stock IC - bottleneck for a green turbo?
Does this concept of the IX bumper causing such a restriction to even those who are looking at upgrading their FMIC while on stock turbos? Should I disregard this in my scenario too?
Don't mean to hi-jack Abner, I'll delete if you want
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Don't mean to hi-jack Abner, I'll delete if you want
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Wasnt the IX bumper design already been proven to be better design then the VIII?
According to Corky Bell's book on Designing Turbo Charged Systems, "Maximum Boost" on page 58, it shows a similar design to the IX's (roughly speaking) as being "better" that the VIII's "poor". (his ratings are: poor - better - best)
The best design according to him would be a slightly smaller opening than the IC cooling plate area, that would actaully be slightly tilted inwards to gather the air and force it though the fins. Sorry I don't have a way to diagram it all, but put simply:
*Poor: The air can run around the outside edges on a wide open inlet
Poor Example: ________ the solid line represents the fin area, nothing to stop the air from flowing around the IC's edges
*The "Better" Example: Below,the air gets directed to and through the fins with the "scoop" that has walls that angled outwards (wider in front to narrower at the IC.)
\______/ solid line is the fin area - air flow is from top to bottom
*The "Best" Example: Below, the slightly smaller than fin area opeing that gets wider as it goes towards the IC is "BEST" in his theory because it "forces" the most air through the fins.
/______\ same deal, only opening is smaller - air flow is from top to bottom
^ The IX = The best design ..
Another thing, why are you trying to use an intercooler desgined for 300hp when you're trying to pass that by as much possible?
According to Corky Bell's book on Designing Turbo Charged Systems, "Maximum Boost" on page 58, it shows a similar design to the IX's (roughly speaking) as being "better" that the VIII's "poor". (his ratings are: poor - better - best)
The best design according to him would be a slightly smaller opening than the IC cooling plate area, that would actaully be slightly tilted inwards to gather the air and force it though the fins. Sorry I don't have a way to diagram it all, but put simply:
*Poor: The air can run around the outside edges on a wide open inlet
Poor Example: ________ the solid line represents the fin area, nothing to stop the air from flowing around the IC's edges
*The "Better" Example: Below,the air gets directed to and through the fins with the "scoop" that has walls that angled outwards (wider in front to narrower at the IC.)
\______/ solid line is the fin area - air flow is from top to bottom
*The "Best" Example: Below, the slightly smaller than fin area opeing that gets wider as it goes towards the IC is "BEST" in his theory because it "forces" the most air through the fins.
/______\ same deal, only opening is smaller - air flow is from top to bottom
^ The IX = The best design ..
Another thing, why are you trying to use an intercooler desgined for 300hp when you're trying to pass that by as much possible?
interesting i'd like to find out more about which front bumper has better flow.
sikrsix what you're saying makes sense, but directing air can't beat ALLOWING more air which is an issue with surface area, or how exposed a FMIC is IMHO.
sikrsix what you're saying makes sense, but directing air can't beat ALLOWING more air which is an issue with surface area, or how exposed a FMIC is IMHO.
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one thing to consider is that many if not most of the bigger intercoolers are considerably thicker then the stock intercooler. the extra area on the endcaps isn't going to make as big of a difference as a 50-100%increase in thickness. regardless of which bumper you have, the 8 or 9, thickness will benefit you, whereas the extra frontal area may not with the 9.
I made over 400 whp as can be seen in my signature on the stock FMIC and piping, stock airbox also. On another car we ran it 3 times with an APS upgraded intercooler. Recorded boost pressure and HP numbers. We switched back to the stock intercooler on the dyno. We gained roughtly 1 to 1.5 hp by switching to the stock FMIC. This car had a WR-9 turbo (20G-9-5 with TME internals). It made in 420 whp range and 450 ft lbs of torque.
IMO, an upgraded FMIC will help out in the warmer weather, but when the air temps are 60 degrees or less, the stock FMIC will do a fine job even with the bigger stock based turbos.
IMO, an upgraded FMIC will help out in the warmer weather, but when the air temps are 60 degrees or less, the stock FMIC will do a fine job even with the bigger stock based turbos.
I made over 400 whp as can be seen in my signature on the stock FMIC and piping, stock airbox also. On another car we ran it 3 times with an APS upgraded intercooler. Recorded boost pressure and HP numbers. We switched back to the stock intercooler on the dyno. We gained roughtly 1 to 1.5 hp by switching to the stock FMIC. This car had a WR-9 turbo (20G-9-5 with TME internals). It made in 420 whp range and 450 ft lbs of torque.
IMO, an upgraded FMIC will help out in the warmer weather, but when the air temps are 60 degrees or less, the stock FMIC will do a fine job even with the bigger stock based turbos.
IMO, an upgraded FMIC will help out in the warmer weather, but when the air temps are 60 degrees or less, the stock FMIC will do a fine job even with the bigger stock based turbos.
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Exactly my thoughts on the subject as well. For us stock/stock like turbo guys in Texas a larger i/c is more of a detonation deterrent during the sweltering summers. So for us it's more of the heat=detonation, less heat=less chance of detonation, less chance of detonation=more reliable power on the table. I know for me, any power I picked up from the addition of my AMS i/c was icing on the cake
My VIII made 409whp on a Dyno4mance Dyno Dynamics with the stock IC, which reads typical of the lower reading DDs. I've seen other cars make clese to 450whp on the stock IC with GT3076 turbos and trap 123-124mph.
I think a Green should be fine on the stock IC. Its not a restriction in my mind until you go 35R.
I think a Green should be fine on the stock IC. Its not a restriction in my mind until you go 35R.