Timing Question
 

The stock ECU really seems to pull a lot of timing and Im wondering if this can be adjusted at all with the UTEC? How does it effect the timing settings on the UTEC when the stock ECU starts pulling timing? Does the UTEC really control timing and fuel injection or does it just fool the ECU like other piggybacks? Im stuck between the UTEC and the AEM EMS. Im thinking the AEM EMS would be overkill but I do want something that is more powerful than a piggyback.

Thanks

Timing changes are absolute. .what you set is what you get.. the current firmware does use intercept for the MAF (Fuel) so it could be affected slightly. The new firmware will allow open loop control of fuel (direct control of the fuel injectors)

so from a timing standpoint, the only time you'd get the ECU influencing your timing is in closed loop driving, or in portions of your map where you have it set to pass through the ECU timing.

The utec is much more than a piggyback.. it has very strong features of a standalone (Especially with the new firmware)

keep in mind that pulling timing is a safety measure.. so if you are using the UTEC, it does have knock control, and it will adjust the timing for you should detonation happen.. But tuning becomes very important at that point..

You need to be certain that the reasons your getting your timing pulled by the stock ECU are due to factors that you can control.. Otherwise you need to address those issues and resolve them before you can really tune around them..

I do want to retain the knock control it just seems to be overly aggresive. I guess its better to be safe then sorry with engine knock though.

yeah definitely.. thats why its important to log the data when the car has stock timing and injector duty.. it will give you a good idea of the places your having trouble.

Yeah after reading through the manual I better understand the UTEC's knock control. Jack, did you adjust your knock control settings with the UTEC? Are the settings that come with the UTEC pretty conservative? I see that the knock threshold and other settings can be adjusted and I was wondering if these need to be altered much during tuning. I know it is car specific but I want to be careful with these settings.

It seems that every car is different, in my case, the current knock settings result in the indicator triggering when the factory ECU also pulls timing, so I know its set correctly.. Some cars may get ping and the ECU may pull timing, yet the UTEC may not register it, in that case you need to listen for the ping with a knocklink, tuner or some sort of phones, and then adjust the UTEC to be more sensitive (or less)

Generally its good to err on the side of caution and make it more sensitive than necessary unless its constantly registering valvetrain or drivetrain noise, then adjust it until it no longer registers background noise.

Some engines seem a bit cranky, or the sensor is picking up noise that isn't actually knock and the ECU isn't discriminating the difference.

So when the UTEC is set to a map other then 0 it will have total knock control over the ECU correct?

If you set the timing map to something OTHER than ECU.. If you put timing in a cell, the UTEC will act on potential knock in that cell.. It has to, since timing is absolute (it doesn't offset the stock ECU's timing) it needs to "Take responsibility" for the timing..

If you set the map switch to 2, and you have a fuel map, but no Timing map setting, it will pass through the timing from the stock ECU (and allow the stock ECU to react to knock)

If your timing map has 10 cells with custom timing in it, but the rest is set to ECU, then those 10 cells will be controlled by the UTEC..

that is why its important to gather all the stock timing information by datalogging before you change anything, then you can build a map based on stock timing, then tune from there and all the cells you need to have the UTEC control will be there..

Is it always true that more advance timing is ALWAYS better (assuming no knocks present)? What about the theory to have a retard timing during ramp up (2750-3750 rpm) to create hotter exhaust gas for faster turbo spool?