Strange Driving Characteristic on EVO9: Is that LSD? ACD?
i have an 05 RS and that is the first thing i noticed about the car when taking 60mph+ sweeping corners, any abrupt throttle change will alter your line. it takes a bit getting used, but you just need to be smoother on the throttle (don't treat it like the clutch 
edit..the 05 RS comes with ACD, rear LSD and front helical LSD
edit..the 05 RS comes with ACD, rear LSD and front helical LSD
Last edited by nitz; Jan 22, 2006 at 02:37 PM.
Originally Posted by nitz
when taking 60mph+ sweeping corners, any abrupt throttle change will alter your line. it takes a bit getting used
Originally Posted by trinydex
sounds like your tire presures are off.
I think its the front LSD. I noticed the same thing about on-throttle/go straight, off-throttle/turn tighter on the STI after I switched from an 03 EVO. I think some of the British car magazines prefered the early American spec EVO due to the "naturalness" in the way the non LSD cars rolled through the corners.
long sweepers are much nicer if you use the top and bottom of the steering wheel to set the line, or at least for me, Keeping my hands on top of the wheel ( 10 and 2) made fast sweepers kind of twitchy.
Newbie
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 23
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From: Manassas, VA
Originally Posted by RobDogg
long sweepers are much nicer if you use the top and bottom of the steering wheel to set the line, or at least for me, Keeping my hands on top of the wheel ( 10 and 2) made fast sweepers kind of twitchy.
Evolving Member
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 105
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From: Northern NJ
I'm not sure if this is related at all... but I have a 2005 EVO VIII and I notice when I accelerate from a standstill (like a toll booth) and turn the wheel a bit (switching lanes while accelerating from a toll booth) the car pulls into the turn a bit. It doesn't seem to be the momentum of the car... it seems to be coming from the wheels. I don't have the kind of knowledge about the drivetrain that some of you guys have... but I've always been curious why that was. I've never had an all-wheel drive car before... maybe it's just that.
Side note: I definitely love AWD now (after 2 months with my EVO) because that feeling of being pushed into a corner and pulled out of it at the same time... is just wild.
Side note: I definitely love AWD now (after 2 months with my EVO) because that feeling of being pushed into a corner and pulled out of it at the same time... is just wild.
UPDATE: Test dove an 06 MR off the lot, and it has the same characteristic of the car wanting to go straight if some throttle is applied and to turn in when throttle is released.
I guess it must the LSD doing funky stuff at these putting around speeds, non-torque conditions.
I guess it must the LSD doing funky stuff at these putting around speeds, non-torque conditions.
Originally Posted by xtnct
I just switched from EVO 8 to EVO 9. 9 has the LSD & ACD. I noticed a strange driving characteristic or behaviour with the new car that was not there on the EVO 8.
Assume you are crusing on a straight road. Ahead is a long constant radious bend in the road. Once you turn the steering wheel, holding it in the same position would take you around the bend. However, on the EVO 9, once I had my steering angle for the entire curve I have to readjust it if I either apply more throttle or get off the throttle. If I apply throttle, the car ends up wanting to go straight, so I need to compensate with the steering wheel (just a tiny bit). If I let off the throttle, the car wants to turn into the turn and I have to compensate again with the steering. This is a very weary subtle feeling that I would not want to experience at higher speed (kind of like a twich). Could this be the ACD or LSD in action even when miles away from the car's actual limits?
I had a FWD car with LSD and it did not have that behaviour. I can tell you definitely what it is NOT:
- not oversteer or understeer,
- does not feel like an alignment issue
- it is not a weight trasfer characteristic
- it is not new tire break in as they are the ones I trasfered from my 8.
Changing ACD setting makes no difference. It feels more like something mechanical is happening, like something is steering the rear wheels for me...
Note that I did not WOT it around the bend. This was just cruising @ 50mph around 3K rpm and just applying moderate throttle in 5th and then easing off before full boost kicks in. I have 40 miles on the odomoter so I have not experimented with what happens at WOT and full boost.
So, would this be ACD and or LSD behavior or should I get my new car checked out?
Assume you are crusing on a straight road. Ahead is a long constant radious bend in the road. Once you turn the steering wheel, holding it in the same position would take you around the bend. However, on the EVO 9, once I had my steering angle for the entire curve I have to readjust it if I either apply more throttle or get off the throttle. If I apply throttle, the car ends up wanting to go straight, so I need to compensate with the steering wheel (just a tiny bit). If I let off the throttle, the car wants to turn into the turn and I have to compensate again with the steering. This is a very weary subtle feeling that I would not want to experience at higher speed (kind of like a twich). Could this be the ACD or LSD in action even when miles away from the car's actual limits?
I had a FWD car with LSD and it did not have that behaviour. I can tell you definitely what it is NOT:
- not oversteer or understeer,
- does not feel like an alignment issue
- it is not a weight trasfer characteristic
- it is not new tire break in as they are the ones I trasfered from my 8.
