oil squirters
Sep 12, 2016, 04:56 PM
#1
oil squirters
Hello Everyone,
Unfortunately i blew my evo 9 motor. I got a 4g64 Block that i will be building soon. My question is is running the oil squirters really necessary? I called few shops and some say they put them in and some say they don't. So i am confused. My tuner is telling me to put them in but my engine builder is saying you don't need them since the car that the block came out of didn't have it and that your'e running stronger internals anyway. I've been looking at every threat regarding the 64 Built but no one really touches on the oil squirters. can you guys please help
me figure the situation out please i really need to fix my car. Thanks in advance.
Boost on
Unfortunately i blew my evo 9 motor. I got a 4g64 Block that i will be building soon. My question is is running the oil squirters really necessary? I called few shops and some say they put them in and some say they don't. So i am confused. My tuner is telling me to put them in but my engine builder is saying you don't need them since the car that the block came out of didn't have it and that your'e running stronger internals anyway. I've been looking at every threat regarding the 64 Built but no one really touches on the oil squirters. can you guys please help
me figure the situation out please i really need to fix my car. Thanks in advance.Boost on
Sep 12, 2016, 08:43 PM
#4
EvoM Guru
iTrader: (1)
Forged aluminum pistons + boost. Yes, you definitely need them. That jet of oil is what cools the pistons, it's rather vital.
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zen311 (Sep 14, 2016)
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Sep 14, 2016, 12:54 PM
#8
When I built my 2.4L I never used them. Oil squirters are there to cool the pistons as stated. When you switched to forged internals they are not needed.
Many will argue, "well it keeps the piston cooler". Yes that is a fact.
My point being, at what temp does your piston start to fatigue? How much cooling do squirters actually cool down the piston? When you figure that out you will realize they are not needed.
Your pistons will not reach its "fatigue" limit if you choose not to run squirters.
Now is there a benefit of taking them away? Yes. A failure mode is taken away.
What if I keep them? Yes they will cool your pistons, but do they truly need it?
My 2 cents
Many will argue, "well it keeps the piston cooler". Yes that is a fact.
My point being, at what temp does your piston start to fatigue? How much cooling do squirters actually cool down the piston? When you figure that out you will realize they are not needed.
Your pistons will not reach its "fatigue" limit if you choose not to run squirters.
Now is there a benefit of taking them away? Yes. A failure mode is taken away.
What if I keep them? Yes they will cool your pistons, but do they truly need it?
My 2 cents
Last edited by lancerrally45; Sep 14, 2016 at 01:01 PM.
Sep 14, 2016, 04:50 PM
#9
I feel like there is some DSM-mentality in the Evo community. A lot of DSMers (no disrespect intended, although some may take it that way) will do what "works" even though it may not be ideal.
For example, some people build engines only using plastigauges. From a real engine building perspective, that's a no-no. But that doesn't mean it can't be done.
Mitsubishi designed the Evo with oil squirters. It's a good insurance policy. If a 2.4 block had come with a turbo from the factory, it would have oil squirters in it.
So, you can cut a corner if you want to...but you really shouldn't.
Lesco Race Engines has a program set up to CNC the 4G64 block for oil squirters. THey're not cheap though. Someone else may be able to do it, though.
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ev...work-pics.html
For example, some people build engines only using plastigauges. From a real engine building perspective, that's a no-no. But that doesn't mean it can't be done.
Mitsubishi designed the Evo with oil squirters. It's a good insurance policy. If a 2.4 block had come with a turbo from the factory, it would have oil squirters in it.
So, you can cut a corner if you want to...but you really shouldn't.
Lesco Race Engines has a program set up to CNC the 4G64 block for oil squirters. THey're not cheap though. Someone else may be able to do it, though.
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ev...work-pics.html
Sep 14, 2016, 05:59 PM
#10
I feel like there is some DSM-mentality in the Evo community. A lot of DSMers (no disrespect intended, although some may take it that way) will do what "works" even though it may not be ideal.
