Better than stock MR Bilstein Performance and Ride Quality
#1
Newbie
Thread Starter
Better than stock MR Bilstein Performance and Ride Quality
Hey all. Obviously I'm new here. Picked up a single owner 2005 Evo 8 MR. Intro/Build post should be coming soon.
Anyways, I have to say I am extremely impressed with the MR Bilsteins out of the box. Mitsubishi really nailed it with the stock Bilstein suspension. The handling is very very good, ride height is very performance oriented but still very usable on the street (or off) and relatively decent ride quality to boot.
However, I am scratching my head wondering if there is further advancement to be found in the aftermarket.
I have a set of 949 Racing Xida coilovers for my turbo Miata, and the dampers are absolutely incredible. They provide incredible grip while still tolerating stiff springs and providing a good ride (on par with the Evo Bilsteins, but far exceeding them in performance).
If anyone has any experience with high end aftermarket springs+dampers, I am all ears.
Of course I have seen the Ohlins, and have driven on a set. They were on a stiffer spring rate than the Road and Track Ohlins come with out of the box, and so I don't feel like it was a good demonstration.
If compromising for multi-use suspension duties (daily driving, snow, rain, backroads, no track/autocross), would a low mile set of Evo 9 MR Bilsteins a good option? I read that Bilstein designed the shock to basically never need to be rebuilt, which I am highly skeptical about.
If anyone has experience replacing their stock bilsteins with a fresh set, or getting them rebuilt/revalved, I would like to hear that as well.
Thanks in advance to all and I am a very happy guy in my Evolution!
Anyways, I have to say I am extremely impressed with the MR Bilsteins out of the box. Mitsubishi really nailed it with the stock Bilstein suspension. The handling is very very good, ride height is very performance oriented but still very usable on the street (or off) and relatively decent ride quality to boot.
However, I am scratching my head wondering if there is further advancement to be found in the aftermarket.
I have a set of 949 Racing Xida coilovers for my turbo Miata, and the dampers are absolutely incredible. They provide incredible grip while still tolerating stiff springs and providing a good ride (on par with the Evo Bilsteins, but far exceeding them in performance).
If anyone has any experience with high end aftermarket springs+dampers, I am all ears.
Of course I have seen the Ohlins, and have driven on a set. They were on a stiffer spring rate than the Road and Track Ohlins come with out of the box, and so I don't feel like it was a good demonstration.
If compromising for multi-use suspension duties (daily driving, snow, rain, backroads, no track/autocross), would a low mile set of Evo 9 MR Bilsteins a good option? I read that Bilstein designed the shock to basically never need to be rebuilt, which I am highly skeptical about.
If anyone has experience replacing their stock bilsteins with a fresh set, or getting them rebuilt/revalved, I would like to hear that as well.
Thanks in advance to all and I am a very happy guy in my Evolution!
#2
EvoM Staff Alumni
iTrader: (3)
Welcome aboard & congrats
There are more than a few choices. Basically you can stay w/the Bills & go w/the Swift / GT Worx springs & that will work just fine for aggressive street / light track work
If you want the adjustability of C/o's & more suited for track work , I recommend the following:
One of the popular brands that a lot of us run (as well as me) is Fortune Auto. They are not too expensive & they are built / assembled here in the U.S.
Each set is built to per order
http://www.fortune-auto.com
There are more than a few choices. Basically you can stay w/the Bills & go w/the Swift / GT Worx springs & that will work just fine for aggressive street / light track work
If you want the adjustability of C/o's & more suited for track work , I recommend the following:
One of the popular brands that a lot of us run (as well as me) is Fortune Auto. They are not too expensive & they are built / assembled here in the U.S.
Each set is built to per order
http://www.fortune-auto.com
#3
Newbie
Thread Starter
Welcome aboard & congrats
There are more than a few choices. Basically you can stay w/the Bills & go w/the Swift / GT Worx springs & that will work just fine for aggressive street / light track work
If you want the adjustability of C/o's & more suited for track work , I recommend the following:
One of the popular brands that a lot of us run (as well as me) is Fortune Auto. They are not too expensive & they are built / assembled here in the U.S.
Each set is built to per order
http://www.fortune-auto.com
There are more than a few choices. Basically you can stay w/the Bills & go w/the Swift / GT Worx springs & that will work just fine for aggressive street / light track work
If you want the adjustability of C/o's & more suited for track work , I recommend the following:
One of the popular brands that a lot of us run (as well as me) is Fortune Auto. They are not too expensive & they are built / assembled here in the U.S.
Each set is built to per order
http://www.fortune-auto.com
#4
EvoM Staff Alumni
iTrader: (3)
What kind of spring rates are you running on your fortune auto coilovers? Did you find ride improved or suffered as a result? Keep in mind the car is primarily a daily driver, and is a canyon carver second. Will likely need softer rates as the roads I will drive on require more compliance out of the suspension.
You would want to go with their 500 series c/o'r at a rate of approx 7K/8K based on your notes (add the option for Swift springs & upper bearing kit)
I would recommend you call them direct. If you are interested & based on your driving profile, they will recommend & build you a set, tuned to your needs
#5
Newbie
Thread Starter
Yeah, you would not want to follow my spec. My FA 510 c/o's are basically set-up for track only (rates are 10K/12K)
You would want to go with their 500 series c/o'r at a rate of approx 7K/8K based on your notes (add the option for Swift springs & upper bearing kit)
I would recommend you call them direct. If you are interested & based on your driving profile, they will recommend & build you a set, tuned to your needs
You would want to go with their 500 series c/o'r at a rate of approx 7K/8K based on your notes (add the option for Swift springs & upper bearing kit)
I would recommend you call them direct. If you are interested & based on your driving profile, they will recommend & build you a set, tuned to your needs
#6
EvoM Guru
iTrader: (1)
For street use, Ohlin's r/t's with the included springs switched (front to rear, rear to front) will be perfect. Fortune auto is extremely close in price to the Ohlins (only $500-$600 difference with the upgrades on the FA500's), but the Ohlins are a far better damper.
