"Evo XI" rumors, speculations, and media reports.
Oct 28, 2011, 08:18 AM
#151
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For instance the same Hyundais have OHC engines no ?
I don't know, nor care. My opinion on Hyundai is bad, through personnal experience. I have no interest whatsoever to learn about their cars. But I know they've been using discontinued Mazda engines in some of their cars (the Protegé 2.0L has been used in Elantra's IIRC, and in Kia Sephia's)
Is it just a matter of costs in the North American market ?
Sadly, in a capitalist system, yes costs drives the game. No wonder everything moves to Mexico/China... Cheap labor...
Aren't the multi valve engines (4/5 valves per cylinder ) inherently more efficient too ?
Yes they are. But the real question is : Does that difference really matter? Including better technology will increase the car's cost, but is it necessary? Most actual engines use 4 valves/cyl, even in SOHC configuration. Some don't have it because they don't really need it.
Seems strange since in North America people like to be on the leading edge in so many other respects.
Actually, we have been in the past the leading edge of technology, but this isn't true anymore. Countries like Japan, Germany, even Taiwan produced tons of technology we use today.
We north Americans are "retarded" in many ways now compared to other industrialised countries. One of them seems to be our irrationnal hatred of diesel engines (to be back on topic). Have you guys ever driven one? The 1st standard car I could succesfully clutch was a TDI Jetta Wagon. The infinite amount of torque it had at very low rpm's made it really hard to stall the car. At this time I wasn't feeling sporty at all, and the car sure didn't feel like sporty either.
But I can't wait to see an awesome sports car, like the Evo, try new things already. I was surprised the 4B engine didn't come with direct injection, VW uses it in it's GTi with tremendous results (here, read 90% of the engine's torque available at 1600 rpms). So even beating the competition by using sporty diesel engines and making it available in a somewhat affordable sports car, I say hell yeah. Keep on surprising me Mitsubishi, you rock!
Thanks for your input Xmaster19.
My pleasure. I absolutely love cars, it is my life, and everything relevant is part of my passion. I like conversing with intelligent beings, makes me forget the world is full of dumbf*cks.
Last edited by xmaster19; Oct 28, 2011 at 08:21 AM.
Oct 31, 2011, 06:53 AM
#153
They should just bring a dam diesel/hybrid lancer and call it Lancer SE Hybrid or whatever they want... no need to mess around with their halo car...
Might as well do what Subie did and split the platform... leave the Evo a pure performance oriented platform and then do w/e greenie crap they want with their Lancers >_<
Oct 31, 2011, 07:17 AM
#154
The way i feel, if it performs, than its a success. There may be some potential in a diesel engine, and if any one can do it, its Mitsu. I mean, they are in the heavy machine business as well and i'm sure they are mostly diesel engines so they must know a thing or two. This is the sort of announcement that stirs up more controversy than hype, but i will sit back and see what develops. Like many have said before, at least the Evo will continue.
Nov 1, 2011, 07:41 AM
#155
The way i feel, if it performs, than its a success. There may be some potential in a diesel engine, and if any one can do it, its Mitsu. I mean, they are in the heavy machine business as well and i'm sure they are mostly diesel engines so they must know a thing or two. This is the sort of announcement that stirs up more controversy than hype, but i will sit back and see what develops. Like many have said before, at least the Evo will continue.
Mitsu actually has a ton of interests in heavy machinery and equipment so they've been dipping into the diesel world long before the Evo
Nov 2, 2011, 11:24 AM
#157
I think they sell more civics than cobalts, yet I have no numbers. Then the price of the civic should be lower. I'd say a better way to put it would be that the more competition/a car sells, the more it has to approach it's manufacturing cost, nothing to do with other companies prices.
For instance the same Hyundais have OHC engines no ?
I don't know, nor care. My opinion on Hyundai is bad, through personnal experience. I have no interest whatsoever to learn about their cars. But I know they've been using discontinued Mazda engines in some of their cars (the Protegé 2.0L has been used in Elantra's IIRC, and in Kia Sephia's)
Is it just a matter of costs in the North American market ?
Sadly, in a capitalist system, yes costs drives the game. No wonder everything moves to Mexico/China... Cheap labor...
Aren't the multi valve engines (4/5 valves per cylinder ) inherently more efficient too ?
Yes they are. But the real question is : Does that difference really matter? Including better technology will increase the car's cost, but is it necessary? Most actual engines use 4 valves/cyl, even in SOHC configuration. Some don't have it because they don't really need it.
Seems strange since in North America people like to be on the leading edge in so many other respects.
Actually, we have been in the past the leading edge of technology, but this isn't true anymore. Countries like Japan, Germany, even Taiwan produced tons of technology we use today.
We north Americans are "retarded" in many ways now compared to other industrialised countries. One of them seems to be our irrationnal hatred of diesel engines (to be back on topic). Have you guys ever driven one? The 1st standard car I could succesfully clutch was a TDI Jetta Wagon. The infinite amount of torque it had at very low rpm's made it really hard to stall the car. At this time I wasn't feeling sporty at all, and the car sure didn't feel like sporty either.