Changing ACD setting makes no difference. It feels more like something mechanical is happening, like something is steering the rear wheels for me...
Note that I did not WOT it around the bend. This was just cruising @ 50mph around 3K rpm and just applying moderate throttle in 5th and then easing off before full boost kicks in. I have 40 miles on the odomoter so I have not experimented with what happens at WOT and full boost.
So, would this be ACD and or LSD behavior or should I get my new car checked out?
What you're describing is throttle steering....
Basic rule of thumb:
lift/off throttle->oversteer
on throttle->understeer
A common mistake for novice driver on the track is lift throttle during mid corner which result in spinging the car around.
Evolving Member
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 203
Likes: 0
From: Grand Rapids, MI
Originally Posted by whiterexman
That's pretty normal. It has nothing to do with ACD.
What you're describing is throttle steering....
Basic rule of thumb:
lift/off throttle->oversteer
on throttle->understeer
A common mistake for novice driver on the track is lift throttle during mid corner which result in spinging the car around.
What you're describing is throttle steering....
Basic rule of thumb:
lift/off throttle->oversteer
on throttle->understeer
A common mistake for novice driver on the track is lift throttle during mid corner which result in spinging the car around.
Originally Posted by ShiftySVT
You can't have under/oversteer in the normal sense of the word if your tires aren't slipping.
Tire slipping has nothing to do with throttle steering.
weight transfer... when you left foot brake and turn in a fwd drive civic and get oversteer you're not losing traction on the rear wheels... they're not slipping or making noise... you're transfering the weight on the car (or NOT transfering it) in such a way that makes the front not push or the front able to move faster than the rear.
this isn't a drifting thing... it's just a product of chasis balance. when you oversteer cuz you have a stiffer rear suspension setup, you're not necessarily losing traction becuase in most well setup suspsensions your level of grip is much higher, yer chassis now balanced differently and your turning characteristic has changed.
in fact this is the REAL meaning behind "improving the 'handling' of your car" many people think oh i'll do this and that but not too many things done actually affect the HANDLING, to affect the turning behavior of your car is very important.
another simple case in point... when i throttle on inside of a turn my outside wheel moves faster than my inside wheel (out front) this then makes my car rotate... am i losing traction anywhere? nope...
this isn't a drifting thing... it's just a product of chasis balance. when you oversteer cuz you have a stiffer rear suspension setup, you're not necessarily losing traction becuase in most well setup suspsensions your level of grip is much higher, yer chassis now balanced differently and your turning characteristic has changed.
in fact this is the REAL meaning behind "improving the 'handling' of your car" many people think oh i'll do this and that but not too many things done actually affect the HANDLING, to affect the turning behavior of your car is very important.
another simple case in point... when i throttle on inside of a turn my outside wheel moves faster than my inside wheel (out front) this then makes my car rotate... am i losing traction anywhere? nope...
Originally Posted by whiterexman
That's pretty normal. It has nothing to do with ACD.
What you're describing is throttle steering....
Basic rule of thumb:
lift/off throttle->oversteer
on throttle->understeer
A common mistake for novice driver on the track is lift throttle during mid corner which result in spinging the car around.
What you're describing is throttle steering....
Basic rule of thumb:
lift/off throttle->oversteer
on throttle->understeer
A common mistake for novice driver on the track is lift throttle during mid corner which result in spinging the car around.
Evolving Member
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 203
Likes: 0
From: Grand Rapids, MI
Originally Posted by trinydex
weight transfer... when you left foot brake and turn in a fwd drive civic and get oversteer you're not losing traction on the rear wheels... they're not slipping or making noise... you're transfering the weight on the car (or NOT transfering it) in such a way that makes the front not push or the front able to move faster than the rear.
this isn't a drifting thing... it's just a product of chasis balance. when you oversteer cuz you have a stiffer rear suspension setup, you're not necessarily losing traction becuase in most well setup suspsensions your level of grip is much higher, yer chassis now balanced differently and your turning characteristic has changed.
in fact this is the REAL meaning behind "improving the 'handling' of your car" many people think oh i'll do this and that but not too many things done actually affect the HANDLING, to affect the turning behavior of your car is very important.
another simple case in point... when i throttle on inside of a turn my outside wheel moves faster than my inside wheel (out front) this then makes my car rotate... am i losing traction anywhere? nope...
this isn't a drifting thing... it's just a product of chasis balance. when you oversteer cuz you have a stiffer rear suspension setup, you're not necessarily losing traction becuase in most well setup suspsensions your level of grip is much higher, yer chassis now balanced differently and your turning characteristic has changed.
in fact this is the REAL meaning behind "improving the 'handling' of your car" many people think oh i'll do this and that but not too many things done actually affect the HANDLING, to affect the turning behavior of your car is very important.
another simple case in point... when i throttle on inside of a turn my outside wheel moves faster than my inside wheel (out front) this then makes my car rotate... am i losing traction anywhere? nope...