eBay brakes and rotors, good idea or not??
Dec 3, 2008, 11:36 AM
#16
Bald tires, pads, and how you use the brake pedal go a long way. Its called threshold braking. Braking to the point of locking up or engaging ABS. Lots of use just pull the ABS fuse. I run with the ABS working still - took some more effort to find the sweet spot. Even on the track doing 140-80 I do not engage the ABS.
Having good tires and pads though really is a safety feature - fix that.
Having good tires and pads though really is a safety feature - fix that.
Dec 3, 2008, 12:07 PM
#17
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well that was just a silly guess. my tires arent that bad, still on OEM advans (just some camber wear in the back), and the pads are still Ok, just checked em out at the shop, looked like couple more thousand miles of life left in them...
im just guessing, trying to figure out why my braking isnt what its supposed to be - abs engages way too much and too often, and hence i get longer stopping distances.
Or maybe im just making all this up, who knows. i guess until i drive another IX to compare, how would i even know whats normal and whats not? im comparing the Evo to my other cars, which may be wrong to begin with
im just guessing, trying to figure out why my braking isnt what its supposed to be - abs engages way too much and too often, and hence i get longer stopping distances.
Or maybe im just making all this up, who knows. i guess until i drive another IX to compare, how would i even know whats normal and whats not? im comparing the Evo to my other cars, which may be wrong to begin with
Dec 3, 2008, 02:24 PM
#18
ABS sensors do fail. Having the system checked out could be helpful.
Have you tired pulling the ABS fuse to see how the car brakes then?
AND if still on the stock tires - they have a sticker: DO NOT USE UNDER 32F (or something close to freezing). So now that winter temps are here they are not going to stick. Which will increase braking times and ABS engagement.
Have you tired pulling the ABS fuse to see how the car brakes then?
AND if still on the stock tires - they have a sticker: DO NOT USE UNDER 32F (or something close to freezing). So now that winter temps are here they are not going to stick. Which will increase braking times and ABS engagement.
Dec 3, 2008, 03:23 PM
#19
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kick me while im down!! i been trying to buy a cheap set of winters, or at least allseasons forever... and i aint dishing out $500-700 on a winter set just to be used for the 1.5 days it will actually snow here in NYC this year
Dec 3, 2008, 08:56 PM
#21
well that was just a silly guess. my tires arent that bad, still on OEM advans (just some camber wear in the back), and the pads are still Ok, just checked em out at the shop, looked like couple more thousand miles of life left in them...
im just guessing, trying to figure out why my braking isnt what its supposed to be - abs engages way too much and too often, and hence i get longer stopping distances.
Or maybe im just making all this up, who knows. i guess until i drive another IX to compare, how would i even know whats normal and whats not? im comparing the Evo to my other cars, which may be wrong to begin with
im just guessing, trying to figure out why my braking isnt what its supposed to be - abs engages way too much and too often, and hence i get longer stopping distances.
Or maybe im just making all this up, who knows. i guess until i drive another IX to compare, how would i even know whats normal and whats not? im comparing the Evo to my other cars, which may be wrong to begin with
Just to give you a heads up, its important to remember that brakes dont slow down the car, tires do. Brakes slow down the wheels, the tires slow down the car.
If your pads are not worn out, your rotors are not warped or damaged, and your pedal feels strong (no air in the lines or leaks) then the problem is not your brakes it is your tires.
The AO46's that come stock on evos do not work in cold weather. If its around freezing and there is even without snow, the compound will be too hard to get a grip on the road as it was meant to. Winter/all season tires need to be malleable to get a grip on cold *** road surface (even without snow or ice) when they have no heat in them.
ABS kickin in early means that your car brakes and ABS system are probably fine, and are detecting slippages of the tires due to lack of traction, mostl likely due to
1) too cold for tires optimal operating range (if there is any snow around its WAY to cold for AO46s)
2) your tires are worn out either to close to the wear bars, OR you have uneven wear due to alignment issues that is causing less than optimal grip on hard brakes. The instant a tires starts to lock up the ABS kicks in and that's it.
In the dry on a warm day, you should be able to stand heavily on the brakes and only get ABS at the limit of very hard braking. Threshold braking is an advanced technique of working the brakes to just before the limit of adhesion so as to avoid ABS, but its more of a track technique than a street one. Not so safe when there are cars piled up at a stoplight an you go barrelling in at 65 and find some ice up there...
My advice woudl be:
1) make sure your pads/rotors are fine and make sure you dont have any air or leaks in your break lines - that means your brakes are probably fine
2) check for uneven tire wear that could have a big impact under hard braking.
