So, I read the reviews and test pages in the Aug DSport issue, as well as went to the Dynojet website to read about the CMD. It looks pretty neat, but I still have some questions about it. Does it work w/ or instead of a Access Port, and does it remove the need for an aftermarket boost controller?
If anyone has any other useful info on the CMD that'd be cool too, especially about it being used on the EVO X.

 

It is a piggyback ECU.

It works by intercepting the signals from the Sensors (MAF, MAP, etc) on their way to the ECU and from the ECU on their way to the actuators (injectors, etc).

It will be able to modify boost by tricking the ECU into thinking it has last boost / airflow than it actually has.

 

I'm actually testing this in vegas and yes its a plug n play piggyback. no wires to cut, very easy to install and very easy to adjust settings. I won't get into specifics right now as they are still working on it, but it works extremely well.

 

When you have the ability to flash the ECU directly like we do, then a piggyback becomes practically worthless. A piggyback will always play second fiddle to flashing the ECU. I used to have an Xede piggyback and dumped for ECUflash and never looked back. I never even sold the darn thing.

A piggyback is useful on cars that have the ECU locked by the manufacturer and it is almost impossible to crack.

Any company that brings a piggyback to the EVO market is just wasting their resources.

 

Worthless you say? Like the Z-Chip?

 

history repeats itself

 

I thought this going into testing of the CMD originally, but when actually testing started its perfect for what I'm looking todo. I wont be modding my car heavily until after the "warranty" has expired, but im looking to do some minor tuning and this product is perfect for those that want to retain factory ecu settings.

This unit is all plug n play, no splicing and will have more "tuning" options than people think. and this piggy back is notihng like the zchip. it has full end user support and a program to edit the files or have a professional tuner do. It is very simple to use and as long as you are competent at at least knowing what changes will do to your car, its pretty foolproof.

 

If a dealer finds out that your car had a piggyback or a flash, then he will void the warranty. It does not matter if it is a flash or a piggy. Both void warranties. We do not know if a flash is detected by the dealer on an Evo X, but in due time we will. The only instance I have read about a voided warranty due to a flash was when one person flash his ECU with the wrong ECU ID and the dealer had a record of the correct ECU ID.

Can your piggy raise the rev limiter?
Can your piggy scale for larger injectors?
Can your piggy remove a speed limiter, if there was one?
What psi will your piggy set the boost to?
Can your piggy enable mode23 logging so we can use Evoscan or does it have its own logger?
Is your piggy user adjustable?
Can your piggy adjust the mivec maps?
Can your piggy adjust the airflow/torque setting tables or disable them?
Can your piggy set the two-step launch control?
Can your piggy adjust the idle speed for larger cams?

Please tell me if it can. Most piggies do not. I hope yours does. It is very well known that a flash is superior to a piggy. There is less hardware, less interaction between sensors and piggy and piggy and ECU and the possibility of lost signals, and more functionality from the flash.

 

I can answer most of your questions just from the testing i have done.

Can your piggy raise the rev limiter?

No, but again I feel that is not in the mod path of someone looking for a piggyback.

Can your piggy scale for larger injectors?

I'm going to say yes to thism if by scaling for larger injectors you are talking about duty cycles.

Can your piggy remove a speed limiter, if there was one?

no, again this is one of those items someone lokoing for a piggy back is looking for.

What psi will your piggy set the boost to?

Currently from my understanding is it adjusts the duty cycle allowing for more or less boost/

Can your piggy enable mode23 logging so we can use Evoscan or does it have its own logger?

the CMD does have its own logging software. All that is require is a usb cable and a laptop. this unit can also be flashed live, does not require engine restarts.

Is your piggy user adjustable?

yes, completely. software is free download. you honestly dont even need a unit if you really want to look at it keith can post the link for it.

Can your piggy adjust the mivec maps?

no, I dont think its an option they are looking at, but as with the others, this is a pretty detailed mod that i dont feel most people looking for a piggyback are looking for.

Can your piggy adjust the airflow/torque setting tables or disable them?

I am guessing you are talkinga bout the sst trannies and i would sa no hear. If you are also speaking of the MAF tables, it does have MAF clamping right now and they are looking into expanding that.

Can your piggy set the two-step launch control?

no that is an ecu function. While that might be interesting, i dont look at that as a major option personally.


Can your piggy adjust the idle speed for larger cams?

