Evo IX MR coilovers
This is a great example of how not all vendors agree on 'features' and it is wise to analyze where the products have been proven before buying. After putting three different sets of coilovers on my race and street Mitsus, ranging from cheap to all out, I've been taught a couple of key things:
1. The more you spend, the more you get. Good shocks are expensive for a reason, but if you pony up $5k, you will get a good set of shocks regardless of the manufacturer. In the mid-level, it gets a little sticky, as there is a pretty wide range of performance in the $2-$2.5k arena. I've had shocks at this level that were race ready and legit for heavily sprung race cars (Robi KWs!) and I've also paid as much for shocks that couldn't handle a 9k spring for more than a lap.
2. If the shock is designed correctly, you can adjust ride height all you need with only the spring perch. Struts designed with adjustable length are usually made in order to use one size of shock on many different vehicles. A shock should be designed with the correct length for you application from the beginning, as using a threaded length adjustment adds another mechanical fastener to the shock body, reducing the strengh of the entire unit. It should be noted that NONE of the high end shocks on the evo market have adjustable length, only adjustable spring perches, including the current shocks on both my race car, and I may have the lowest properly handling evo in the country.
3. Buy for your application. If you want to track a couple of times but have lots of other things going on, you don't need Robispec DMS-50, even if they do ride better than anything else on the street
. But if you think you may do a lot more tracking in the future, don't buy anything that hasn't been race tested...you will end up spending more in the long run.
4. Who you buy from is more important than what you buy.
1. The more you spend, the more you get. Good shocks are expensive for a reason, but if you pony up $5k, you will get a good set of shocks regardless of the manufacturer. In the mid-level, it gets a little sticky, as there is a pretty wide range of performance in the $2-$2.5k arena. I've had shocks at this level that were race ready and legit for heavily sprung race cars (Robi KWs!) and I've also paid as much for shocks that couldn't handle a 9k spring for more than a lap.
2. If the shock is designed correctly, you can adjust ride height all you need with only the spring perch. Struts designed with adjustable length are usually made in order to use one size of shock on many different vehicles. A shock should be designed with the correct length for you application from the beginning, as using a threaded length adjustment adds another mechanical fastener to the shock body, reducing the strengh of the entire unit. It should be noted that NONE of the high end shocks on the evo market have adjustable length, only adjustable spring perches, including the current shocks on both my race car, and I may have the lowest properly handling evo in the country.
3. Buy for your application. If you want to track a couple of times but have lots of other things going on, you don't need Robispec DMS-50, even if they do ride better than anything else on the street
. But if you think you may do a lot more tracking in the future, don't buy anything that hasn't been race tested...you will end up spending more in the long run.4. Who you buy from is more important than what you buy.
Good post!
- drew
Last edited by GTWORX.com; Apr 9, 2008 at 12:42 PM.
Very interesting comments. I now have my wheels turning in an opposite direction. I am not planning on tracking the car. Maybe once or twice. Daily driving and some aggresive mountain roads. I do want a lower stance without effecting the handling of the car as it is pretty good from the factory with the Bilsteins. I hate the gap the car has, especially in the front. Do you guys think I will be happy with just springs? Do they lower it enough? I do not, I repeat, I do not want a "slammed" car. Function and not form. I do want it lower, but want good handling! What do you think?
Thanks for all the replies.
Thanks for all the replies.
I may be totally biased, but you might like our GTWorx springs. Handling and ride quality were our priority, not looks. Only 20mm drop front and 15mm drop rear, far less then most springs out there.
Spring rates are a little firmer then Swifts, but you have more travel to soak up bumps. Geometry-wise you're in a better place as well, as a slammed car leaves you with no travel and lowers your roll center too much.
That said, the Swifts are still very good and we still sell a ton of them. Ours are just a little taller and the rates are a little firmer. Both improve handling and the ride quality is great with both, especially with Bilsteins. I think you'd be happy with either one.
- Andrew
Spring rates are a little firmer then Swifts, but you have more travel to soak up bumps. Geometry-wise you're in a better place as well, as a slammed car leaves you with no travel and lowers your roll center too much.