3) if its cold out where u are, and you want to be able to use those powerful brakes more of the time, get some all seasons, or if there is actually snow/ice on the road, get some winter tires. {thumbup**
Last edited by ktk; Dec 3, 2008 at 09:06 PM.
Dec 3, 2008, 09:37 PM
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Just to give you a heads up, its important to remember that brakes dont slow down the car, tires do. Brakes slow down the wheels, the tires slow down the car.
If your pads are not worn out, your rotors are not warped or damaged, and your pedal feels strong (no air in the lines or leaks) then the problem is not your brakes it is your tires.
The AO46's that come stock on evos do not work in cold weather. If its around freezing and there is even without snow, the compound will be too hard to get a grip on the road as it was meant to. Winter/all season tires need to be malleable to get a grip on cold *** road surface (even without snow or ice) when they have no heat in them.
ABS kickin in early means that your car brakes and ABS system are probably fine, and are detecting slippages of the tires due to lack of traction, mostl likely due to
1) too cold for tires optimal operating range (if there is any snow around its WAY to cold for AO46s)
2) your tires are worn out either to close to the wear bars, OR you have uneven wear due to alignment issues that is causing less than optimal grip on hard brakes. The instant a tires starts to lock up the ABS kicks in and that's it.
In the dry on a warm day, you should be able to stand heavily on the brakes and only get ABS at the limit of very hard braking. Threshold braking is an advanced technique of working the brakes to just before the limit of adhesion so as to avoid ABS, but its more of a track technique than a street one. Not so safe when there are cars piled up at a stoplight an you go barrelling in at 65 and find some ice up there...
My advice woudl be:
1) make sure your pads/rotors are fine and make sure you dont have any air or leaks in your break lines - that means your brakes are probably fine
2) check for uneven tire wear that could have a big impact under hard braking.
3) if its cold out where u are, and you want to be able to use those powerful brakes more of the time, get some all seasons, or if there is actually snow/ice on the road, get some winter tires. {thumbup**
If your pads are not worn out, your rotors are not warped or damaged, and your pedal feels strong (no air in the lines or leaks) then the problem is not your brakes it is your tires.
The AO46's that come stock on evos do not work in cold weather. If its around freezing and there is even without snow, the compound will be too hard to get a grip on the road as it was meant to. Winter/all season tires need to be malleable to get a grip on cold *** road surface (even without snow or ice) when they have no heat in them.
ABS kickin in early means that your car brakes and ABS system are probably fine, and are detecting slippages of the tires due to lack of traction, mostl likely due to
1) too cold for tires optimal operating range (if there is any snow around its WAY to cold for AO46s)
2) your tires are worn out either to close to the wear bars, OR you have uneven wear due to alignment issues that is causing less than optimal grip on hard brakes. The instant a tires starts to lock up the ABS kicks in and that's it.
In the dry on a warm day, you should be able to stand heavily on the brakes and only get ABS at the limit of very hard braking. Threshold braking is an advanced technique of working the brakes to just before the limit of adhesion so as to avoid ABS, but its more of a track technique than a street one. Not so safe when there are cars piled up at a stoplight an you go barrelling in at 65 and find some ice up there...
My advice woudl be:
1) make sure your pads/rotors are fine and make sure you dont have any air or leaks in your break lines - that means your brakes are probably fine
2) check for uneven tire wear that could have a big impact under hard braking.
3) if its cold out where u are, and you want to be able to use those powerful brakes more of the time, get some all seasons, or if there is actually snow/ice on the road, get some winter tires. {thumbup**
this happened during the summer as well, so its not about cold temps. i dont wanna say this is a real problem, its really Not That bad... but it is noticeable. the car does brake just fine from any speed, but compared with other cars i have and drive weekly, in all those cars abs never turns on (unless crazy panic braking), and here in the Evo, its 'vibrating' right away, if i step on the brakes just a bit hard.
ye, i checked all those 'symptoms' way back when i first started noticing the "early Abs intervention" but the only thing i can see is uneven wear on the rear tires (camber wear). can that really be causing this ??
Dec 4, 2008, 12:43 AM
#24
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I have seen mixed reviews on the RotorPro Centric cheapy rotors. Several peeps on here have bought them and used them even on the track and swear they are great. One of the serious track guys had a pretty bad experience on the track with one rotor that cracked pretty badly, but that may have been an isolated case and he is a very serious track driver.