#7
Newbie
Thread Starter
For street use, Ohlin's r/t's with the included springs switched (front to rear, rear to front) will be perfect. Fortune auto is extremely close in price to the Ohlins (only $500-$600 difference with the upgrades on the FA500's), but the Ohlins are a far better damper.
Can you explain a little about the swapping the stiffer springs to the rear? I am coming from an Front engine rear drive suspension world and am not well versed in setting up a suspension for a AWD car.
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#8
EvoM Staff Alumni
iTrader: (3)
I agree, Ohlins is top shelf in some regards, but their c/o's are not assembled to your needs & are hundreds of $$$ more. So the spring rates & valving are pre-set to an incorrect standard for the EvO.
FA servicing & customer service is far superior to what Ohlins offer
FA, on the other hand, specifically matches spring rates & valving to each set of c/o's & each set are dyno plotted w/the results sent w/each kit
Due to the motion ratio (lever arm) of the rear suspension, the EVO needs an approx 1K-2K higher spring rate in the rear vs the front (i.e. 8k front 10k rear) The Ohlins have them backwards
Last edited by MinusPrevious; Sep 8, 2016 at 06:54 AM.
#9
EvoM Guru
iTrader: (50)
Evo 8 and Evo 9 Bilsteins are the same. The Bilstein HDs are stiffer and have poorer ride quality. I went directly from Evo MR Bilsteins with GTWorx springs to Ohlins R&T with 400 lb/in (7 kg/mm) springs on all four wheels, and they work better in every way. I do think that 400 lb/in is too soft though and have a set of 450 lb/in springs waiting to be installed when I find the time. I recently got to drive an Evo with R&Ts that had 11k/12k springs, and I was amazed at the ride quality. It was essentially as good as mine.
Choice of spring rate can generate a lot of debate. My suspicion is that Bilstein choose a strong front spring to combat roll in the front and therefore maintain a better contact patch that will prevent understeer. I have no idea whether it works in practice, but I ended up going with equal rate front and rear, and combined it with a stiffer rear bar. This has produced neutral to mild oversteer under power.
Choice of spring rate can generate a lot of debate. My suspicion is that Bilstein choose a strong front spring to combat roll in the front and therefore maintain a better contact patch that will prevent understeer. I have no idea whether it works in practice, but I ended up going with equal rate front and rear, and combined it with a stiffer rear bar. This has produced neutral to mild oversteer under power.
#10
EvoM Guru
iTrader: (1)
Originally Posted by astral
I've always heald Ohlins in high regard.
Can you explain a little about the swapping the stiffer springs to the rear? I am coming from an Front engine rear drive suspension world and am not well versed in setting up a suspension for a AWD car.
Can you explain a little about the swapping the stiffer springs to the rear? I am coming from an Front engine rear drive suspension world and am not well versed in setting up a suspension for a AWD car.
#11
Newbie
Thread Starter
Evo 8 and Evo 9 Bilsteins are the same. The Bilstein HDs are stiffer and have poorer ride quality. I went directly from Evo MR Bilsteins with GTWorx springs to Ohlins R&T with 400 lb/in (7 kg/mm) springs on all four wheels, and they work better in every way. I do think that 400 lb/in is too soft though and have a set of 450 lb/in springs waiting to be installed when I find the time. I recently got to drive an Evo with R&Ts that had 11k/12k springs, and I was amazed at the ride quality. It was essentially as good as mine.
Choice of spring rate can generate a lot of debate. My suspicion is that Bilstein choose a strong front spring to combat roll in the front and therefore maintain a better contact patch that will prevent understeer. I have no idea whether it works in practice, but I ended up going with equal rate front and rear, and combined it with a stiffer rear bar. This has produced neutral to mild oversteer under power.
Choice of spring rate can generate a lot of debate. My suspicion is that Bilstein choose a strong front spring to combat roll in the front and therefore maintain a better contact patch that will prevent understeer. I have no idea whether it works in practice, but I ended up going with equal rate front and rear, and combined it with a stiffer rear bar. This has produced neutral to mild oversteer under power.
#12
Anyone know how reliable it will be to use the MR Bilsteins with Swift MR springs?
Reliable in regards to will my Bills blow after continuous usage or will it last due to the Swift MR being made specifically for the Bills. Usage is 100% daily driving and uphill roads/back roads. No track or auto x. Also how often does my stock bills need servicing? with these springs
Thanks !
Reliable in regards to will my Bills blow after continuous usage or will it last due to the Swift MR being made specifically for the Bills. Usage is 100% daily driving and uphill roads/back roads. No track or auto x. Also how often does my stock bills need servicing? with these springs
Thanks !
#14
Evolved Member
iTrader: (23)
Bilstein stopped doing the revalving and rebuilding of their shocks. There are a couple shops that will rebuild Bilsteins in California.
Swift spec R lowering springs are a good combination of performance and ride quality. I have never come across an issue with that setup.
Swift spec R lowering springs are a good combination of performance and ride quality. I have never come across an issue with that setup.
#15
Thanks guys. Shall be my next upgrade!