That said, the Swifts are still very good and we still sell a ton of them. Ours are just a little taller and the rates are a little firmer. Both improve handling and the ride quality is great with both, especially with Bilsteins. I think you'd be happy with either one.
- Andrew
I may be totally biased, but you might like our GTWorx springs. Handling and ride quality were our priority, not looks. Only 20mm drop front and 15mm drop rear, far less then most springs out there.
Spring rates are a little firmer then Swifts, but you have more travel to soak up bumps. Geometry-wise you're in a better place as well, as a slammed car leaves you with no travel and lowers your roll center too much.
That said, the Swifts are still very good and we still sell a ton of them. Ours are just a little taller and the rates are a little firmer. Both improve handling and the ride quality is great with both, especially with Bilsteins. I think you'd be happy with either one.
- Andrew
Spring rates are a little firmer then Swifts, but you have more travel to soak up bumps. Geometry-wise you're in a better place as well, as a slammed car leaves you with no travel and lowers your roll center too much.
That said, the Swifts are still very good and we still sell a ton of them. Ours are just a little taller and the rates are a little firmer. Both improve handling and the ride quality is great with both, especially with Bilsteins. I think you'd be happy with either one.
- Andrew
Save another $g and spend the $2300 on the Robispecs or something equivalent. You can spend 1/2 the money and get 1/2 way there, but you'll wish you did it right the first time, and lots of guys on this board have been through this.
The difference is dramatic. A quality set of coilovers will ride AND handle better than stock. Crappy coilovers will be noisy, fall apart on the track, and won't ride as well as stock.
Lots of vendors will tell you that you can get quality coilovers for less than $2k, but the top suspensions guys out there won't even sell you a set of $1000 coilovers because its just not worth it. A set of quality camber plates alone can run $500, so it doesn't seem reasonable to get a full set of coilovers for $1k.
If you are not planning on tracking the car, lowering springs and a set of quality shocks would fit your budget and give you a great street machine, though it wouldn't be as tunable as coilovers.
My opinion is certainly not the only one on this topic, so let the debate begin...
The difference is dramatic. A quality set of coilovers will ride AND handle better than stock. Crappy coilovers will be noisy, fall apart on the track, and won't ride as well as stock.
Lots of vendors will tell you that you can get quality coilovers for less than $2k, but the top suspensions guys out there won't even sell you a set of $1000 coilovers because its just not worth it. A set of quality camber plates alone can run $500, so it doesn't seem reasonable to get a full set of coilovers for $1k.
If you are not planning on tracking the car, lowering springs and a set of quality shocks would fit your budget and give you a great street machine, though it wouldn't be as tunable as coilovers.
My opinion is certainly not the only one on this topic, so let the debate begin...
My uncle races ministock cars and this guy custom made and CNC'd some camber plates for him for like $500... I cant imagine it would cost that much to bang out a set after you already have the file...
As for suspension... I have owned mostly FWD cars, and most of my knowledge is in that area. I have had Koni Yellows with nuespeed race springs, Tein Basics, 2 Sets of Tein Flexs, Tein S-Techs, Shine, and some others. I loved the Flex's with the EDFC I had on my RSX. Thats was a sweet setup.
On my MR, I only plan on doing the s-techs. reason is I dont track, and the stock suspension is already really good. Unless you are a hardcore auto-x'er, there's no need to spend that kind of money.
Also, anytime you change (lower) a car, you completely alter the geometry of car creating soft spots. So ideally, you want a setup that will keep you at stock ride hight, but will allow you to adjust dampening, camber, toe, ect... Suspension can be complicated
Last edited by 05ah8james; Apr 9, 2008 at 08:19 PM.
I know the OP is now leaning toward springs but I agree that you get what you pay for. I could not be happier with my new Ohlins DFV's and though they were not cheap I think they were worth every penny. I have had multipe sets of coilovers on past cars and these blow them all away. Ride quality is better than the MR stock on the street with a fairly soft setting, the stance is good and handling is amazing. To anyone considering a setup like this, I could not be happier with these.
I may be totally biased, but you might like our GTWorx springs. Handling and ride quality were our priority, not looks. Only 20mm drop front and 15mm drop rear, far less then most springs out there.