Check this thread out:
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/sh...d.php?t=143878
Now as for the different styles of rotors:
For the bulk of Evo drivers doing a mix of mostly street with perhaps the occasional track session you want to stick with blank rotors.
Slotted rotors are used in motorsport by some very extreme braking setups. In the motorsports world, the slotted rotors combined with the aggressive pads have a 2 fold effect:
1) they are said to put a sharper initial bite to the brakes so that they grab faster and harder on initial application
2) The slots scrape against the pads which supposedly deglaze the contact area to improve braking performance.
disatvantage?
1) the slots scraping on the pads will wear out your pads faster.
2) the edges of the slots can (in theory) have a detrimental effect on the overal structural integrity of the rotors. Spider cracks could develop during rapid heat cycling and it is possible that the slots will exacerbate the problem and encourage cracks to propagate
Drilled Rotors:
1) originally developed in the early days of racing when brake pads consisted of organic compounds that sublimated from solid to gas under high temperature and pressure. The cross drilled holes allowed this very thin layer of gas to escape, ensuring flush contact of the pad against the rotor.
Since then, advances in brake pad technology have all but eliminated that problem but the drilled rotors, which were originally developed for high performance race applications, still carried the "high performance" look and as such continued to be used on many street applications.
Advantages:
-could help to evacuate water from between the pad and rotor in the wet
-very very marginal weight saving
Disadvantages:
-original purpose of venting gas created by organic pads does not really exist anymore
-drilling holes in the rotor compromises structural integrity under which can lead to cracks, crack propagation, and brake failure under high heat cycle and loads (like on the track). Chamfered (smooted/rounded) edges on the holes, like some rotors have, will help mitigate cracks propagating from the sharp edge of the holes, but will still have a negative impact on overall structural integrity.
Dimpled
As far as I know dimpled rotors are done simply to get the look of cross drilled without sacrificing as much of the structural integrity of the rotor by drilling only partway through instead of all the way through. The weight savings are even more marginal on cross drilled, yet the benefit of evacuating water (or gas) is not there. Pretty much just for show.
Making a decision?
If you only drive around town in your Evo and use the brakes like any other street drive can, any of these rotors will work fine. You may notice increased pad wear with slotted rotors, but the weaknesses introduced by cross drilling or dimpling will not be an issue on the street.
On the track the story is very different. The danger of rotor cracking is much more sever under he high heat cycles on the track and as such I would recommend either blanks or good quality slotted rotors and a good set of track pads.
Check this thread out:
https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/sh...d.php?t=143878
Now as for the different styles of rotors:
For the bulk of Evo drivers doing a mix of mostly street with perhaps the occasional track session you want to stick with blank rotors.
Slotted rotors are used in motorsport by some very extreme braking setups. In the motorsports world, the slotted rotors combined with the aggressive pads have a 2 fold effect:
1) they are said to put a sharper initial bite to the brakes so that they grab faster and harder on initial application
2) The slots scrape against the pads which supposedly deglaze the contact area to improve braking performance.
disatvantage?
1) the slots scraping on the pads will wear out your pads faster.
2) the edges of the slots can (in theory) have a detrimental effect on the overal structural integrity of the rotors. Spider cracks could develop during rapid heat cycling and it is possible that the slots will exacerbate the problem and encourage cracks to propagate
Drilled Rotors:
1) originally developed in the early days of racing when brake pads consisted of organic compounds that sublimated from solid to gas under high temperature and pressure. The cross drilled holes allowed this very thin layer of gas to escape, ensuring flush contact of the pad against the rotor.
Since then, advances in brake pad technology have all but eliminated that problem but the drilled rotors, which were originally developed for high performance race applications, still carried the "high performance" look and as such continued to be used on many street applications.
Advantages:
-could help to evacuate water from between the pad and rotor in the wet
-very very marginal weight saving
Disadvantages:
-original purpose of venting gas created by organic pads does not really exist anymore
-drilling holes in the rotor compromises structural integrity under which can lead to cracks, crack propagation, and brake failure under high heat cycle and loads (like on the track). Chamfered (smooted/rounded) edges on the holes, like some rotors have, will help mitigate cracks propagating from the sharp edge of the holes, but will still have a negative impact on overall structural integrity.
Dimpled
As far as I know dimpled rotors are done simply to get the look of cross drilled without sacrificing as much of the structural integrity of the rotor by drilling only partway through instead of all the way through. The weight savings are even more marginal on cross drilled, yet the benefit of evacuating water (or gas) is not there. Pretty much just for show.
Making a decision?
