Clarification between the 4G63 and EVO engine
Oct 9, 2005, 03:47 PM
#17
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Very interesting thread. What about cylinder head interchangeability? Will any 4g63 head bolt up to the Evo8 block and have all the necessary accessory provisions?
Oct 9, 2005, 03:51 PM
#19
Unfortunately no because, mainly the 4-8 were reversed. The timing belt was on the opposite side, as the Evo4-8 have belts on the right hand side.
The best engine, in my opinion, concieved from factory only parts would be a Galant engine with Evo 8 rods, pistons and the Evo III 16g. It would use a 1G cylinder head and Evo cams.
The Evo 8 turbo is much better, no doubt but we're considering interchangeability, not an option in this theoritical situation I created.
The best engine, in my opinion, concieved from factory only parts would be a Galant engine with Evo 8 rods, pistons and the Evo III 16g. It would use a 1G cylinder head and Evo cams.
The Evo 8 turbo is much better, no doubt but we're considering interchangeability, not an option in this theoritical situation I created.
Oct 9, 2005, 05:20 PM
#20
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Some clarification:
US GVR4 in 91-92 did NOT come with cyclone intake...they are identicle to 90-91 DSM engine other than intake and intercooler piping.
There are LOTS of similarities between DSM turbo engines and the evo8 engine, BUT the differances are enough to make actual interchangability completely unrealistic.
There are some things about the evo8 engine that are almost funny how much they are the same as dsm engines. It's like they seriously just took a 2g turbo block, and stuck it in an evo8 backwards.
US GVR4 in 91-92 did NOT come with cyclone intake...they are identicle to 90-91 DSM engine other than intake and intercooler piping.
There are LOTS of similarities between DSM turbo engines and the evo8 engine, BUT the differances are enough to make actual interchangability completely unrealistic.
There are some things about the evo8 engine that are almost funny how much they are the same as dsm engines. It's like they seriously just took a 2g turbo block, and stuck it in an evo8 backwards.
Oct 9, 2005, 05:41 PM
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Originally Posted by VTEC Killer
2nd GEN DSM Turbo, 7 bolt crank, prone to crank walk, 4G63T engine ***note, the internal parts from this motor, including valves, rods, crank are all identical to the EVO4-9 motor. this motor also has a slightly different and better flowing cylinder head then the 1G DSM *** Pistons are a little different due to valve pocket size and location***
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Oct 24, 2007, 06:16 AM
#24
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I know this is sort of off topic but how do the EVO 8-9 rods compare to the rods of the 90-91 4G63 DSM. I know the 93-99 DSMs had weaker rods than the 90-91 "big rods" as they were referred to but how do the EVO's compare?
BTW, the EVO motor is obviously just a newer better version of the 4G63. Its just improved! Also, since its reversed, it cant be dropped in DSMs and things alike, but that doesnt make it not a classic 4G63
BTW, the EVO motor is obviously just a newer better version of the 4G63. Its just improved! Also, since its reversed, it cant be dropped in DSMs and things alike, but that doesnt make it not a classic 4G63
Oct 24, 2007, 06:34 AM
#25
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the engine numenclature might be the same but evo's were made by ralliart hence the internals were different compared to the 4G63 we know about in the DSM. From Evo 1-9, there is a different factory that manufactures evolutions altogether and from previous spec sheets of evo IV-IX, there were a lot of improvements of this engine which makes it unique to the evolution model only.
Oct 24, 2007, 06:39 AM
#26
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ok im gonna break this down the best I can
Please note all these motors are original layout, engine on the driver side, tranny on the passenger side
1st Gen DSM turbo, has a 6 bolt crank, stonger rods, the big end of the rod is wider, comes with a 4G63T
1st GEN Non-Turbo Eclipse. Talon, Laser. non turbo, 7 bolt crank comes with a 4G63 (notice no " T " since its not turbo)
2nd GEN DSM Turbo, 7 bolt crank, prone to crank walk, 4G63T engine ***note, the internal parts from this motor, including valves, rods, crank are all identical to the EVO4-9 motor. this motor also has a slightly different and better flowing cylinder head then the 1G DSM *** Pistons are a little different due to valve pocket size and location***
2nd GEN Non-Turbo Eclipse, Talon, Laser. Comes with a 420A motor, its a Chryler motor, same as found in the older Neon.