I'm going to respond here and say this mod is out of the range of something someone looking at a piggy back system would be doing.

Those were some really good questions and I'm going to end with saying to keep an open mind about this product. It has greatly surprised myself and I am glad i was open to testing this for them. the wait was more than worth it to me.


oh one last thing... the CMD will be priced under the zchip. it's not my place to post prices and no i wont answer them in pm's either as i don't think it would be my place to disclose that.

 

So it sounds just like any other piggyback that has been out. Same faults, etc

Works ok for a stock or semi-stock car.

The argument that people looking at this piggyback are not interested in larger injectors, Mivec Control, 2step, revlimiter, idle etc is not a strong argument in my book, those would be the same people that would just want to get a flash done for their modifications and be done with it, not a person that would want to tinker with tuning a piggyback or tuning at all.

I'm personally with nj1266 on this one and I'll even be a little more blunt. The people that are pitching for a piggyback for a vehicle that already has a direct ecu reflash option (and free opensource at that), either have not actually done that direct ecu tuning to actually see/feel/witness the differences first hand, or are trying to make money on a product. Piggybacks do have their place for car makes that do not have direct ecu flashing capabilities yet (much like the Evo 10 last year), but that is not the landscape currently.

We aren't talking about / tuning a full standalone here with non-established closed loop fuel mapping. I'd also be hard pressed to find a real tuner that uses these fancy "autotune" features that people like to tout. Looks good on paper and at engineer cocktail hour and hell, if I could be sipping mojitos while the car tunes its own proper fuel map, then I would, but it doesn't.

-Bryan

 

A lot of people want as raised rev limiter for drag racing purposes so they do not have to shift inot 5th gear as they go through the traps. So you are saying that this piggy is not for drag racers!!!

Can you please explain how this piggy adjusts the scaling table and the latency tabe in the ECU for larger injectors.

Latencies also need to be adjusted for an intake. As you may know, an intkae on the Evo X will change the trims and that in turn feeds into the AFR. You must adjust the trims to get a steady AFR. Trim adjustment can be done either by scaling the MAF table or changing the injector latency table.

Can your piggy adjust the latency table or scale the MAF table. This is a must on cars with an intake. Unless this piggy is not designed for Evo Xs with an intake!!!

That is not what I asked. What is the maximum boost that the piggy can achieve on an Evo X? What is peak boost and what does it taper to?

What parameters can the logger log? Can it log WGDC and WGDCC. These are essential for proper boost adjustment. Can it log Knock Sum? This is essential for timing adjustment.

The ability to adjust mivec is essential for making power. It is essential for turbo spool-up. You can add a lot of low end torque for daily driveability with mivec. If the piggy cannot adjust mivec, then it is a poor substitute for a flash.

No I am not. The airflow/torque tables will cause a CEL light if they are not adjusted to match the increased power from a tune. In some cases you will get a p1235 and a p1238 CEL. The car goes into limp mode and the rpm sticks at 2000. You have to turn the car off and on to clear the limp mode. I have had cars on a stock tune trigger these codes. We now have the ability to turn the tables off with the flash thanks to Tephra. If your piggy does not allow for the adjustment of these tables, then it is a poor substitue for a flash.

A lot of people who drag race look at this as an important function. I guess your piggy is not designed for drag racers.

So your piggy is not for people who intend to run cams on their Evo X since the idle is not adjustable.

One thing I forgot to ask: Can your piggy addjust the throttle maps for better response?

So to re-cap:

1. Your piggy is not for drag racers since you cannot lift the rev limit and cannot adjust the two-step.
2. Your piggy is not for people who want to run an intkae on their cars since you cannot scale the MAF table and the latency tabble with it.
3. Your piggy cannot adjust the MIVEC intake and exhaust cams for more power and low end torque.
4. We do not know what parameters the logger logs.
5. We do not know the peak boost and how much does the boost taper to redline.
6. It does not adjust or deactivate the airflow/torque limiter tables to prevent the onset of limp codes.

All the above CAN be done with a flash. Do you still believe that piggy is superior to flash on an Evo X?

 

I removed one member's posts and am closing the thread.

Having a sig with your name, company name, and debating technical merits are all three walking the line of vending without a vendor account. This is prohibited per site rules.

I am leaving the thread visible, as some of our longstanding members have some good contribution within.