
(Post 10684433)
There are 3 options actually.
Springs with stock retainers (5039) Springs with Ti retainers (5040) HD Springs with Ti retainers (5041) I have seen a few stock retainers fail at high rpm so we no longer sell "just" the spring. The extra $170 is worth it compared to a potential $5000 for a motor. I will also add that we batch our springs according to spring rate for the individual spring, so every bag has the exact same spring rate in every spring. Consistency is key with valvetrain! {thumbup} |
Originally Posted by JohnBradley
(Post 10684433)
There are 3 options actually.
Springs with stock retainers (5039) Springs with Ti retainers (5040) HD Springs with Ti retainers (5041) I have seen a few stock retainers fail at high rpm so we no longer sell "just" the spring. The extra $170 is worth it compared to a potential $5000 for a motor. |
With the current issues I'm having with possible valve float issues and since my head is a few yrs old (3-4yrs old) I will be moving over to the Kiggly Beehives.
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