US or JDM Spec Galant VR4 1991 and 1992 for the US models. Same motor as the 1st GEN DSM turbo, however it has a "cyclone" intake manifold. Slightly different design.
EVO I, II, III Same motor as the 2G DSM motor, except a different turbo, better flowing exhaust manifold.
Now this is when things change up a bit. Now the 4G63T engine becomes transverse, which means they flip it 180 degrees in the engine bay. So now the engine is on the passenger side and tranny is on the driver side.
EVO4-8 Transverse mounted 4G63T, same DESIGN as the 2nd GEN Eclipse engine but with improvements, better oil squirter design to eliminate the problem of crank walking. Various different cam designs, solid cams, hollow cams, different fuel mapping in the ECU. Better flowing intake and exhaust manifolds. Different turbochargers. They made improvements as each new model was released
All the 4G63T and 4G63 engines are pretty much the same design, slight updates here and there but overall the same functions, same parts, etc. Mitsu new they were onto a good thing when they built that motor, thats why hear we are 15 years later and they are still using it.
Hope this helps.
Please note all these motors are original layout, engine on the driver side, tranny on the passenger side
1st Gen DSM turbo, has a 6 bolt crank, stonger rods, the big end of the rod is wider, comes with a 4G63T
1st GEN Non-Turbo Eclipse. Talon, Laser. non turbo, 7 bolt crank comes with a 4G63 (notice no " T " since its not turbo)
2nd GEN DSM Turbo, 7 bolt crank, prone to crank walk, 4G63T engine ***note, the internal parts from this motor, including valves, rods, crank are all identical to the EVO4-9 motor. this motor also has a slightly different and better flowing cylinder head then the 1G DSM *** Pistons are a little different due to valve pocket size and location***
2nd GEN Non-Turbo Eclipse, Talon, Laser. Comes with a 420A motor, its a Chryler motor, same as found in the older Neon.
US or JDM Spec Galant VR4 1991 and 1992 for the US models. Same motor as the 1st GEN DSM turbo, however it has a "cyclone" intake manifold. Slightly different design.
EVO I, II, III Same motor as the 2G DSM motor, except a different turbo, better flowing exhaust manifold.
Now this is when things change up a bit. Now the 4G63T engine becomes transverse, which means they flip it 180 degrees in the engine bay. So now the engine is on the passenger side and tranny is on the driver side.
EVO4-8 Transverse mounted 4G63T, same DESIGN as the 2nd GEN Eclipse engine but with improvements, better oil squirter design to eliminate the problem of crank walking. Various different cam designs, solid cams, hollow cams, different fuel mapping in the ECU. Better flowing intake and exhaust manifolds. Different turbochargers. They made improvements as each new model was released
All the 4G63T and 4G63 engines are pretty much the same design, slight updates here and there but overall the same functions, same parts, etc. Mitsu new they were onto a good thing when they built that motor, thats why hear we are 15 years later and they are still using it.
Hope this helps.
Oct 24, 2007, 06:50 AM
#28
I have seen a 7-bolt crank from a 2G DSM be dropped into an evo, with crower rods (made for a 2G as well) get put in that same motor. They are very very very very very similar. The thing that has changed the most over the years is the head. Evo head flows sooo much better than DSMs ever did.