Spring rates are a little firmer then Swifts, but you have more travel to soak up bumps. Geometry-wise you're in a better place as well, as a slammed car leaves you with no travel and lowers your roll center too much.
That said, the Swifts are still very good and we still sell a ton of them. Ours are just a little taller and the rates are a little firmer. Both improve handling and the ride quality is great with both, especially with Bilsteins. I think you'd be happy with either one.
- Andrew
Spring rates are a little firmer then Swifts, but you have more travel to soak up bumps. Geometry-wise you're in a better place as well, as a slammed car leaves you with no travel and lowers your roll center too much.
That said, the Swifts are still very good and we still sell a ton of them. Ours are just a little taller and the rates are a little firmer. Both improve handling and the ride quality is great with both, especially with Bilsteins. I think you'd be happy with either one.
- Andrew
Can you suggest some coils that actually work and are comfy? (I am thinking about Konis from ZZYXZZ (sp?), Bilstein PSS9 or used MR suspension with worx springs).
Weird how that works...
My uncle races ministock cars and this guy custom made and CNC'd some camber plates for him for like $500... I cant imagine it would cost that much to bang out a set after you already have the file...
As for suspension... I have owned mostly FWD cars, and most of my knowledge is in that area. I have had Koni Yellows with nuespeed race springs, Tein Basics, 2 Sets of Tein Flexs, Tein S-Techs, Shine, and some others. I loved the Flex's with the EDFC I had on my RSX. Thats was a sweet setup.
On my MR, I only plan on doing the s-techs. reason is I dont track, and the stock suspension is already really good. Unless you are a hardcore auto-x'er, there's no need to spend that kind of money.
Also, anytime you change (lower) a car, you completely alter the geometry of car creating soft spots. So ideally, you want a setup that will keep you at stock ride hight, but will allow you to adjust dampening, camber, toe, ect... Suspension can be complicated
My uncle races ministock cars and this guy custom made and CNC'd some camber plates for him for like $500... I cant imagine it would cost that much to bang out a set after you already have the file...
As for suspension... I have owned mostly FWD cars, and most of my knowledge is in that area. I have had Koni Yellows with nuespeed race springs, Tein Basics, 2 Sets of Tein Flexs, Tein S-Techs, Shine, and some others. I loved the Flex's with the EDFC I had on my RSX. Thats was a sweet setup.
On my MR, I only plan on doing the s-techs. reason is I dont track, and the stock suspension is already really good. Unless you are a hardcore auto-x'er, there's no need to spend that kind of money.
Also, anytime you change (lower) a car, you completely alter the geometry of car creating soft spots. So ideally, you want a setup that will keep you at stock ride hight, but will allow you to adjust dampening, camber, toe, ect... Suspension can be complicated
I know the OP is now leaning toward springs but I agree that you get what you pay for. I could not be happier with my new Ohlins DFV's and though they were not cheap I think they were worth every penny. I have had multipe sets of coilovers on past cars and these blow them all away. Ride quality is better than the MR stock on the street with a fairly soft setting, the stance is good and handling is amazing. To anyone considering a setup like this, I could not be happier with these.
if you're not going to be racing with them though and you just want a little more stiffness and a drop (or need a quick bandaid to reduce a little body until you can afford ohlins), a good set of springs isn't a bad idea. i currently have works springs and have been very happy with them. they have definitely reduced a good bit of body roll, and put the center of gravity lower.
Tein is junk for evo's and if you did any type of research you would find the S-techs are the WORST spring ever designed for an evo. Problem is this isn't your previous honda or some $hitty fwd car. Might want to consult with your uncle before you ruin your cars handling.
I understand you're upset that I argued your point, but theres no need to call my previous cars junk, and disrespect me. The RSX was a nice car. Before I got hit by a drunk driver it was a 325whp supercharged moster. I had 2 friends with evos with light modding that couldnt keep up with it. Take your rude comments elsewhere, please.
Here your proof
MR Bilsteins with Swifts or our GTWorx springs are great if you don't want to bother with coilovers.
