Over Moderation (2. Teil)
May 24, 2004, 12:17 PM
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Over Moderation (2. Teil)
I thought some good points were made in the previous thread by this title, and here I was ready to post my $.02, when I see that the thread has been closed. What gives? Ok, so the thread looked like it was going to end up in a flame fest, but apparently that's not why it was closed 
Anyways, since I can't rant there, I'll rant in me own thread...
On the subject of merged threads ... one look at the "Evo vs. Sti" merge should be enough to warrant no further 'super hyper extra mega buku merges'. That particular thread and all that have been merged into it have become IMHO completely useless. Might as well delete it and let everyone start over.
On the subject of closing threads, deleting posts, etc. ... just now a newbie's thread got killed because apparently his english wasn't good enough for the rigid american english standards applied at this site (funny I don't remember reading that in the ULA I agreed to, although there is that Ministry of Truth-like blanket statement in there
) NEways... not only did he get flamed by 3 or 4 alleged adult members, but the thread was summarily closed. Quite frankly the only immature posts I saw in that thread were the last five replies, which had absolutely NOTHING useful to say (including the mod). There's an old saying that goes .. "if ya got nothin' good to say, then don't say nothin' at all." (yeah, I know, my english is slipping). Perhaps the mature thing to do would have been to kindly remind the flamers to mind their own business and stay on topic and to then also make a statement to the original poster to clean up his grammar a bit. All of this could have been handled in a mature and non-inflammatory manner... very disappointing.
I would like to appeal to the moderators to please take a deep breath and count to ten before you make a split second decision like that. I would also like to applaud the fact that you have finally opened a DynoFlash vs. Vishnu forum ... please keep it an open forum and don't cave in to the temptation to start closing down threads and deleting posts. You have IMHO the best Evo forum out there right now. It has helped me tremendously and I hope it will continue to do so. But over moderation will kill it just as surely as allowing **** and unchecked flame wars would.
l8r)
Anyways, since I can't rant there, I'll rant in me own thread...
On the subject of merged threads ... one look at the "Evo vs. Sti" merge should be enough to warrant no further 'super hyper extra mega buku merges'. That particular thread and all that have been merged into it have become IMHO completely useless. Might as well delete it and let everyone start over.
On the subject of closing threads, deleting posts, etc. ... just now a newbie's thread got killed because apparently his english wasn't good enough for the rigid american english standards applied at this site (funny I don't remember reading that in the ULA I agreed to, although there is that Ministry of Truth-like blanket statement in there
) NEways... not only did he get flamed by 3 or 4 alleged adult members, but the thread was summarily closed. Quite frankly the only immature posts I saw in that thread were the last five replies, which had absolutely NOTHING useful to say (including the mod). There's an old saying that goes .. "if ya got nothin' good to say, then don't say nothin' at all." (yeah, I know, my english is slipping). Perhaps the mature thing to do would have been to kindly remind the flamers to mind their own business and stay on topic and to then also make a statement to the original poster to clean up his grammar a bit. All of this could have been handled in a mature and non-inflammatory manner... very disappointing.I would like to appeal to the moderators to please take a deep breath and count to ten before you make a split second decision like that. I would also like to applaud the fact that you have finally opened a DynoFlash vs. Vishnu forum ... please keep it an open forum and don't cave in to the temptation to start closing down threads and deleting posts. You have IMHO the best Evo forum out there right now. It has helped me tremendously and I hope it will continue to do so. But over moderation will kill it just as surely as allowing **** and unchecked flame wars would.
l8r)
Last edited by Ludikraut; May 24, 2004 at 12:21 PM.
May 24, 2004, 12:28 PM
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i have to say that the site has been cleaned up...i have to say though that sometimes thread just keep getting started over and over again and it gets kinda old...like evo's showing off volks...how many of those threads do we have....ot which wheels fit an evo or lancer or or which intake is best for my evo....things like this have gotten too repetitious...dont turn it into the 2g eclipse site where all the responses are "search"...
i also have to say that the banning of people have gotten a lil overboard in a few instances...but thats just my take on it...if people dont like what they read then leave its not that hard click the little X at the top right of your screen
but i also have to say that some of the mods are very helpful
i also have to say that the banning of people have gotten a lil overboard in a few instances...but thats just my take on it...if people dont like what they read then leave its not that hard click the little X at the top right of your screen
but i also have to say that some of the mods are very helpful
May 24, 2004, 12:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Ludikraut
On the subject of closing threads, deleting posts, etc. ... just now a newbie's thread got killed because apparently his english wasn't good enough for the rigid american english standards applied at this site NEways... not only did he get flamed by 3 or 4 alleged adult members, but the thread was summarily closed.