But I can't wait to see an awesome sports car, like the Evo, try new things already. I was surprised the 4B engine didn't come with direct injection, VW uses it in it's GTi with tremendous results (here, read 90% of the engine's torque available at 1600 rpms). So even beating the competition by using sporty diesel engines and making it available in a somewhat affordable sports car, I say hell yeah. Keep on surprising me Mitsubishi, you rock!
Thanks for your input Xmaster19.
My pleasure. I absolutely love cars, it is my life, and everything relevant is part of my passion. I like conversing with intelligent beings, makes me forget the world is full of dumbf*cks.
For instance the same Hyundais have OHC engines no ?
I don't know, nor care. My opinion on Hyundai is bad, through personnal experience. I have no interest whatsoever to learn about their cars. But I know they've been using discontinued Mazda engines in some of their cars (the Protegé 2.0L has been used in Elantra's IIRC, and in Kia Sephia's)
Is it just a matter of costs in the North American market ?
Sadly, in a capitalist system, yes costs drives the game. No wonder everything moves to Mexico/China... Cheap labor...
Aren't the multi valve engines (4/5 valves per cylinder ) inherently more efficient too ?
Yes they are. But the real question is : Does that difference really matter? Including better technology will increase the car's cost, but is it necessary? Most actual engines use 4 valves/cyl, even in SOHC configuration. Some don't have it because they don't really need it.
Seems strange since in North America people like to be on the leading edge in so many other respects.
Actually, we have been in the past the leading edge of technology, but this isn't true anymore. Countries like Japan, Germany, even Taiwan produced tons of technology we use today.
We north Americans are "retarded" in many ways now compared to other industrialised countries. One of them seems to be our irrationnal hatred of diesel engines (to be back on topic). Have you guys ever driven one? The 1st standard car I could succesfully clutch was a TDI Jetta Wagon. The infinite amount of torque it had at very low rpm's made it really hard to stall the car. At this time I wasn't feeling sporty at all, and the car sure didn't feel like sporty either.
But I can't wait to see an awesome sports car, like the Evo, try new things already. I was surprised the 4B engine didn't come with direct injection, VW uses it in it's GTi with tremendous results (here, read 90% of the engine's torque available at 1600 rpms). So even beating the competition by using sporty diesel engines and making it available in a somewhat affordable sports car, I say hell yeah. Keep on surprising me Mitsubishi, you rock!
Thanks for your input Xmaster19.
My pleasure. I absolutely love cars, it is my life, and everything relevant is part of my passion. I like conversing with intelligent beings, makes me forget the world is full of dumbf*cks.
Nov 3, 2011, 09:22 AM
#158
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The benefits are numerous. Using the fuel to cool the cylinders, better atomization (thus better combustion), extremely precise air/fuel control. If GM uses it, I can't see why Mitsubishi wouldn't. All this leading to more power, better fuel mileage, better turbo spool, etc.
Again, I think the bean counters in Mitsubishi HQ's said no.
Again, I think the bean counters in Mitsubishi HQ's said no.
Nov 4, 2011, 10:11 AM
#160
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I so agree with the above statements that speak of using Direct Injection. Direct Injection has so many benefits over conventional fuel injection, one would think that it would be a no brainer. GM understands this. So does Hyundai. Being a Honda fan, I was really hoping that Honda would introduce it on the 2012 Si, but no deal. Likewise, I feel that Mitsubishi could get a lot more mileage out of the current 4B11T if they were to use direct injection. Why oh why couldn't Mitsubishi use an electric motor hybrid with a direct injection 4B11T? Fuel economy would go up and emissions would go down. This is much more in keeping with the spirit of the Evo than a diesel hybrid.
Mitsubishi should try out a diesel hybrid in the Lancer and Outlander Sport. Then, down the road, use an advanced version of this layout on an Evo XII. Additionally, I would love to see Mitsubishi following the lead of companies like Mercedes and BMW who both plan to extensively use composites to radically reduce weight. The next E series Mercedes is claimed to only weigh about 2,800 pounds. BMW says it will heavily use composites and aluminum in all future BMW's. So, imagine an Evo that weight about 500-700 pounds less with a direct injection/hybrid 4B11T. A win-win situation.
Mitsubishi should try out a diesel hybrid in the Lancer and Outlander Sport. Then, down the road, use an advanced version of this layout on an Evo XII. Additionally, I would love to see Mitsubishi following the lead of companies like Mercedes and BMW who both plan to extensively use composites to radically reduce weight. The next E series Mercedes is claimed to only weigh about 2,800 pounds. BMW says it will heavily use composites and aluminum in all future BMW's. So, imagine an Evo that weight about 500-700 pounds less with a direct injection/hybrid 4B11T. A win-win situation.
