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Road Course Alignement Specs?

 
Old Feb 10, 2019, 03:48 PM
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yip
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Road Course Alignement Specs?

Looking for advice on alignment adjustments to consider making at the track? Currently the car is really neutral and pushes more than it wants to rotate in the low speed corners. Rarely does the *** come out since we installed the coilovers, Dallas's uprights and 275 tires. One thing I noticed that has majorly improved is high speed steady state turns I can get the car to turn in towards the apex where before it was always wanting to push and I would have to let off of the throttle to get it to turn in. My average speed has increased by a few mph which seems to result in a consistent 2 second decrease at Buttonwillow. My inside tire temps are are within 10 degrees of the outside and tire wear has greatly improved.

Here is what I have been running and stuck with:



Last edited by yip; Feb 10, 2019 at 03:59 PM.
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Old Feb 10, 2019, 04:41 PM
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IMO, you have a lot of rear camber, otherwise, looks like youre set. Did he tell you why theres that much rear camber? Was it done for tire clearance?

Ive always thought that we were to keep rear camber at -2 or less?

WestEnd knows track alignments!
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Old Feb 10, 2019, 05:12 PM
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Either way ,nice work on dropping two seconds! I'd sacrifice a kitten to do that.
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Old Feb 10, 2019, 06:40 PM
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Originally Posted by MinusPrevious View Post
IMO, you have a lot of rear camber, otherwise, looks like youre set. Did he tell you why theres that much rear camber? Was it done for tire clearance?

Ive always thought that we were to keep rear camber at -2 or less?

WestEnd knows track alignments!
I only take my cars to West End. They ask me what I want and I tell them do whatever they think is best. I've never asked for anything specific. I am being advised to play with the toe out. Do you guys do this at the track? What increments do you guys play with?

Originally Posted by kaj View Post
Either way ,nice work on dropping two seconds! I'd sacrifice a kitten to do that.
I'm 2 seconds quicker but I'm still slow compared to most :P

I'm going back for my 5th time at Buttonwillow next month so hoping to see 1:58 - 1:59. Need to take some in car instruction. I feel like I'm over driving the car and not being smooth enough. I go off a lot
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Old Feb 10, 2019, 07:10 PM
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Originally Posted by yip View Post
I only take my cars to West End. They ask me what I want and I tell them do whatever they think is best. I've never asked for anything specific. I am being advised to play with the toe out. Do you guys do this at the track? What increments do you guys play with?
I wouldnt mess w/the toe. Just keep it a zero & work w/your cambers. For me, TOE changes is for high level track work. If youre just HPDE'ing it, zero TOE will work just fine

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Old Feb 10, 2019, 07:17 PM
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Originally Posted by yip View Post

I'm 2 seconds quicker but I'm still slow compared to most :P

I'm going back for my 5th time at Buttonwillow next month so hoping to see 1:58 - 1:59. Need to take some in car instruction. I feel like I'm over driving the car and not being smooth enough. I go off a lot
I'm in the same boat. My best was a 2'00".059 with a teeny bit of traffic and a bad transmission. Not excuses, just explaining why my shifting sucked LOL. This was my first track day in about a year and I've only been back once, since. I'm seriously out of practice. I hope to reach a 2'57.000 then getting ambitious with the new tire/brake setup where 1'53".999 is my new goal! I'm lucky that I have a friend who is a professional drive and has offered to help me out. I can't wait to get out there with some instruction. I'm a mediocre driver, at best, and have reached the end of what I can figure out on my own. No offs, so maybe I'm not pushing hard enough
We should try to meet up out there and egg each other on. Nothing better than having someone out there with similar goals to get each other psyched up.