Quite frankly the only immature posts I saw in that thread were the last five replies, which had absolutely NOTHING useful to say (including the mod). There's an old saying that goes .. "if ya got nothin' good to say, then don't say nothin' at all." (yeah, I know, my english is slipping). Perhaps the mature thing to do would have been to kindly remind the flamers to mind their own business and stay on topic and to then also make a statement to the original poster to clean up his grammar a bit. All of this could have been handled in a mature and non-inflammatory manner... very disappointing.
But over moderation will kill it just as surely as allowing **** and unchecked flame wars would.
The first thread pretty much covered everything that needed to be said in terms of the merged threads issue (that you brought to the table yet again), therefore, there is no need for me to reiterate them to you.
Lastly, I don't know where this is occuring (feel free to point me to it), where the hell do you see **** on OUR forum? I'd REALLY REALLY would like to know.
As for the "unchecked flamewars," I have not received any notification whatsoever about any such occurrence. If I witnessed such incidents happening, I WILL eliminate the problem. Again, feel free to point me to it.
May 24, 2004, 12:54 PM
#5
I think the issue of merged threads came up before. We could stop doing this as it's really work for the mods to merge threads. It's a fine line between hundreds of the same threads or a select few. We'll probably discuss the meged threads for the future in the mod forums.
Mark
Mark
May 24, 2004, 01:04 PM
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My honest opinion.
The merger threads really do help, if people learn how to use the "Search within this thread" option. This way, you visit the merged thread, and all you have to do is run the search on what you are looking for, instead for being "forced" to rummage through the posts. Just an idea. to reitterate what Mark said, I'm sure we'll be dicussing this amongst ourselves shortly.
In regards to the "overmoderation" thing, it think you are mistaken. This board is moderated very liberally in comparionsion to places like VW Vortex, Corner Carvers, and other elitist boards. Most people here agree with tht fact that Moderators here are easy to get along with and generally abide by the rules (and yes composing a post in PROPER ENGLISH is in the rules (with the exception of OT)).I don't believe we are guilty of overmoderation by any means. But, whether we under or over moderate, no one will ever not complain.
The merger threads really do help, if people learn how to use the "Search within this thread" option. This way, you visit the merged thread, and all you have to do is run the search on what you are looking for, instead for being "forced" to rummage through the posts. Just an idea. to reitterate what Mark said, I'm sure we'll be dicussing this amongst ourselves shortly.
In regards to the "overmoderation" thing, it think you are mistaken. This board is moderated very liberally in comparionsion to places like VW Vortex, Corner Carvers, and other elitist boards. Most people here agree with tht fact that Moderators here are easy to get along with and generally abide by the rules (and yes composing a post in PROPER ENGLISH is in the rules (with the exception of OT)).I don't believe we are guilty of overmoderation by any means. But, whether we under or over moderate, no one will ever not complain.
May 24, 2004, 01:38 PM
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LancerEvoMR,
The requested link: https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/sh...ad.php?t=81999
My statement:
Your question:
My clarification: I did not say that there is **** or that there are unchecked flame wars going on. To praphrase my sentence: If you were to allow **** and flame wars to rampage unchecked through your forums, it would kill it. The same thing can be said for going the route of over moderating a forum.
Why are you getting so defensive? This is not a tribunal or court-martial ... it's merely a discussion.
Crazylizard,
Where does it state that PROPER ENGLISH is required? The current Forum rules that have to be agreed to as of this morning are:
A link to any other rules would be greatly appreciated. Furthermore, if such a rule exists, then I'd like to truly see it enforced (i.e. no sentence fragments allowed, proper punctuation, no split infinitives, etc.). Yes, I know I'm being asinine about this, but with some of the posts I've seen on these forums, saying that proper english is required is being hypocritical at best.
