Why? Skyline has a smaller stroke, makes more power on average in terms of a Stock bottom end and Modded. Just wana hear why is all.....

 

Alright!!!! an answer to my question which brings me to another question.....
How can i achieve the best of both worlds then. 7000 nothing less to 8000 rpm limit and the durability that would last me until im too old to drive?

what kind of work needs to be done to achieve this feat?

which one 2.2, 2.3, or 2.4?

 

You are trying to find out the effects of displacement change, on power potential. This is extremely specific.

By comparing two entirely different engines, with nearly all factors big (valve area, turbo & tract flow characteristics, cooling system design, component strength, , cam duration, lift, phasing, etc.) and small (journal dia. and widths, heat exchanger surface area and access to clean air, etc.), a specific comparison cannot be made. You will not find a comparison in any two differenct street engines. You will not even find a comparison in race engines of the same class because there are STILL differences.

You need to either run some single cylinder tests of your own where all other variables are held as constant as possible, or read the test results of others who who have clearly shown their results to be in line with physics, and accept that as truth. From Ricardo in the early 1900s, to Taylor (1960s), to Heywood (late 80s), and Blair and Lumley (late 90s), the fundamentals have been solidly established.

 

You need to be extremely specific about budget, min. power target, application, min. teardown interval (in race miles) desired.

Best of both worlds doesn't exist without a ton of money. Free of racing regulation, design and manufacture of one off pieces using the best materials and processes easily sends the price of a complete 4G63 into the 6 digits... very possibly 7 depending on who you hire.

Outside of custom design and manufacture, all else is compromise. For longevity, you want to avoid high engine speed, excessive heat, excessively high combustion pressure. For power, you want huge bores and large valve areas, efficient ports, strong and lightweight rotating assembly and valvetrain, and an absolutely strong and stiff block to keep bore concentricity and stability. High engine speed is never a target. High engine speed is a result of pursuing the highest engine displacement/mass/space [packaging] specific outputs - given regulations on engine displacement, or vehicle weight and size.

Regulations removed..... high RPM sounds good, but there is a difference between sounding good, and actually going fast and lasting long on a non-multi-millionaire budget.

 

i think i just pissed my pants.....a whooping 6 digit figure price is scurry!!!

anyways i dont have that kind of moolas!! although i want a car unlike any other.
im not really a drag fan. becuz i just feel like 4g63 are not meant for drag. im more of a circuit kind of guy. time attack!! thats why i got the evo.

power target.... 400awhp but a motor still capable of 500awhp once all supporting mods are added just to be on the safe side.
willing to spend as much as 10k on just the motor itself.

i just notice that alot of tuners out there are focusing more on squeezing out the most power out of a stock motor. supporting mods are added once the get they're hands on the evo.

I for one want to make the 4g63 a more dependable and monstrous engine than it already is.
what i really want is a strong motor. wider rpm range is not really necessary for me as long as the turbo spools alot sooner and rpm range does not decrease less than stock form (7000)

GUys im heading to work on my motor first and i need ideas where to start what to ask for as far as what my goal and desire are.
Im going to Vishnu sometime soon and a tuner called torquefreaks near my area.
But i still want you and others opinion on this topic. thanks guyz

 

What kind of dyno are you talking about for your 400 whp/500 whp? The driveline loss varies quite a bit between dyno types.

to make 450 - 500 CRANK hp, you can do that with a turbo kit, cams, and a clutch on the stock block and easily rev to 7500 - 7800 rpm.

 

sorry but i dont think you understand what i was trying to say.

i want a motor capable of 400whp-500whp.
i know just by working on the motor itself w/out supporting mods such as bolt on and such, i wont get the 400whp.

i want to work on the motor first. Beef it up. so it can easly handle a 500whp no sweat.

 

I think I do. Dynos read differently, but you can use crank hp as a common denomenator.

For example A Dyno Dynamics might read the equivelent of 500 crank hp at 360 whp, where a Mustang Dyno or another make might read the same car, identical conditions at 400 whp.

https://www.evolutionm.net/forums/sh...ht=dynomometer

That's why I say, define your dyno standard, then build accordingly.

An AMS turbo kit with their 3076 turbo will put you at around 400 whp on a dyno dynamics and the dyno AMS uses (not a Dyno Dynamics) reads iirc 430-450 depending on cams, tune, intercooler.

Vishnu has some stuff coming up too. Unless you want the huge hp that will blow freeze plugs on a stroker motor, the 2 Liter will keep the reliability in check. Buscher has some cool stuff too. Road Race engineering same etc... .

By the time you are done with all the goodies for this kind of hp, expect to spend between $10 and $15K - if you don't break anything (that's including installation, clutch, cams, turbokit, intercooler, brake upgrades, headstuds, tune, standalone or piggyback, a little suspension work...). Maybe a little less if you don't get too carried away.

 

I'd say stick with the 2.0 and just go forged. That was my route.
Al and TT are both on the 2.0 and making massive power.

 

so what you guys are trying to say is a 2.0 is more realiable than a 2.2-2.3-2.4? I thought increasing displacement is a way to match reliability with and when increasing power.

al and tt are making massive power, right but theyre cars are meant for drag strip.
i want a car thats able to run more on the streets than the strip. i want my car to have endurance.
like i said b4 im more of a circuit type of guy but with overwhelming power on the wheels.


also what was shaun saying that an increase in displacement with more low end torque will have less friction therefore long engine life?? i was about to believe him there for a sec. until you guys suggested to stay on the 2.0

also im not really worried about what dyno im going to be running in. if im not mistaken all dyno types will slightly vary from the other. I dont think i've seen someone dynoed there car, came up with a whooping 410whp then goes to another and comes up with 310whp.
as long all dynoes will post well in between 400-500whp then im good. But correct me if im wrong.

 

Longer stroke, the more forces your motor is taking. Same reason why you can't rev as high or it'll blow. Short stroke motors make more WHP but less torque (ON THE 4G63 BLOCK)

 

I would love to see the effects of taking a stock EVO tune it to optimal HP/TQ levels on a given dyno... Then stroke it as the only mod retune and see the differences keeping stock rev limits.

I would love to see the effects (same dyno) to low end TQ, spool. overall HP/TQ and the "negative" aspects of the upgrade that many keep refering to. I suspect it would result in more "positive" results in terms of street use /autoX power use than negative ones...

Anyone done or heard of this actually tested?

 

This is absolutely true. For a given power level, turning less RPM will extend service life. This is done by raising displacement, or raising boost. The latter option at some point is not an option because it narrows the effective operating range engine speed and load wise, of the turbocharger.

Avoid RPM, live long... it is simple. I do not understand why people cannot grasp this concept. Name one engine that has increased engine speed (RPM) and lived longer.

You are like me. I like both ends of the road course racing stuff - one being time attack, other being endurance.

Don't believe the other guys. Don't believe me either. Look throughout history at race engines and how top engine developers achieve longevity. Look at which type of street engines last the longest. Spend about 100 dollars and pick up an authoritative textbook on the spark ignition internal combustion engine. Read and observe as much as you can and notice the strong trends.

 

thanks....
i think i'll do that...but what are the major engine components that needs beefing up to gain such power and durability??

 

well that's what im trying to find out!!! i dont see anybody doing this.... i dont know whether its a good idea or most tuners just like to work on the obvious.