Oct 24, 2007, 07:35 AM
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ok im gonna break this down the best I can
Please note all these motors are original layout, engine on the driver side, tranny on the passenger side
1st Gen DSM turbo, has a 6 bolt crank, stonger rods, the big end of the rod is wider, comes with a 4G63T
1st GEN Non-Turbo Eclipse. Talon, Laser. non turbo, 7 bolt crank comes with a 4G63 (notice no " T " since its not turbo)
2nd GEN DSM Turbo, 7 bolt crank, prone to crank walk, 4G63T engine ***note, the internal parts from this motor, including valves, rods, crank are all identical to the EVO4-9 motor. this motor also has a slightly different and better flowing cylinder head then the 1G DSM *** Pistons are a little different due to valve pocket size and location***
2nd GEN Non-Turbo Eclipse, Talon, Laser. Comes with a 420A motor, its a Chryler motor, same as found in the older Neon.
US or JDM Spec Galant VR4 1991 and 1992 for the US models. Same motor as the 1st GEN DSM turbo, however it has a "cyclone" intake manifold. Slightly different design.
EVO I, II, III Same motor as the 2G DSM motor, except a different turbo, better flowing exhaust manifold.
Now this is when things change up a bit. Now the 4G63T engine becomes transverse, which means they flip it 180 degrees in the engine bay. So now the engine is on the passenger side and tranny is on the driver side.
EVO4-8 Transverse mounted 4G63T, same DESIGN as the 2nd GEN Eclipse engine but with improvements, better oil squirter design to eliminate the problem of crank walking. Various different cam designs, solid cams, hollow cams, different fuel mapping in the ECU. Better flowing intake and exhaust manifolds. Different turbochargers. They made improvements as each new model was released
All the 4G63T and 4G63 engines are pretty much the same design, slight updates here and there but overall the same functions, same parts, etc. Mitsu new they were onto a good thing when they built that motor, thats why hear we are 15 years later and they are still using it.
Hope this helps.
Please note all these motors are original layout, engine on the driver side, tranny on the passenger side
1st Gen DSM turbo, has a 6 bolt crank, stonger rods, the big end of the rod is wider, comes with a 4G63T
1st GEN Non-Turbo Eclipse. Talon, Laser. non turbo, 7 bolt crank comes with a 4G63 (notice no " T " since its not turbo)
2nd GEN DSM Turbo, 7 bolt crank, prone to crank walk, 4G63T engine ***note, the internal parts from this motor, including valves, rods, crank are all identical to the EVO4-9 motor. this motor also has a slightly different and better flowing cylinder head then the 1G DSM *** Pistons are a little different due to valve pocket size and location***
2nd GEN Non-Turbo Eclipse, Talon, Laser. Comes with a 420A motor, its a Chryler motor, same as found in the older Neon.
US or JDM Spec Galant VR4 1991 and 1992 for the US models. Same motor as the 1st GEN DSM turbo, however it has a "cyclone" intake manifold. Slightly different design.
EVO I, II, III Same motor as the 2G DSM motor, except a different turbo, better flowing exhaust manifold.
Now this is when things change up a bit. Now the 4G63T engine becomes transverse, which means they flip it 180 degrees in the engine bay. So now the engine is on the passenger side and tranny is on the driver side.
EVO4-8 Transverse mounted 4G63T, same DESIGN as the 2nd GEN Eclipse engine but with improvements, better oil squirter design to eliminate the problem of crank walking. Various different cam designs, solid cams, hollow cams, different fuel mapping in the ECU. Better flowing intake and exhaust manifolds. Different turbochargers. They made improvements as each new model was released
All the 4G63T and 4G63 engines are pretty much the same design, slight updates here and there but overall the same functions, same parts, etc. Mitsu new they were onto a good thing when they built that motor, thats why hear we are 15 years later and they are still using it.
Hope this helps.
When you get right down to it, every 4G63 is an iron block, closed deck, aluminum head DOHC. Bore and stroke remain unchanged no matter what side the transmissions sits.. Each iteration get tweaks meant to imporive something, or mitigate terrible things like emissions...( major reason for the 2G's little ports...)
Last edited by 4G63DSM; Oct 24, 2007 at 07:39 AM. Reason: more info
