Any Vendors still developing things for our cars?
I dont want to have full open ducting on a weekend warroir dd car. I like the fact that these can stay on the car and only turned on when needed.
The lighter track car with st-40's and full ams ducting along with some additional custom ducting,is still getting bad brake fade and not able to handle a 20 min lapping session without fade. I could enquire more as to pad pedal or fluid but the end problem is heat.
450$ isn't much when the ams kit with no fans will run you more than that.
The lighter track car with st-40's and full ams ducting along with some additional custom ducting,is still getting bad brake fade and not able to handle a 20 min lapping session without fade. I could enquire more as to pad pedal or fluid but the end problem is heat.
450$ isn't much when the ams kit with no fans will run you more than that.
How was it "not cutting it" what was his problem? Were the rotors getting too hot? Green fade on the pads? Was his fluid boiling?
My basic feeling is that if the car is moving so slow that you need a fan to cool the brakes, then there's not enough heat going into them to need the airflow.
If a ducting solution alone is not working to keep the brake rotors cool, then do like the supercar V8 and WRX guys do at higher speeds, mist water into the cooling ducts or (as some do), directly into the center of the rotor.
The reason the kit for the GTR was made, was because the GTR has inadequate brake cooling for track usage, and not enough space to put in proper sized cooling ducts with the factory undertray. As GTR owners are not fans of cutting factory items on their $100K toy, they look for overly complex solutions like this $450 pair of $40 bildge fans, and associated hardware.
My basic feeling is that if the car is moving so slow that you need a fan to cool the brakes, then there's not enough heat going into them to need the airflow.
If a ducting solution alone is not working to keep the brake rotors cool, then do like the supercar V8 and WRX guys do at higher speeds, mist water into the cooling ducts or (as some do), directly into the center of the rotor.
The reason the kit for the GTR was made, was because the GTR has inadequate brake cooling for track usage, and not enough space to put in proper sized cooling ducts with the factory undertray. As GTR owners are not fans of cutting factory items on their $100K toy, they look for overly complex solutions like this $450 pair of $40 bildge fans, and associated hardware.
2. Plenty of other people have made the points I'd be making... but running a fan kit on a brake cooling system seems gimmicky.
The bottom line is that you can either have a track car, or a street car. This has always been the case.
Other logical comments I'd make would be to consider...
1. Racing isn't about being the fastest (necessarily), it's about getting the most out of your chosen platform. If you are having issues with fade, then perhaps consider altering your racing methods. If your pal is having issues with fade... then use that as a resource and inquire about his driving methods, and setup. No need to pop in here talking about people that are trying to help negatively.
2. You can quite easily add any of those fans if you think they'd actually help (I HIGHLY doubt based on PHYSICS, that they would).
3. If you're looking for a logical, and more intrusive solution to brake cooling, aside from running dryer hose appropriately... I'd suggest:
1. Buying a set of wheels with proper aerodynamics.
2. Cutting NACA ducts into your bumper/fender/hood/whatever you desire.
3. Investigate alternatives to your current setup, as there're likely alternative options... of course all with their own set of pros and cons.
Seems to work for the gtr's and the evo that is at ER.
My goal is to have the most stock looking dual purpose car possible. At this point it doesn't look like any ducts unless made out of metal could have fans easily attached to them
Of course seeing this thread https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ev...tang-dyno.html
Have similar spool to my 3076 isn't going to help my brakes but it sure makes me wonder if you could road race a 6466 now lol.
My goal is to have the most stock looking dual purpose car possible. At this point it doesn't look like any ducts unless made out of metal could have fans easily attached to them
Of course seeing this thread https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ev...tang-dyno.html
Have similar spool to my 3076 isn't going to help my brakes but it sure makes me wonder if you could road race a 6466 now lol.
1. I definitely clicked it.
2. Plenty of other people have made the points I'd be making... but running a fan kit on a brake cooling system seems gimmicky.
The bottom line is that you can either have a track car, or a street car. This has always been the case.
Other logical comments I'd make would be to consider...
1. Racing isn't about being the fastest (necessarily), it's about getting the most out of your chosen platform. If you are having issues with fade, then perhaps consider altering your racing methods. If your pal is having issues with fade... then use that as a resource and inquire about his driving methods, and setup. No need to pop in here talking about people that are trying to help negatively.
2. You can quite easily add any of those fans if you think they'd actually help (I HIGHLY doubt based on PHYSICS, that they would).
3. If you're looking for a logical, and more intrusive solution to brake cooling, aside from running dryer hose appropriately... I'd suggest:
1. Buying a set of wheels with proper aerodynamics.
2. Cutting NACA ducts into your bumper/fender/hood/whatever you desire.
3. Investigate alternatives to your current setup, as there're likely alternative options... of course all with their own set of pros and cons.
2. Plenty of other people have made the points I'd be making... but running a fan kit on a brake cooling system seems gimmicky.
The bottom line is that you can either have a track car, or a street car. This has always been the case.
Other logical comments I'd make would be to consider...
1. Racing isn't about being the fastest (necessarily), it's about getting the most out of your chosen platform. If you are having issues with fade, then perhaps consider altering your racing methods. If your pal is having issues with fade... then use that as a resource and inquire about his driving methods, and setup. No need to pop in here talking about people that are trying to help negatively.
2. You can quite easily add any of those fans if you think they'd actually help (I HIGHLY doubt based on PHYSICS, that they would).
