Notices
Evo X Engine Management / Tuning Forums Discuss the major engine management systems.

Better fuel economy in CRUISE

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old Feb 6, 2011 | 10:05 PM
  #31  
Hiboost's Avatar
Evolved Member
iTrader: (9)
 
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,222
Likes: 8
From: Rochester, NY
I've never heard or seen a voltage reference table but there is an Evap Map 1 & 2 as well as a Cylinder Fuel Trim 1, 2, 3 & 4. I have no idea if anyone has tested if making changes on those tables will lean things out but assuming that the Evap Map 1 has some method of leaning things out when triggering Evap functions there is a possibility.

I'm wondering if all those maps were changed to 15.5 or 16.0 that it would shift the target values in closed loop.
Reply
Old Feb 6, 2011 | 10:23 PM
  #32  
tephra's Avatar
EvoM Guru
15 Year Member
iTrader: (6)
 
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 9,486
Likes: 67
From: Melbourne, Australia
in previous Evo's the ECU used a 0v ground to pass to the 02 sensor.

this ecu uses a 0.5v signal, so if you were at stoich you would get 1v back (assuming a 0.5v signal for stoich)

the ECU then subtracts the reference voltage and you end up with a normalised value..

so Gunzo's hypothesis is if you modify the subtractor then you can artificially change "stoich"..

but like i said this sort of feedback loop gives my brain lots of hurt
Reply
Old Feb 6, 2011 | 11:28 PM
  #33  
xhomm02's Avatar
Thread Starter
Evolving Member
 
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 318
Likes: 0
From: Czech rep.
Originally Posted by tephra
in previous Evo's the ECU used a 0v ground to pass to the 02 sensor.

this ecu uses a 0.5v signal, so if you were at stoich you would get 1v back (assuming a 0.5v signal for stoich)

the ECU then subtracts the reference voltage and you end up with a normalised value..

so Gunzo's hypothesis is if you modify the subtractor then you can artificially change "stoich"..

but like i said this sort of feedback loop gives my brain lots of hurt
Well I do not think chnaging the reference 0v or the signal going from O2 could control the mixture. The signal is not linear (like with wideband), but changes quickly between 0 and 1V (a bit simplified). ECU leans when getting 1V and enriching when getting 0V (or negatively). This way it tries to keep stioch as average from a bit leaner and a bit richer.
Reply
Old Feb 6, 2011 | 11:34 PM
  #34  
tephra's Avatar
EvoM Guru
15 Year Member
iTrader: (6)
 
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 9,486
Likes: 67
From: Melbourne, Australia
yeh i know how it works I was just giving an example..

We wouldn't change the reference voltage, we would change what the ECU thinks is the reference voltage... ie the subtractor voltage..

I am happy to find it for anyone that has a WB and wants to test?
Reply
Old Feb 7, 2011 | 12:09 AM
  #35  
xhomm02's Avatar
Thread Starter
Evolving Member
 
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 318
Likes: 0
From: Czech rep.
Originally Posted by tephra
yeh i know how it works I was just giving an example..

We wouldn't change the reference voltage, we would change what the ECU thinks is the reference voltage... ie the subtractor voltage..

I am happy to find it for anyone that has a WB and wants to test?
I know you know :-)

It would be great if the substracting in ECU worked. Unfortunatelly I do not have WB, so could not test the changes. Anyone´s help would be appreciated!
Reply
Old Feb 7, 2011 | 08:17 AM
  #36  
Golden's Avatar
Evolved Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,456
Likes: 0
From: Omaha, NE
I can test.
Reply
Old Feb 7, 2011 | 07:21 PM
  #37  
gunzo's Avatar
Evolved Member
iTrader: (2)
 
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 1,328
Likes: 0
From: Somewhere
Don't think the reference voltage is shared for the O2 .. its shared between the front and rear O2 though ..

You can also shift the 0% value for the idle fuel trim .. helpful especially if you have big lumpy cams ..

