The video is before I rebuilt the pump with the kit. Now I can't get the gauge to show anything, and I also have a second pump also not showing anything. Can you note the best way to bleed the system on the bench. See my hose in the pic above. I don't have a trans or TC now. Car is in pieces so I can't bleed it on the car. I can connect it and did, but the lack of pressure on the vague was the same for both pumps. I suspect it has too much air in there. What is the best way to bleed it on the bench using the tester?

 

your setup is ok, and I think you need more fluid in that reservoar.. I usually do not use the reservoar at all, just connect a thick clear hose, and fill that with oil. The screen in the reservoar sometimes makes it difficult for oil to get down to the pump.

AS for the pumps not working, I suspect you probably installed the plate wrong way round, and/or installed the upper pump body 180 deg out of position... Both of these result in a non functioning pump.

 

may I suggest you do the following:

1. open the pump and send pic of the installed plate
2. remove the pressure sensor and install the pressure gauge with the supplied hose adapter into that port. That way you can monitor if the pump works regardless of the solenoid valve.

 

Here some pics of the installed plate. Also, a one handed video of me first taking the pump off of the housing so you could see how the pieces lined up.









The video is at
I re-essembled the pump and just to try something I turned the upper pump body 180 degrees. So in case I had it incorrect, I was just going to trial and error try it this way. My pump is super clean and says to take apart.

I tried to flip the plate around, but from what I could tell there is no way to mount it incorrectly. Or, said differently, I could only find one way where the holes would line up. flipped around with the other side face up two of the holes would not align. So for me it was not possible to change that or have it incorrect.

When I ran the pump again, I filled up the res very full and the pump ran, and it did sound more like what I expected, since it was decreasing in pitch and likely speed. It seemed like it was building pressure. However, I could not get a pressure reading at the outlet with the kit gauge.

I began to remove the OEM wired pressure sensor, but stopped, because I remember from earlier today everything is actually under pressure and I would explode oil all of the place and on me. So I will remove that tomorrow, when I assume the internal pressure is gone, so I can place the kit gauge on that port to rule out the solenoid.

Let me know if the pics tell you anything, and I will continue tomorrow afternoon with more pics and videos. Thanks for all the help.

 

looking at the plate pic, it is wron way round.. you need to flip it 180 deg.

 

then you need to align the upper pump body so that the grooves in it follow the groves in the plate..

I'll try to dig some pics..

 

Maybe I am being dense, but I don't see any way to flip the plate around and still have the holes line up. No matter flipped faces or turned in the face it is, the holes won't line up, and I assume that means its incorrect. I take some more vids tonight.

 

I checked again, and drew up piece of paper with the old plate as a template. Then I tried to flip the plate around any way other than the only one way where the bolt holes and the opening on the plate could line up. There is only one way, so either its correct, and there is only one way, or you need to install the plate with the 4 holes not necessarily overlapping the four holes in the bottom housing.

All that said, my flipping the center housing 180 degrees last night seems to have been one of the issues, because now my original pump is sounding consistently like the junk yard one I bought; decreasing in pitch as its running. Seemingly building pressure.

I then removed the OEM pressure sensor and put the kit gauge there. When I ran the pump I quickly got 15 bar. The gauge would leak fluid from inside the unit behind the face plate significantly. I had to pop off the face plate cover to let the oil out so I could see the reading. That also told me that the pump is working.

Could the tester not be firing the solenoid properly? I don't know what properly is, but I measured the voltage. I used several different methods and all yielded inconsistent measurements, but all were well below 12V. So I wonder what the voltage should be at the wires that trigger the solenoids?

I get this as a low, and a variance of above that 1.5V.


To try and prove or disprove that the tester is chasing me around in circles, I connected the setup directly to the car. That eliminates the tester, but is using the pump exactly as it is on the bench.

For this I have to use the key ON, TPS 100%. For the first try the pump ran as expected, and my helper, my old man, noted that oil was coming out of the looped hose at the top of the reservoir. Unfortunately I was in the car, and I don't have a pic to prove this. Yet.



Now I wanted to shoot a video of that, and decided to replace the hose with the gauge. However, when I tried to run the pump again with me there and taking the vid, the pump ran for less that a second, and the gauge showed no pressure.



I am not sure how much I need to wait to expect the pump to run again, and if subsequent times fire the solenoid, etc. This kind of brings me full circle, in that I haven't been able to bleed the system (when the car was all together) in the normal way and get a stream of oil at the TC bleeder in a couple of years. Just barely a dribble. That is what had me starting all this.

After the car has sat overnight I will repeat the tests on the car and shoot a vid of that. I am also wondering what to expect at the output port; a tiny bit of oil, a lot of oil, a burst, or a steady stream? I am just wondering if the rather large hose I am using requires too much volume to show the expected pressure at the output. Since the hose is full of air and vents to the atmosphere there is not back pressure there, as there would be if the system was in the car and connected to the TC.