To the mods at large,
I know the topic of thread merges has been brought up before and I would have posted in the previous thread merge thread (now that's a mouthfull), but it was closed. Therefore I elected to open a new topic. I really do try to not open new threads when I don't have to and I use most of the advanced search features regularly (for example, you didn't see me post a "Hi I'm new, what should I do to my car thread").
All I'm doing with this thread is to point out some things that I've noticed. I'm not trying to flame everyone into obilivion, I'm offering what I hope will be deemed constructive criticism. As I stated in my initial post, you guys run a great site and I'm just voicing my opinion and trying to get you guys to perhaps take a "look before you leap" stance when deciding on things like closing threads or merging threads or other moderation tasks.
l8r)
The requested link: https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/sh...ad.php?t=81999
My statement:
Originally Posted by ludikraut
...But over moderation will kill it just as surely as allowing **** and unchecked flame wars would...
Originally Posted by LancerEvoMR
..Lastly, I don't know where this is occuring (feel free to point me to it), where the hell do you see **** on OUR forum? I'd REALLY REALLY would like to know...As for the "unchecked flamewars," I have not received any notification whatsoever about any such occurrence...
Why are you getting so defensive? This is not a tribunal or court-martial ... it's merely a discussion.
Crazylizard,
Where does it state that PROPER ENGLISH is required? The current Forum rules that have to be agreed to as of this morning are:
Forum Rules
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Although the administrators and moderators of evolutionm.net will attempt to keep all objectionable messages off this forum, it is impossible for us to review all messages. All messages express the views of the author, and neither the owners of evolutionm.net, nor Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. (developers of vBulletin) will be held responsible for the content of any message.
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I have read, and agree to abide by the evolutionm.net rules.
Registration to this forum is free! We do insist that you abide by the rules and policies detailed below. If you agree to the terms, please check the 'I agree' checkbox and press the 'Register' button below. If you would like to cancel the registration, click here to return to the forums index.
Although the administrators and moderators of evolutionm.net will attempt to keep all objectionable messages off this forum, it is impossible for us to review all messages. All messages express the views of the author, and neither the owners of evolutionm.net, nor Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd. (developers of vBulletin) will be held responsible for the content of any message.
By agreeing to these rules, you warrant that you will not post any messages that are obscene, vulgar, sexually-orientated, hateful, threatening, or otherwise violative of any laws.
The owners of evolutionm.net reserve the right to remove, edit, move or close any thread for any reason.
I have read, and agree to abide by the evolutionm.net rules.
To the mods at large,
I know the topic of thread merges has been brought up before and I would have posted in the previous thread merge thread (now that's a mouthfull), but it was closed. Therefore I elected to open a new topic. I really do try to not open new threads when I don't have to and I use most of the advanced search features regularly (for example, you didn't see me post a "Hi I'm new, what should I do to my car thread").
All I'm doing with this thread is to point out some things that I've noticed. I'm not trying to flame everyone into obilivion, I'm offering what I hope will be deemed constructive criticism. As I stated in my initial post, you guys run a great site and I'm just voicing my opinion and trying to get you guys to perhaps take a "look before you leap" stance when deciding on things like closing threads or merging threads or other moderation tasks.
l8r)
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May 24, 2004, 01:46 PM
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Originally Posted by KK
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The following rules apply to all members of evolutionm.net. They are instated to ensure a well-run board and to embrace meaningful discussions related to the Mitsubishi Lancer:
No vendor advertising unless registered with our site. For advertising information please click here.
Before posting a question, please conduct a search for an answer and check our Newbie forum.
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Posting in all CAPS is forbidden. If the majority of a message if determined to be made up of CAPS it will be deleted and the user will be warned.
The following applies to all but the Off-Topic forum and all Regional Forums: The contents of every message SHOULD be written with proper English. If you have been warned and the content is not corrected within 24 hours, your message will be deleted.
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May 24, 2004, 01:46 PM
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I'm sure Ralph will give you a heads up on why he closed that thread.
As far as me being defensive, hardly. You wanna bring this issue to our table, I'll gladly defend my position as well as my other Units.
As far as me being defensive, hardly. You wanna bring this issue to our table, I'll gladly defend my position as well as my other Units.
