2006EvoIXer

iTrader: (1)

Trust me, we are trying to learn. I think it's the language barrier that we don't follow.

Evo8cy

OK very last post, but no matter what questions you post, that's it, you'll have to answer them for your self, as I have other things to do lol.

The fact that the engine will keep running through the alternator when the battery is disconnected does not cancel out what I said. The alternator is the electrical heart of the car and the battery is its regulator, It is the battery that grounds things and creates the proper safe route for the loop. If you disconnect it, the remaining voltage of the 50KV, will find other passages to the ground and mainly through the alternator and not only, damaging parts along the way.Your battery does more than just provide electricity. It also shorts any AC spikes and transients to ground. Removing the battery from the circuit allows those spikes and transients to travel around, endangering every semiconductor circuit in your car. If there is no regulator the alternator will be working at 100% load and very soon it will fry, not only that because the loop will not close through the battery, then any electronic device on the car will be damaged, if it is not the first time you do it, it will be the second or the third. Most electronic devices on the car have their own regulator, so does the alternator but that is not enough, the battery is what does most of the work.




About the coils, do some searching of your own, you will find that there are certain type of coils that created a closed loop inside the coil pack in association to the harness and ecu of a specific car.












Marios

RightSaid fred

The secondary circuit is actually completed by multiple paths, anything and everything which is connected to both 12 and earth and turned on.....if the lights are on then some of the current will go through the lights.
You can run an engine with just a battery, no alternator and no accessories, in that case the only path is through the battery.
In the case of no battery and just an alternator , it goes through the alternator.


So purely from a tech point of view a wasted spark ignition is always best, just from the fact that it doesn't add unwanted noise to the entire electrical system.
But it's not the only advantage.

You'll never see more than about 35 to 40 KV either, certainly not 50KV unless you've got a really tricked up ignition like mine which puts out a max of about 80KV.




That's a test circuit for bench testing any coil.
Q2 turns off to make the spark, the secondary circuit is completed through the battery. It can't be completed through a capacitor because capacitors block DC.Nor through Q2 because it's off.


That one looks like a factory mitsubishi COP type same as used in GDI engines. The secondary circuit is the same, through the battery because the capacitor is to block DC. Those coils are extremely unreliable, they fail due to insulation breakdown and spark internally. That's the second reason why going from wasted spark to COP is a downgrade.The zener diode in the secondary circuit is to prevent it sparking prematurely and the beginning of dwell when it makes about 1Kv.

SIM08U

wow looks like its much easier to buy these brand kits brand new lol

2006EvoIXer

iTrader: (1)

It's fairly easy to do the wiring. Cutting the plate is the real challenge. Lol

Biggiesacks

Im gonna try and model this up in ltspice and see whats up. What would you say the purpose of that capacitor in the diagram is for then?

2006EvoIXer

iTrader: (1)

My guess is to help the primary coil kick up faster so it can have enough for at least a small spark.

RightSaid fred

It's to reduce the noise that's put into the electrical system. Helps soak up the spikes.

2006EvoIXer

iTrader: (1)

Found the answer to your capacitor question. It is to protect the switching circuit. Video explains at the end.

Biggiesacks

oh nice, lets contain the fire in here. I have been doing plenty of research here on caps and I still stand by what i was claiming before on that cap. Yes it is protecting the switching circuit but its also a path for that spark. As far as capacitors blocking dc, I believe that's an incomplete statement, they block constant dc. A high frequency high voltage pulse however is not constant dc. Yes the capacitor is protecting the switching circuit, by providing that clean return path.

As far as the other coils without that cap, its always going to be about the path of least resistance, and i'll stick with the alternator being that path, maybe if the alternator wasn't there then the battery. The diode rectifier in the alternator has got to have like an order of magnitude less ESR then the battery.

Said another way, that cap, the diode rectifier, and the battery are all in series with that coil. The one with the lowest ESR wins.

The cap keeps noise off the system by being that path, so that the "noise" aka high voltage high frequency pulse doesn't go through the system. Make sense?

2006EvoIXer

iTrader: (1)

Check out where the spark goes. Notice there is a wire connecting the coil shell to the Positive terminal. So how is the secondary voltage getting back to seconday winding/coil?

2006EvoIXer

iTrader: (1)

But look at his schematic.

2006EvoIXer

iTrader: (1)

Alternator is more likely than lead-acid battery.
Could you imagine if 30,000 volts can go through the battery? To get back to coil, would it go through ECM? I doubt the ECM will survive that. Or any other electronics that it can travel through. It just doesn't make sense. Let's keep this discussion logical and not full of claims. And I don't buy that spark is 30,000V at spark plug and then it changes to 12V (or some other voltage) as it goes through the battery.

WelDun1

How did this Thread turn into a Electrical Theory thread? LoL
I have a question concerning a DIY kit. Does anyone have a pn on the Mitsu Male Coil Connector? Im under the impression that it is an OEM connector for other sensors etc on other model Mitsubishis. Any confirm this or a pn?
Yes i know i can get them on SpoolinUp & JD Customs as well as a few other sites, but it would be a lot more convenient if i can cut it off of another harness.

2006EvoIXer

iTrader: (1)

I'm not sure you can buy it separate from the coil. I haven't found it on a harness. Spoolinup was where I ended up buying from.