How much power can timing get you? went to the dyno to find out!
Sep 12, 2008, 10:05 AM
#16
I'd like to see a proof done, in this fashion, of a tuner explaining why a fully built Evo with 35R should run 22 psi on pump gas 
I mean is anyone left who still beleives 22 psi can be the right pump gas boost for your typical fully built 35R car? People run 22 psi on the stock turbo safely. And as Ted has described in this thread, your tolerance for ignition advance increases as peak torque / max boost occurs later. And also the more efficient compressor and larger hotside also contribute to higher ignition advance tolerance.
So someone explain to me why we still see fully built 35R cars only tuned for 22-23 psi on pump gas?
I mean is anyone left who still beleives 22 psi can be the right pump gas boost for your typical fully built 35R car? People run 22 psi on the stock turbo safely. And as Ted has described in this thread, your tolerance for ignition advance increases as peak torque / max boost occurs later. And also the more efficient compressor and larger hotside also contribute to higher ignition advance tolerance.
So someone explain to me why we still see fully built 35R cars only tuned for 22-23 psi on pump gas?
Maybe because some people don't want their cars to make 600whp all the time. Personally I like utilizing the car for some backroad action, and without a ****load of money in the suspension and tire setup 600hp is f**king useless. Not to mention its just that much more stress on the engine.
Sep 12, 2008, 10:42 AM
#18
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In that case, why not stick with a stock turbo, or a green and make 350-400? If you have a 35R, than you should have the supporting mods to run it, otherwise what is the point? Now, having a street tune and a track tune are two different things. But still, 22 PSI on a 35R is like running 12 PSI on a stock turbo in a sense...
Sep 12, 2008, 11:12 AM
#20
Maybe because some people don't want their cars to make 600whp all the time. Personally I like utilizing the car for some backroad action, and without a ****load of money in the suspension and tire setup 600hp is f**king useless. Not to mention its just that much more stress on the engine.
I'm just an amateur but from what I've learned over the years, thanks in part to the good people on EvoM like TedB and such, it seems like it is provable, that whatever you deem safe boost on stock turbo, can be higher with a larger turbo, while keeping the exact same safety margin, and all else being equal. It's not a guess it's fact... *I think*.
I would have so loved to see the OP of this thread, do a test, while listening or logging knock, to keep increasing boost, while retarding ignition timing, on pump fuel. My guess is he could get to around 35 psi on pump fuel safely, and probably around 30 psi he would end up not making much more power.
Sep 12, 2008, 01:56 PM
#27
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Maybe because some people don't want their cars to make 600whp all the time. Personally I like utilizing the car for some backroad action, and without a ****load of money in the suspension and tire setup 600hp is f**king useless. Not to mention its just that much more stress on the engine.
Sep 12, 2008, 02:05 PM
#28
Evolving Member
I've been wondering this same stuff since im in the middle of tunning my car. I started a thread timing vs boost but know one chimed in. I was under the impression that boost made more power than timing as long as the timing is somewhat decent and not over agressive with higher boost?