May 24, 2004, 01:52 PM
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Mods are here for a reason, a good one at that, this is a great site, without them to keep things civil, clean...etc, it would just turn into a ****/hate chat room...etc Also, the rules say that the owners (KK) who empowers the mods, can remove, edit, delete...etc any thread, post for any reason. On the other hand, I won't name names, but for some mods to say everyone needs to act like adults is ridiculuous, because regardless of their age, they too can act childish, maybe the power to use the delete button goes to their heads. Again, just constructive criticism, but i'm sure my post will get deleted anyway.
May 24, 2004, 01:56 PM
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Originally Posted by jaymz916
On the other hand, I won't name names, but for some mods to say everyone needs to act like adults is ridiculuous, because regardless of their age, they too can act childish, maybe the power to use the delete button goes to their heads.
Again, just constructive criticism, but i'm sure my post will get deleted anyway.
INTRODUCING THE GANGSTA FROM DOWN UNDA......RALPH!!!!!
May 24, 2004, 01:58 PM
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Got it.
Originally Posted by Crzylizard
i didn't say it was in the ULA. It said it was in the forum rules, which are listed in the Annocement in each of the forums.
Hehe, I guess I should read through the announcements section one of these days.
Alright, I'll ask one last thing, and then I'll stop pestering all of you (for a while
). The rules state that "The contents of every message SHOULD be written with proper English. If you have been warned and the content is not corrected within 24 hours, your message will be deleted." Why wasn't the guy whose post I linked to warned and given a chance to edit his post?Sorry to rant, it just rubs me the wrong way when you have a new member posting and instead of being made welcome they get the equivalent to a kick in the teeth. I've seen it a couple of times now (please don't ask me to dig up the links). I guess I'd just like to see something more along the lines of "Hey, quit flaming the new guy ... and Mr. Newb, please edit your post into something more along the lines of proper English, or we will close this thread."
l8r)
PS.: LancerEvoMR, yeah of course you should defend your position, but what's with the SHOUTING, dude?
Last edited by Ludikraut; May 24, 2004 at 02:02 PM.
May 24, 2004, 02:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Ludikraut
.... NEways... not only did he get flamed by 3 or 4 alleged adult members, but the thread was summarily closed. Quite frankly the only immature posts I saw in that thread were the last five replies, which had absolutely NOTHING useful to say (including the mod). There's an old saying that goes .. "if ya got nothin' good to say, then don't say nothin' at all." (yeah, I know, my english is slipping). Perhaps the mature thing to do would have been to kindly remind the flamers to mind their own business and stay on topic and to then also make a statement to the original poster to clean up his grammar a bit. All of this could have been handled in a mature and non-inflammatory manner... very disappointing.
1. Flaming.
2. It was a pointless Newbie thead that has been asked and answered over and over on these forums.
3. Not written properly
When it comes to threads that need corrective action, we have a few things we can do.
a. If the thread has any technical merit, it can be cleaned of those flaming posts and left open.
b. If the thread has little or no technical merit, it can just be closed.
c. If the thread is excessively inappropriate, it will be closed and trashed.
I chose action b because I felt the thread lacked tech merit and it also contained flaming. That was a judgement call. Sure, I could have warned the individual for this. But that would be too severe of a punishment. I closed the thread and pm'd the thread starter to let him know why I closed the thread.
Regarding the proper use of English on this site, no one is asking for members to write in perfectly executed English prose. But purposely writing in gangster talk rubs lots of people the wrong way. This isn't urbanricer.com where you will find countless suburban kids trying to act 'hard' with the gangsta slang they learned while watching tv.
Speaking clearly and correctly is the only way a person (or their questions) are taken seriously in the world of grown-ups. This site is owned and operated by grown-ups. So the rules and regs that are in place reflect the views of grown-ups.
SC~
Last edited by Secret Chimp; May 24, 2004 at 02:06 PM.
May 24, 2004, 02:03 PM
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Ooooo......that does it, this puppy is clean. Put a fork in it, it's a rap, the fat lady has sung, it's OVA! Bomb Squad out.
Oh well, this thread was fun while it lasted.
Oh well, this thread was fun while it lasted.
May 24, 2004, 02:05 PM
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Originally Posted by LancerEvoMR
Negative. I don't know why you even said that your post will get deleted.