For example, some people build engines only using plastigauges. From a real engine building perspective, that's a no-no. But that doesn't mean it can't be done.
Mitsubishi designed the Evo with oil squirters. It's a good insurance policy. If a 2.4 block had come with a turbo from the factory, it would have oil squirters in it.
So, you can cut a corner if you want to...but you really shouldn't.
Lesco Race Engines has a program set up to CNC the 4G64 block for oil squirters. THey're not cheap though. Someone else may be able to do it, though.
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ev...work-pics.html
For example, some people build engines only using plastigauges. From a real engine building perspective, that's a no-no. But that doesn't mean it can't be done.
Mitsubishi designed the Evo with oil squirters. It's a good insurance policy. If a 2.4 block had come with a turbo from the factory, it would have oil squirters in it.
So, you can cut a corner if you want to...but you really shouldn't.
Lesco Race Engines has a program set up to CNC the 4G64 block for oil squirters. THey're not cheap though. Someone else may be able to do it, though.
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ev...work-pics.html
is there anybody else besides them that does the oil squirters in CA?Thanks everyone. Keep the info flowing I need my car fixed soon.
Sep 15, 2016, 07:07 AM
#12
Like I stated, its dependent on the material the piston is made out of. Most OEMs will not use forged pistons due to piston slap. Hint: We are putting forged pistons in. Would you think forge pistons act differently then cast pistons? The answer is yes, they do act differently. They can withstand more heat/load.
Sep 15, 2016, 09:14 AM
#13
I could say the same thing. If you're not an engineer from Mitsubishi, then you can't say they wouldn't. They put them in the Evo. If the 2.4 engine was in a car with similar build specs to the Evo, I'm pretty sure they'd be there too.
But hey, save a few bucks and don't put oil squirters in. As they say in Thailand...up to you.
But hey, save a few bucks and don't put oil squirters in. As they say in Thailand...up to you.
Sep 15, 2016, 09:21 AM
#14
I could say the same thing. If you're not an engineer from Mitsubishi, then you can't say they wouldn't. They put them in the Evo. If the 2.4 engine was in a car with similar build specs to the Evo, I'm pretty sure they'd be there too.
But hey, save a few bucks and don't put oil squirters in. As they say in Thailand...up to you.
But hey, save a few bucks and don't put oil squirters in. As they say in Thailand...up to you.
Yes you would be correct, then they would probably have the squirters.
But if they put forged pistons in...
Going back to my original point, it all comes down to the material of the piston and how its made.
This is coming from someone who is a release engineer for powertrain at an OEM.
Sep 15, 2016, 10:18 PM
#15
Evolved Member
The automaker can and will do the research to establish exactly how the stock cast piston expands. If it isn't what they desire, they change the mold until they have a satisfactory result.
When an owner pops the stock engine and goes about constructing a “built” engine they want forged pistons to make a ton of horsepower. However, the oil cooler has been contaminated – do they really need it and the block selected doesn't have oil squirters - do they really need them?
No aftermarket seller of pistons can do the research the automaker does. So they recommend loose fitting pistons. Fit them too loose and burn oil or too tight and scuff cylinders or break lands.
So, my take on this is the oil cooler and oil squiters are just insurance that will hopefully keep you out of trouble. Some people buy insurance and some don't.
When an owner pops the stock engine and goes about constructing a “built” engine they want forged pistons to make a ton of horsepower. However, the oil cooler has been contaminated – do they really need it and the block selected doesn't have oil squirters - do they really need them?
No aftermarket seller of pistons can do the research the automaker does. So they recommend loose fitting pistons. Fit them too loose and burn oil or too tight and scuff cylinders or break lands.
So, my take on this is the oil cooler and oil squiters are just insurance that will hopefully keep you out of trouble. Some people buy insurance and some don't.