So what is the proper way to scale the Timing map? Do you just dial in 220 230 240 etc etc?

 

so what about the VVT map for the IX's...?

 

a factory scaled maps dont mean its a 1/2 *** job. You can get a wonderful tune using them. It all depends on the car since everyone is a little different. If your tuning philosophy is to tune on the ragged edge then ya you probably need to adjust the resolution in some areas. But this is a pretty good idea for a thread. good job on starting it up.

 

another way tuner could rip somebody off is if they spent say $25k on a car being built & it ends up running SLOWER than it did with stock turbo. seems to be the trend in AZ. down there big turbo means slow

 

well said lemmonhead, I would add that the same applies to most of the "one size fits all" commandments. as an example, the mutt commandment, really isn't necessary in order to do 2 byte or anything else. Or the big steps in a map, sometimes they are correct.

 

Honestly, this thread is horrible. Every single point that you made is VERY conditional, and I don't think any of them apply to tuning a fully stock car (which is very beneficial)

Everyone has different needs, these may be clues that your tuner didn't know exactly what was going on... but there are also instances where you are just paying for a full boost tune, not a street tune, etc, etc, etc.

Did you guys know that some of the roms (88950015) have higher timing in the high load, low octane maps than the high load, high octane maps? Did you know that boost cut can be valuable, but some people just don't want it? Did you ever think that sometimes people might want high and low octane maps that were the same?

It is not at all required to log the 2 byte values to tune properly. It is totally possible to tune a car very well with the stock MUT table

While not generally preferential some drastic changes even occur in the stock fuel and timing maps... big surprise!

Some people also want higher resolution in their low load cells. Cars that are daily driven but heavily modded probably find this particularly valuable. This, just like most everything else in here can be user/tuner preference and is not necessarily a sign of someone who doesn't know what they are doing.

Just about the only thing that you said that is generally correct is about the scaled injectors... but only applies if you have non-stock injectors. Maf scaling is not necessary either, or my car that is definitely in your "requires maf scaling" category wouldn't run perfect on fresh power and start with the stock table.



You should add a whole lot of "ifs" to your post or just remove it. I can't even imagine the headache you just created for some poor, professional, awesome tuners who are doing a perfectly good job.

What you are saying is similar to saying you need to replace a whole car if the engine goes bad. Sometimes, (and very often for that matter) the things that you have mentioned are not indicative of a bad tune in any way!

 

My point: Tuners should understand and utilize the purpose of High/Low Octane maps. Setting them the same is LAZY.

My point: People who pay for a tune on low to moderate boost should always keep fuel cut customized to their application. Turning off fuel cut for all customers, regardless of their needs is LAZY.

My point: People who pay for a tune are trusting their car's health towards someone they see as an expert in the field. Again, making it the "status quo" to set them the same, just because the customer doesn't know any better is LAZY.

My point: I don't think anyone questions whether or not its POSSIBLE... but if you are sending someone logs of your car, and expecting them to update your fuel & timing maps, then without proper MUT table changes, the tuner is making GUESSES as to which cells to change because they are too LAZY.

My point: It's easy to spot when a tuner simply selected a small block of cells and changed their values by a large amount, or set them all to be the same value. This type of "block tuning" is LAZY.

My point: There is no value to keeping rows and rows of duplicate cells. My beef is with tuners who don't care about those cells, and leave the duplicates there... the ECU is capable of much more precision with a 5 minute change that is re-scaling the load & RPM scales. Leaving rows and rows of duplicate entries is LAZY.

My point: People need to understand that just because they have a non-stock intake and/or injectors, they should not have to live with poor idle/cruise on cold-start or if they reset their fuel trims.

 

Welcome to two years ago.

 

Good points, and I know where you are coming from..Most of the big money guys can't be bothered with stuff like this but at the same time it is not always necessary and there are ways around it. But I would never tune without a solid log to point me where I need to be, as I have seen some people do..I have seen some really bad things lol

 

haha yeah, this thread will probably be locked soon too.

 

Setting the timing maps the same is not lazy. There are reasons that we are beginning to understand more and more the deeper we dig.

The fuel map you have has violent changes becuase of the lean spool being on. You didnt know what it would look like but that doesnt make it lame.

If we are gonna get on this topic, any tuner that doesnt include a knocklight must be lame too? Its a nice safety feature for the end user but hardly needed for 20psi tunes on a mostly stock turbo.

The conclusions you make have nothing to do with lazy. Most people dont need all the TOP FUEL mods to a ROM becuase they have a mild build that isnt on the edge.

 

Good idea, bad execution.

 

Thanks for the post r3compile, it's very informative for people such as me who don't know how to tune via Ecuflash.

Can you read an Ecutek tune with the above equipment as I would like to understand my settings & to be able to view logs & datalog my vehicle at some stage? I'm not sure whether the ecu can be locked via ecutek, can anyone put some light on this?

Thanks all.

Steve

 

good write up

 

useful infos!