In case you are curious:

Way off topic, sorry. Not sure if it helps you, seeing how I run 255 NT01s, But I was at about 2.8*F camber, 1.6* rear, zero tow all around, and about 7.5* caster. The car is lowered enough to keep the front lower control arms level, from there I set the rear to have a 13mm rake. I have an APR wing set at minimum angle of attack with no front aero. The car is REALLY balanced and has a ton left in it, once I get used to being on track again. Since then, I've bumped camber to 3.0F and 1.8R.. we'll see how it does.
I don't have a way to measure tire temps. I need to get on that, but my tire wear is pretty danged decent due to relatively low spring rates (8kF, 10kR).
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Old Feb 11, 2019, 08:03 AM
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I usually stick around -3 to -3.1 up front and -1.9 in the rear. Tire probe always comes back with an even 20~ deg spread.
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Old Feb 11, 2019, 10:00 AM
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I measured some semi-pro (Robi and Mueller) setup Evos (NASA, SCCA, and TA), and they:
A) sit lower in the rear than most, with say 1/4" rake only.
B) ride height front is 24.5" to 24 3/4" - so really low
C) the alignment is with only 1 - 1.5 degree of camber difference front to back
D) front camber is in the range of 3.5 to 4.5, seems to perhaps depend on track

I think this alignment is spot on
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Old Feb 11, 2019, 10:46 AM
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Thats pretty low for stock geometries but maybe overcome running real stiff. Also, 24.5" is tucking the front tires quite a bit. Hard to do if running aggressive tires unless theyve done more cutting (probably the case).
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Old Feb 11, 2019, 11:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Dallas J View Post
Thats pretty low for stock geometries but maybe overcome running real stiff. Also, 24.5" is tucking the front tires quite a bit. Hard to do if running aggressive tires unless theyve done more cutting (probably the case).
Probably narrower tires too. I've noticed a lot of cars setup years back (pre 2015) didn't really run massive tires like a lot of guys do today.
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Old Feb 11, 2019, 02:14 PM
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Originally Posted by ayoustin View Post
Probably narrower tires too. I've noticed a lot of cars setup years back (pre 2015) didn't really run massive tires like a lot of guys do today.
Possibly. When Robi advised me on my specs, it was all based on a 255 tire, which he also recommended. This was about 3-5yrs ago, though. Lots have changed with wheel/tire setups since then.
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Old Feb 11, 2019, 03:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Balrok View Post
I usually stick around -3 to -3.1 up front and -1.9 in the rear. Tire probe always comes back with an even 20~ deg spread.
this is about what i run
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Old Feb 11, 2019, 07:27 PM
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Only 4 degrees of caster? What struts/plates?
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Old Feb 11, 2019, 07:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Butt Dyno View Post
Only 4 degrees of caster? What struts/plates?

Ohlins R&T with Ciro plates.
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Old Feb 11, 2019, 07:56 PM
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Originally Posted by kaj View Post
I'm in the same boat. My best was a 2'00".059 with a teeny bit of traffic and a bad transmission. Not excuses, just explaining why my shifting sucked LOL. This was my first track day in about a year and I've only been back once, since. I'm seriously out of practice. I hope to reach a 2'57.000 then getting ambitious with the new tire/brake setup where 1'53".999 is my new goal! I'm lucky that I have a friend who is a professional drive and has offered to help me out. I can't wait to get out there with some instruction. I'm a mediocre driver, at best, and have reached the end of what I can figure out on my own. No offs, so maybe I'm not pushing hard enough
We should try to meet up out there and egg each other on. Nothing better than having someone out there with similar goals to get each other psyched up.

Way off topic, sorry. Not sure if it helps you, seeing how I run 255 NT01s, But I was at about 2.8*F camber, 1.6* rear, zero tow all around, and about 7.5* caster. The car is lowered enough to keep the front lower control arms level, from there I set the rear to have a 13mm rake. I have an APR wing set at minimum angle of attack with no front aero. The car is REALLY balanced and has a ton left in it, once I get used to being on track again. Since then, I've bumped camber to 3.0F and 1.8R.. we'll see how it does.
I don't have a way to measure tire temps. I need to get on that, but my tire wear is pretty danged decent due to relatively low spring rates (8kF, 10kR).
Thanks for sharing the vid. My gear selection is quite different but assuming it's the difference between a 5 and 6 speed?

I set my heights at what Dallas's upright install directions recommended.

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