If you only drive around town in your Evo and use the brakes like any other street drive can, any of these rotors will work fine. You may notice increased pad wear with slotted rotors, but the weaknesses introduced by cross drilling or dimpling will not be an issue on the street.
On the track the story is very different. The danger of rotor cracking is much more sever under he high heat cycles on the track and as such I would recommend either blanks or good quality slotted rotors and a good set of track pads.
{thumbup**
Dec 4, 2008, 09:48 AM
#25
thank you^ 
Assuming you are located in NYC as it says under your avatar, temperature is definitely a factor if you are still rolling on AO46s. That said, you say it happens in summer too, that may mean that its not the only factor that is causing yoru problem.
Uneven camber wear can definitely have the effect of triggering ABS early. When you brake hard, you get weight transfer to the front of the car, the rear end gets light, there is less normal force on the rear tires and as a result less traction. In your case this normal braking situation is made worse by uneven camber wear.
What could be happening then is the rear end, lacking the traction to keep the rear wheels rolling, locks up a side under braking and the ABS system senses a wheel lockup and kicks in early.
this happened during the summer as well, so its not about cold temps. i dont wanna say this is a real problem, its really Not That bad... but it is noticeable. the car does brake just fine from any speed, but compared with other cars i have and drive weekly, in all those cars abs never turns on (unless crazy panic braking), and here in the Evo, its 'vibrating' right away, if i step on the brakes just a bit hard.
ye, i checked all those 'symptoms' way back when i first started noticing the "early Abs intervention" but the only thing i can see is uneven wear on the rear tires (camber wear). can that really be causing this ??
ye, i checked all those 'symptoms' way back when i first started noticing the "early Abs intervention" but the only thing i can see is uneven wear on the rear tires (camber wear). can that really be causing this ??
Assuming you are located in NYC as it says under your avatar, temperature is definitely a factor if you are still rolling on AO46s. That said, you say it happens in summer too, that may mean that its not the only factor that is causing yoru problem.
Uneven camber wear can definitely have the effect of triggering ABS early. When you brake hard, you get weight transfer to the front of the car, the rear end gets light, there is less normal force on the rear tires and as a result less traction. In your case this normal braking situation is made worse by uneven camber wear.
What could be happening then is the rear end, lacking the traction to keep the rear wheels rolling, locks up a side under braking and the ABS system senses a wheel lockup and kicks in early.
Dec 4, 2008, 09:55 AM
#26
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trying to buy 2 good used tires now for the back to replace the unevenly worn ones (made an offer to someone right here on the forum)... if i end up buying them, we'll see if that helps with the braking.
ye still stickin with the oem Advans... i know i know
ye still stickin with the oem Advans... i know i know
Dec 4, 2008, 05:33 PM
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your insurance deductable I'm sure is going to be more the a new set of all seasons. when you get in an accident because you couldn't stop you're going to wish you spent a couple hundred on some tires.
the a046's are not meant to be driven in anything under 40*... do a search and read how many accidents happened to evo owners because they wanted to try and save a couple bux. don't say you haven't been warned.
the a046's are not meant to be driven in anything under 40*... do a search and read how many accidents happened to evo owners because they wanted to try and save a couple bux. don't say you haven't been warned.
Dec 4, 2008, 08:55 PM
#28
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i know, and agree with everything said.
But its more than just buying a second set of tires, i also gotta get a second set of wheels to go along... just too much right now. tired of spending all my money on these damn needy cars.
just bought a new fujitsubo exhaust, and the following week had to fix the benz
ever change a head gasket on an AMG benz ??
...i guess in the end, i just dont drive the evo enough to justify keeping spending money on it...
also want new drilled rotors (for looks), want new summer tires, now i need winters too... before u know it, the clutch will go Or somethin.... IT NEVER ENDS
But its more than just buying a second set of tires, i also gotta get a second set of wheels to go along... just too much right now. tired of spending all my money on these damn needy cars.
just bought a new fujitsubo exhaust, and the following week had to fix the benz
ever change a head gasket on an AMG benz ??
...i guess in the end, i just dont drive the evo enough to justify keeping spending money on it...
also want new drilled rotors (for looks), want new summer tires, now i need winters too... before u know it, the clutch will go Or somethin.... IT NEVER ENDS
Dec 5, 2008, 05:09 AM
#29
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you have like what 4 cars in your profile and you can't afford a couple hundred for some rims & tires. why would you buy an aftermarket exhaust when you need safety equipment for one of your cars? sounds like you have your priorities all screwed up... sorry but I have no sympathy for you.