 

I have tried a zillion things, but am just going backwards. I now have a second pump and second solenoid. I repaired the tester to fire 12V upon every button push. I am actually not sure if the solenoid is supposed to operate with 12V or if its 4.5V. I would be curious if anyone knows that detail. I get both values at my meter at the harness plug (on the car).

In my troubleshooting to try and make the solenoid provide pressure to the output port I have been trying everything with both pumps. They seemed to behave the same. No fluid would come out of the output port, or just a tiny bit. You could feel the pressure slowly build if you put your finger over the output port, but activating the solenoid didn't make any difference. On both pumps. I don't understand that. I was expecting that when you activate the solenoid a bunch of oil should shoot out of the output port. Is that not the case?

Trying to figure that out I took my pump apart again, and made sure the grooves in the plate and the housing matched up, think side to thin side. One of the times I put it back together the motor wouldn't run. It bound up. After some investigating I could see that the pin on the shaft was marring the plate and locking up the mechanism. I don't have any idea why that would be happening now. Nothing has changed. Now no matter how I ensemble it, once I tighten the housing it won't turn easily.

Here you can see on my old and new plate, because I was trying both to figure this out, the pin marred the plate. This is what is/was binding. If I don't tighten the housing down then it spins freely. I don't understand how now, all of a sudden, the housing can be too tight and bind the pin between the plate and the housing?


Is there something that is supposed to be here at the end of the shaft to keep it shimmed up, and the pin off of the plate?


Can you tell me if the wide part of the slot should be up or down in this pic orientation. In other words do I have the plate spun correctly. The face only goes one way, but the plate can turn 180 degrees which is what kiki was getting at earlier I believe. I have now tried it a bunch of ways, but because of this problem now don't know which way around it should be. I assume the plate and the housing should line up, but the whole thing can be turned either way.


Also there are tiny dimples in the two gears. Should they face up or down on the plate?

 

OK, I took the risk and took the junk yard pump apart to see exactly how its put together so I have answers to some of my own questions. This thread is a mess and I apologize, but hopefully I can get something from it all when its done that will help someone in the future. I'll edit up the first post for folks when I am all done.

The orientation of the large side of the plate slot should be to the bottom of the pump. So opposite of the picture I have above.

It should be spun as it sits so the holes swap.


Now the problem i was having with the solenoid is a classic one, but the one thing I never checked, the only thing, was the orientation of the solenoid. You can put it in 180 degrees incorrect. Just like the plate. The bracket allows you to orient the solenoid, but it has an inner and outer side. The plug should be facing inward. After wasting countless hours, and junk yard trips, shop trips, I saw it clear as day in my own damn video.

Now both pumps run and test as would be expected, BUT I still have this weird new problem where the original pump will bind up if I tighten the bolts down, especially the inner housing bolts. If I leave them a little soft, then the shaft will spin fine. If I tighten them down like they were when I took the thing apart, then the shaft won't turn at all.

 

Hey did you buy your rebuild kit from a Canadian supplier off ebay?

If you did - the plate is too thick. And it's causing that binding problem.

The rebuild kit plate is .25mm too thick.

There really should be announcement made about this or something.

 

From what I have read that plate was designed to be thicker on purpose to help fight the corrosive elements. Can you describe why it being thicket would cause the binding? Is it forcing two elements together that it shouldn't be?

That plate is from ACD Tuning, before its weird change/demise. I believe the parts of the rebuild kit and the tester are supported by kikiturbo. However I haven't received a response from him in a bit. Maybe he can comment on the thickness/design of his plate in those kits.

.....and respond to my PM about exchanging the tester....

 

I got my rebuld kit from the Canadian guy and the motor wouldnt move. I loosened up the pumps bolts slightly and it works good now. So Im assuming its because the plate is too thick now that I read this.

 

Oh ok. So people have had success with the thicker plate. I have to take apart the pump again anyway so maybe I'll try the rebuild kit plate one more time. From my limited experience the lip on the pump head seals much better when you use an oem plate. When you tighten the pump head down on top of the oem plate, the outer lip on the head sits flush on the pump housing's. With the rebuild kit plate it sits higher and then when you go to torque the bolts down I think it localizes the compression to around threaded hole area vs. a nice even distribution across the entire plate. Which binds the gears. Just my theory.

It appears as though I made the same mistake as the OP and had the pump plate in the wrong orientation. I found this out when I took apart my original busted up pump just yesterday and noticed the larger side of the grooves were facing away from the pump.

Wish I read your thread a little closer. Dang it!

 

Yeah I just got the thicker plate to work yesterday. I followed the video incorrectly and my problem was I had the plate in the wrong orientation.

I just made sure I didn't go crazy tightening the bolts down and it's working like a champ now. Finally.