Alot of similiarities between our ECU and the Keihins

Originally Posted by tephra
in previous Evo's the ECU used a 0v ground to pass to the 02 sensor.

this ecu uses a 0.5v signal, so if you were at stoich you would get 1v back (assuming a 0.5v signal for stoich)

the ECU then subtracts the reference voltage and you end up with a normalised value..

so Gunzo's hypothesis is if you modify the subtractor then you can artificially change "stoich"..

but like i said this sort of feedback loop gives my brain lots of hurt
Reply
Old Feb 7, 2011 | 07:31 PM
  #38  
SiliconTek's Avatar
Evolved Member
iTrader: (3)
 
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 501
Likes: 0
From: Autocrossing Somewhere
Tuning for fuel economy in an Evo seems a lot like those that try to use protection to last longer during sex...why bother?
Reply
Old Feb 7, 2011 | 11:46 PM
  #39  
xhomm02's Avatar
Thread Starter
Evolving Member
 
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 318
Likes: 0
From: Czech rep.
Originally Posted by SiliconTek
Tuning for fuel economy in an Evo seems a lot like those that try to use protection to last longer during sex...why bother?
Because I use the car for daily driving and while going 800km on highway the fuel economy is a metter.

Of course while enjoing the car on a curved road economy does not metter
Reply
Old Feb 8, 2011 | 11:18 AM
  #40  
fostytou's Avatar
EvoM Community Team
iTrader: (15)
 
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,143
Likes: 7
From: Aurora, IL
Originally Posted by SiliconTek
Tuning for fuel economy in an Evo seems a lot like those that try to use protection to last longer during sex...why bother?
5% of the $2000 I spent on fuel in the last year is still $100 free dollars in my pocket and a happier earth... but I'm one of those fools who runs a cat.
Reply
Old Feb 8, 2011 | 11:33 AM
  #41  
SiliconTek's Avatar
Evolved Member
iTrader: (3)
 
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 501
Likes: 0
From: Autocrossing Somewhere
Originally Posted by fostytou
5% of the $2000 I spent on fuel in the last year is still $100 free dollars in my pocket and a happier earth... but I'm one of those fools who runs a cat.
Reply
Old Feb 8, 2011 | 12:02 PM
  #42  
xhomm02's Avatar
Thread Starter
Evolving Member
 
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 318
Likes: 0
From: Czech rep.
Originally Posted by fostytou
5% of the $2000 I spent on fuel in the last year is still $100 free dollars in my pocket and a happier earth... but I'm one of those fools who runs a cat.
I wish we had as cheap gas as you in US!
I spend about 5k USD a year (12000 miles) on gas here....
Reply
Old Feb 8, 2011 | 12:04 PM
  #43  
tsitalon1's Avatar
Evolved Member
iTrader: (3)
 
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,072
Likes: 3
From: Southeast USA
Can we get the tables Richard?
Reply
Old Feb 8, 2011 | 01:07 PM
  #44  
fostytou's Avatar
EvoM Community Team
iTrader: (15)
 
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 3,143
Likes: 7
From: Aurora, IL
Originally Posted by xhomm02
I wish we had as cheap gas as you in US!
I spend about 5k USD a year (12000 miles) on gas here....
Running e85 and driving a motorcycle that gets 44mpg helps... but foreign gas prices are definitely not an envy of mine!
Reply
Old Feb 9, 2011 | 06:07 PM
  #45  
takeit2thetrack's Avatar
Newbie
 
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 52
Likes: 0
From: Harrisburg, PA
Originally Posted by xhomm02
Hi guys,

according to theory, the best fuel economy can be achieved at lambda 1.2 (AFR about 17.6)

Has anyone tried this in low load, cruising (40-80 load, 2000-3500 RPM):
1) setting open loop
2) fuel map 1.2 (17.6 AFR)
3) increased timing due to leaner mix
EDIT 4) +increasing exhaust valve retard for higher EGR

Can this setup (due to probably high EGT) hurt vlave seats, catalysator or something else?

Martin.
Why risk expensive engine repairs for a few $$ in gas savings???? If you want good MPG buy a Festiva!!
Reply



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 07:11 AM.