Construct

iTrader: (4)

Take a picture with your camera phone if you have to. We're to the point where there's not a whole lot of advice we can give without seeing the chart.

If the final run started at 2000RPM and the first (baseline) run started at 2500RPM, then it's hard to say how much of the 300RPM spool threshold improvement came from the tuning and how much came from the 500RPM head start on the dyno. Obviously the turbo isn't going to spool much down below 3K either way, but it's not an apples-to-apples comparison either.

Now I'm really confused. You said you only gained 6hp, but that would put you at 279hp baseline. That's rather high for an untuned Evo X on a mustang dyno. Let's take a step back here:

What are your mods?
Are you the first and only owner? (In other words: Is it possible that the car was already tuned to some degree?)
Did the tuner add any sort of correction factor?

RJones

iTrader: (5)

285whp is about right for an STU 8 or 9. I would think the X would trend about the same way.

BluEvo210

I'm the only owner (bought it in May of 2008). I waited until the warranty expired to modify anything. Yes, the 1st dyno run showed 279hp for a car with a modified exhaust.

I have a K&N panel filter, which I don't even count as a modification.

Mods are an ATP "divorced and transformable" 3-inch downpipe, and a twin-tailpipe exhaust installed by a local muffler shop.

Compared to the stock downpipe, the new one has a bend radius about twice as large. This was the first mod on the car, and I immediately noticed an improvement in throttle response.

After the stock catalyst, the exhaust has a 3" pipe, and a Dynomax "Race Bullet" muffler. Shortly after that muffler, there's a Y-pipe that splits the exhaust into a pair of 2" pipes. Each pipe has a Magnaflow muffler with a 2" core.

The two 2" pipes have a combined cross section slightly smaller than the single 3" pipe. I thought that would help the torque and throttle response.

The 3" pipe has a cross section of 7.07 square inches, and the 2" pipes have a combined cross section of 6.28 square inches. The law of "Conservation of Mass", as it applies to fluid mechanics, dictates that the exhaust will have a higher velocity in the section with the smaller cross section. Higher velocity means it has less pressure relative to the 3" section, so that might help pull the flow through the pipe.

BluEvo210

Here is my attempt to post the scanned dyno graph:

vortico

iTrader: (38)

Hey BluEvo210,

Think I met you at the PanAm event back in mid October. Anyways, I would have to say you are reading the peak numbers appropriately, not sure if the graph is accounting for the fact you started it off earlier. However, I would have to say that you may want to try a remote tune if you have the parts and feel confident enough with flashing the rom to your car, that is my current plan to update my mail in flash on my 9. You should defiantly make more than 6hp and losing 2 torque after a tune. Have you tried to pull your map and look at the fuel and timing tables while comparing it to a stock map to see just what they did to the car? I know when I pulled my mail in one and compared it to stock I was fairly dissatisfied, though you could see the difference and feel it from the stock tune. I am planning on going with tscompusa as soon as I can pry loose some cash lol, I've heard nothing but good things from him and when talking to him understood my intentions for my car at auto-x.

Hope you get the car figured out and tuned to its best performance!

BluEvo210

Yes! I was racing a dead stock car in STU. The STU PAX was better than BS by about 0.001. My downpipe arrived the Friday before the event, and it's a good thing we didn't try to install it. Damian and his one coworker and I took about 5hrs to get all the bolts loose on the old pipe, then getting the new one in was almost as much of a pain. For a mechanic without a lift, Damian is doing a lot of work, so he gets an A for effort.

I'm not sure he gets an A for effort at the autocross. He only walked the course once each day.

BluEvo210

I'll know in the next day or 2 if the tuner wants to stand by their work and try again.

But, it sounds like everyone else is saying there's no value in going back to that tuner. Is that right?

vortico

iTrader: (38)

Hah cool, yeah that would be a good thing you guys did not try to install it. It is amusing how simple of a job changing a downpipe was on 8/9's but how much more complex it is due to the rearranging of where the exhaust manifold goes in the 10's.

As for the tuner, I'd say let them check it out again if he wants to stand by his work, but if its the same, get another opinion.

Also, did they pull the stock rom before they started that they can provide you with?

Construct

iTrader: (4)

I don't know if I'd go back even if he was re-tuning for free. Once he realizes you're disappointed in the gains and the forums are watching (even though you've left him nameless so far) he might start pushing timing/fueling/etc into dangerous territory to eek out the gains he couldn't find the first time around.

BluEvo210

I see your point. The guy said he was being a bit conservative with the Air/Fuel Ratio, to keep the engine from overheating and maintain longevity. I'm at a loss for how to tell him, "I want it to still be a little conservative, but not that damn much." I'd need to figure out how to discuss it without giving him a poke in the eye.

...I still don't think they did anything with the MIVEC. That's adjustable just like all the other tables, right?
Here's the part I'm really not sure about: I know the cam timing is controlled electronically, and both cams have variable timing on the 4B11, but can they be adjusted independently?

If I get a Tactrix plug and start adjusting the cam timing on my own, how big a risk am I taking? I'm envisioning getting most of the possible gains with something like 4 to 6 degrees of advance. I'm a n0ob when it comes to ECU tuning. I may not f*ck up any worse than these guys that use boost as a crutch, but I'm open to lots of help here!

Butt Dyno

iTrader: (10)

Check out the "MIVEC tuning" thread in the Ecuflash forum. It's pretty long. I have only read it once but IIRC, someone said there wasn't much damage you could do by playing with the MIVEC stuff, just power loss potentially.

As far as asking for a more aggressive map - I would just say "hey, I'd like to get an autox specific map that I won't run on the street, so that you don't have to worry about being conservative". And then, actually do that I'm not sure I would go back tho, as compared to going to some place like TopSpeed.

BluEvo210

Since the owner isn't answering e-mails, I called the guy that actually did the tune. He says he can do another map, but he won't get much more power without increasing boost. I have an appointment for next Tuesday, but I think I'm going to cancel it. I've had a day to think about it, and if they can't get over their dependence on boost, I can't spend any more time on them.

The Evo X FQ-360 is rated at 354hp or so (at the flywheel, I assume), and its' boost actually tapers off to about 10.3psi. So, I don't have the intercooler upgrade - I have an extra 1.5psi at 7000rpm. Am I wrong thinking an STU Evo should have power like the FQ-360?

One review says "The power delivery is smoother than the outgoing motor and there’s less turbo lag, but this is still an engine defined by its top-end surge." http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/Drives/...ontent-block=2

I'm feeling a pretty good surge from 2500-4000rpm, but now the top end is less impressive, by comparison. Maybe the question to ask is: Is that normal for an STU tune?

BluEvo210

I was looking at these tables:

https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/ec...10-thread.html

This is EcuFlash output of the stock tables, right? The shop didn't give me any way to compare tables, but if I was going to mess with the ECU myself, I can compare what I've got to the tables in the EcuFlash link.

4B11AWD

iTrader: (1)

If you're willing to drive to Atlanta, both Forged Performance and Topseed are excellent shops and know the autox game well. Sharif at Forged Performance is a master at tuning.

By the way, what did you end up using for tuning: Accessport or OpenECU?

As far as power goes though I say 280 to 300 whp is realistic for STU without changing boost. For reference I make around 330whp with turboback, intercooler and piping, intake, with 25psi so if you're staying at stock boost it will be less than that. You're stock baseline without any mods should have been around 240ish whp.

BluEvo210

If those are the choices, then the shop must have used OpenECU. They had a laptop plugged into my ECU, rather than an Accessport device. I also found that all the tunes on an Accessport raise the boost to 24psi, so I ruled out buying one myself.