Nov 6, 2011, 05:48 PM
#161
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Mitsubishi should try out a diesel hybrid in the Lancer and Outlander Sport. Then, down the road, use an advanced version of this layout on an Evo XII. Additionally, I would love to see Mitsubishi following the lead of companies like Mercedes and BMW who both plan to extensively use composites to radically reduce weight. The next E series Mercedes is claimed to only weigh about 2,800 pounds. BMW says it will heavily use composites and aluminum in all future BMW's.
:facepalm:
You sir still don't get it.
1st, Mitsubishi has been making diesel Lancers/SUV's for ages. Only north americans refuse to buy diesel powered cars, because we are plainly retarded. They are already at the "advanced" part of diesel car engineering, thus a diesel powered evo.
2nd, although the weight reduction idea is a no brainer, Mitsubishi has been offering this option on previous generations Evo's. I'm not totally sure about which gets what, but IIRC, MR's had aluminium roofs, side impact beams and such. All in favor of weight reductions. Even rs's gets "no radio, no wing, regular seats, etc." option to cut on weight also.
As for extensive use of lighter materials to save 600-700 lbs of weight, it could be cool, but it would mean a 5-10k increase in MRSP easy. I'm pretty sure Mitsubishi will try to say competitive with similar cars, not try to take on Porsche's and Bimmers... (although we all know they don't give much more for 30k more :P).
TL; DR : Please stop thinking we (north america) are the center of the universe. Things happens outside the borders too.
Nov 7, 2011, 01:20 PM
#163
Evolved Member
:facepalm:
You sir still don't get it.
1st, Mitsubishi has been making diesel Lancers/SUV's for ages. Only north americans refuse to buy diesel powered cars, because we are plainly retarded. They are already at the "advanced" part of diesel car engineering, thus a diesel powered evo.
2nd, although the weight reduction idea is a no brainer, Mitsubishi has been offering this option on previous generations Evo's. I'm not totally sure about which gets what, but IIRC, MR's had aluminium roofs, side impact beams and such. All in favor of weight reductions. Even rs's gets "no radio, no wing, regular seats, etc." option to cut on weight also.
As for extensive use of lighter materials to save 600-700 lbs of weight, it could be cool, but it would mean a 5-10k increase in MRSP easy. I'm pretty sure Mitsubishi will try to say competitive with similar cars, not try to take on Porsche's and Bimmers... (although we all know they don't give much more for 30k more :P).
TL; DR : Please stop thinking we (north america) are the center of the universe. Things happens outside the borders too.
You sir still don't get it.
1st, Mitsubishi has been making diesel Lancers/SUV's for ages. Only north americans refuse to buy diesel powered cars, because we are plainly retarded. They are already at the "advanced" part of diesel car engineering, thus a diesel powered evo.
2nd, although the weight reduction idea is a no brainer, Mitsubishi has been offering this option on previous generations Evo's. I'm not totally sure about which gets what, but IIRC, MR's had aluminium roofs, side impact beams and such. All in favor of weight reductions. Even rs's gets "no radio, no wing, regular seats, etc." option to cut on weight also.
As for extensive use of lighter materials to save 600-700 lbs of weight, it could be cool, but it would mean a 5-10k increase in MRSP easy. I'm pretty sure Mitsubishi will try to say competitive with similar cars, not try to take on Porsche's and Bimmers... (although we all know they don't give much more for 30k more :P).
TL; DR : Please stop thinking we (north america) are the center of the universe. Things happens outside the borders too.
As for weight, Subaru is introducing a 2012 Impreza that weighs about 180 pounds less than the 2011 and 37 pounds less than the 2007. Subaru has even talked about a shorter wheelbase WRX/STi, so Mitsubishi could emulate what Subaru is doing. Again, facepalm.
I never said that they would copy Mercedes exactly and drop a massive 700 pounds. But, with a shorter wheelbase car and smaller dimensions, plus greater usage of aluminum, the car could easily weigh 200-300 pounds less.
And finally, I never said that North America was the center of the universe. You are putting words in my mouth. What Mitsubishi does for the Evo would apply worldwide.
I am afraid that you are the one not getting it. I am trying to put a positive spin on a somewhat pessimistic viewpoint of the next Evo. Somehow, I picture you in a diesel electric hybrid Evo, belching out black sooty smoke...
Nov 12, 2011, 09:33 PM
#164
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http://www.dieselpowermag.com/events...ans/index.html
The advantages to diesel are growing. Also, diesel emission control systems are improving and new diesels no longer smoke or smell. Maybe the weight of the hybrid technology will be offset by the lessening of the drive-train weight by replacing gears and axles with motors. This could be awesome!
The advantages to diesel are growing. Also, diesel emission control systems are improving and new diesels no longer smoke or smell. Maybe the weight of the hybrid technology will be offset by the lessening of the drive-train weight by replacing gears and axles with motors. This could be awesome!
Nov 12, 2011, 09:40 PM
#165
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who cares about a new evo.. cherish and take care of the one u have and keep making it better and better. its nice to OWN an evo, not pay for one.. I use that car payment as a maintenance payment and couldn't be happier