3. If you're looking for a logical, and more intrusive solution to brake cooling, aside from running dryer hose appropriately... I'd suggest:
1. Buying a set of wheels with proper aerodynamics.
2. Cutting NACA ducts into your bumper/fender/hood/whatever you desire.
3. Investigate alternatives to your current setup, as there're likely alternative options... of course all with their own set of pros and cons.
ive street driven with brake ducts for over a year now. you cant tell they are on the car, and there are no issues.
i highly doubt you will find fans that can move as much air as a tube ducted to the front of the bumper. i couldnt even fade my brakes before i added ducting and certainly not since its been added. i really think you need to reassess your setup.
i highly doubt you will find fans that can move as much air as a tube ducted to the front of the bumper. i couldnt even fade my brakes before i added ducting and certainly not since its been added. i really think you need to reassess your setup.
I've got double your power and I can fade the factory brakes with 2-3 back to back passes of 0-100-5 stops. If you couldn't fade your ducting before why would it help you any now?
Ti backing plates , giro disc rotors.
Ti backing plates , giro disc rotors.
ive street driven with brake ducts for over a year now. you cant tell they are on the car, and there are no issues.
i highly doubt you will find fans that can move as much air as a tube ducted to the front of the bumper. i couldnt even fade my brakes before i added ducting and certainly not since its been added. i really think you need to reassess your setup.
i highly doubt you will find fans that can move as much air as a tube ducted to the front of the bumper. i couldnt even fade my brakes before i added ducting and certainly not since its been added. i really think you need to reassess your setup.
Last edited by Grimgrak; Jan 28, 2014 at 07:23 PM.
FYI - Excluding friction @ 40 mph a 2" duct (AMS size) would theoretically produce 77 CFM, @ 80 mph it would be 154 CFM. You're going to need a large bilge blower to move that kind of air. A bilge blower will also be a restriction to flow at higher speeds.
What pad compound are you running?
What fluid compound are you running?
How are your brakes fading? Fluid boiling? green fade?
Cooling ducts/fans alone will not stop the fade from back to back 100-zero stops, if your pad compound is not correct for your application, or if your fluid is boiling.
horsepower has absolutely NOTHING to do with fading brakes fyi. if thats your thought i suggest you do a little more research.
i added ducting for testing purposes/precautiuon and because i changed back to a straight vaned rotor as well as a new pad. i actually wind up closing off the ducts a lot unless ambient temps are in the 80ish range because prior to that i can't heat the pads to optimum on the tracks i run.
ti backing paltes are a band aid imho and can actually cause some problems. i forgot to mention im running the racing brake stainless pistons now.
to add even more fuel to the fire, i know two very fast evo drivers (400whp range, 3000lbs, NASA TT top competitive cars) that have never and will never run ducting, and run just racing brake two piece rotors with racing brake pads.
On a car that weighs 500lbs less with st40's with 100whp less power on pfc01's I will overheat in two laps, with no ducts. Motul fluid etc.
This car will only be worse with more power and weight.
What causes brake fade/fluid boiling/ whatever green fade is.....? The answer is HEAT. I need to get rid of heat without hacking holes in my car... Same conclusion the guys racing big rigs came too, however they are spraying water to keep the brakes cool and I dont want to worry about more fluids therefore I want to stay with air.
This car will only be worse with more power and weight.
What causes brake fade/fluid boiling/ whatever green fade is.....? The answer is HEAT. I need to get rid of heat without hacking holes in my car... Same conclusion the guys racing big rigs came too, however they are spraying water to keep the brakes cool and I dont want to worry about more fluids therefore I want to stay with air.
I agree with others here that you need to re-evaluate your setup...
What pad compound are you running?
What fluid compound are you running?
How are your brakes fading? Fluid boiling? green fade?
Cooling ducts/fans alone will not stop the fade from back to back 100-zero stops, if your pad compound is not correct for your application, or if your fluid is boiling.
What pad compound are you running?
What fluid compound are you running?
How are your brakes fading? Fluid boiling? green fade?
Cooling ducts/fans alone will not stop the fade from back to back 100-zero stops, if your pad compound is not correct for your application, or if your fluid is boiling.
I think maybe its your driving style that's overheating the brakes, if that is in fact what your doing. I have minor weight reduction, stock rotors, track pads, No ducting, Brembo LCF600 fluid. I Had no issues with brake fade with this setup. The last time I ran this setup the car was also doing back to back sessions pretty much, so it wasn't getting much downtime. Maybe you have something mechanical going on that makes it seem like brakes are fading
On a car that weighs 500lbs less with st40's with 100whp less power on pfc01's I will overheat in two laps, with no ducts. Motul fluid etc.
This car will only be worse with more power and weight.
What causes brake fade/fluid boiling/ whatever green fade is.....? The answer is HEAT. I need to get rid of heat without hacking holes in my car... Same conclusion the guys racing big rigs came too, however they are spraying water to keep the brakes cool and I dont want to worry about more fluids therefore I want to stay with air.
This car will only be worse with more power and weight.
What causes brake fade/fluid boiling/ whatever green fade is.....? The answer is HEAT. I need to get rid of heat without hacking holes in my car... Same conclusion the guys racing big rigs came too, however they are spraying water to keep the brakes cool and I dont want to worry about more fluids therefore I want to stay with air.
Also, was there any data showing the bilge pumps helping with the fade? I could see them functioning as cooling when the vehicle was stopped, or going VERY slow, but at speed... it doesn't seem logical (sorry if you posted... I'm just getting over the flu here... refresh my memory).