- Andrew
Really? Thats funny how Teins can be really nice in one car and not so great in another car. maybe its just a difference of opinion. Did you ever have any yourself? I havent done much research as far as the evo goes, but i had tein flexes on my rsx and my sti, both handled well. And as far as my uncles race car is concerned, no one makes camber plates for it so he had to have them made.
I understand you're upset that I argued your point, but theres no need to call my previous cars junk, and disrespect me. The RSX was a nice car. Before I got hit by a drunk driver it was a 325whp supercharged moster. I had 2 friends with evos with light modding that couldnt keep up with it. Take your rude comments elsewhere, please.
Here your proof
I understand you're upset that I argued your point, but theres no need to call my previous cars junk, and disrespect me. The RSX was a nice car. Before I got hit by a drunk driver it was a 325whp supercharged moster. I had 2 friends with evos with light modding that couldnt keep up with it. Take your rude comments elsewhere, please.
Here your proof
First of all I didn't call you car junk...I just called fwd in general junk. Your car may have been nice but the facts are the suspension geometry in RSX's aren't even in the same league as an evo. Evo has FAR FAR more suspenion companies to pick from. Saying you are going to put Stech on your car if your first mistake. I may have came across blunt but my point is 90% of all the JDM brands coilovers springrates and valving are not optimized for an evo...especially Tein. Btw if you outran your friends evo's with only that power they need some damn mods
I may have been rude but your last post contradicted yourself. You said "Also, anytime you change (lower) a car, you completely alter the geometry of car creating soft spots. So ideally, you want a setup that will keep you at stock ride hight, but will allow you to adjust dampening, camber, toe, ect... Suspension can be complicated" I hope you do realize the Teins lower the car the most out of ANY spring, blow struts all the time, and are softer springrates that stock. It will ruin your car.
Last edited by dbsears; Apr 10, 2008 at 04:59 PM.
I run Tein Flex's on my Evo and couldn't be happier. Granted they are not as good as Robispec KW's but they sure beat out many of the cheaper brands like Megan, Stance, etc. New they are very expensive and probably not worth the money but I bought mine with 1500 miles on them for $750 shipped. I couldn't go wrong and the car rides better than stock and the handling is simply amazing.
First of all I didn't call you car junk...I just called fwd in general junk. Your car may have been nice but the facts are the suspension geometry in RSX's aren't even in the same league as an evo. Evo has FAR FAR more suspenion companies to pick from. Saying you are going to put Stech on your car if your first mistake. I may have came across blunt but my point is 90% of all the JDM brands coilovers springrates and valving are not optimized for an evo...especially Tein. Btw if you outran your friends evo's with only that power they need some damn mods
I may have been rude but your last post contradicted yourself. You said "Also, anytime you change (lower) a car, you completely alter the geometry of car creating soft spots. So ideally, you want a setup that will keep you at stock ride hight, but will allow you to adjust dampening, camber, toe, ect... Suspension can be complicated" I hope you do realize the Teins lower the car the most out of ANY spring, blow struts all the time, and are softer springrates that stock. It will ruin your car.
I may have been rude but your last post contradicted yourself. You said "Also, anytime you change (lower) a car, you completely alter the geometry of car creating soft spots. So ideally, you want a setup that will keep you at stock ride hight, but will allow you to adjust dampening, camber, toe, ect... Suspension can be complicated" I hope you do realize the Teins lower the car the most out of ANY spring, blow struts all the time, and are softer springrates that stock. It will ruin your car.
I run Tein Flex's on my Evo and couldn't be happier. Granted they are not as good as Robispec KW's but they sure beat out many of the cheaper brands like Megan, Stance, etc. New they are very expensive and probably not worth the money but I bought mine with 1500 miles on them for $750 shipped. I couldn't go wrong and the car rides better than stock and the handling is simply amazing.
As I said I havent done much research on suspension setups on the evo, but to be honest, I'm going more for simple mods and looks in this car. I put so much hard work and effort into the rsx, and it was a sweet little car, but I lost soooo much money because of that wreck, even with it being 100% the other persons fault. This car looks and performs well stock, so I dont think I will be doing too much to it.
I said this about the RSX too, but...
