Downpipe test = Zero gain
I myself saw that the corrections were off on the dyno plots that Turbo Trix posted in the other thread. Even Helen Keller herself could have spotted it plain as day, but God forbid they get called out on it.
Last edited by CULVIIIER; Feb 18, 2008 at 11:17 AM.
We (Turbotrix) go through the same test procedure as you do. We knew that the temps were very close from run to run and the hp gains were accurate. We posted uncorrected because it was the highest of the base line numbers. (You had a problem with our numbers being too low, remember?) We didn't feel the need to post temp readings but now that another shop is questioning our practices I'll post those numbers as well.
You can see that the temp and humidity went up as we made more power. So, in SAE we're actually up 107.
Please have a look at the graphs and explain the "obvoius issues" you keep mentioning.
-jeff
You can see that the temp and humidity went up as we made more power. So, in SAE we're actually up 107.
Please have a look at the graphs and explain the "obvoius issues" you keep mentioning.
-jeff
Thank you for posting the info.
l8r)
Thread Starter
Former Sponsor
iTrader: (3)
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 793
Likes: 0
From: Arlington Heights, IL
Before this goes any further I just wanted to step in and say a few things.
Here are some graphs of our stock EVO X. It varied from 227whp to 240whp. After a bunch of runs with proper cool down period the hp stabilized at 237-240whp.
Someone asked why is Turbotrix making so much more power than we are. Their base numbers do seem low, even the same or lower than some mustang dyno #'s. Why I don't know, maybe the car has very low miles onit and the fuel trim's, timing, ect is still adjusting. Maybe it had 91 oct and now it has 93 oct, I don't know. Maybe their car is just a low power car and their parts unlocked it's potential, again could be anything.
I don't want to accuse anyone of anything and say that our power gains where done to be as realistic and representative of real world results. I'm not saying that their's wouldn't be, so make of it what you will. If you look at our parts they are very similiar. Our exhaust is very straight with only two slight bends. We made two version of the UICP's one with a quick transition from turbo outlet to pipe and one with a smooth transition, which made no difference in horsepower. Our inlet pipe leans the car out to 11.2 at redline but still runs low 10's in the middle. I'm not sure what their pipe does so it may lean the car out even further, hence the horsepower gains. We could have leaned it our further but want to leave the fuel tuning mostly to a flash or piggyback because each car can vary, and an intake system might run 11.5 on one car might run low 12's on another. There are slight differences in our parts but I would guess they would produce very similar power gains.
Hopefully that explains everything a little better. The purpose of this thread was to show that a 3" downpipe made no more power than the stock downpipe. Just trying to save the readers from spending money on a part that might not make any more power.
Here are some graphs of our stock EVO X. It varied from 227whp to 240whp. After a bunch of runs with proper cool down period the hp stabilized at 237-240whp.
Someone asked why is Turbotrix making so much more power than we are. Their base numbers do seem low, even the same or lower than some mustang dyno #'s. Why I don't know, maybe the car has very low miles onit and the fuel trim's, timing, ect is still adjusting. Maybe it had 91 oct and now it has 93 oct, I don't know. Maybe their car is just a low power car and their parts unlocked it's potential, again could be anything.
I don't want to accuse anyone of anything and say that our power gains where done to be as realistic and representative of real world results. I'm not saying that their's wouldn't be, so make of it what you will. If you look at our parts they are very similiar. Our exhaust is very straight with only two slight bends. We made two version of the UICP's one with a quick transition from turbo outlet to pipe and one with a smooth transition, which made no difference in horsepower. Our inlet pipe leans the car out to 11.2 at redline but still runs low 10's in the middle. I'm not sure what their pipe does so it may lean the car out even further, hence the horsepower gains. We could have leaned it our further but want to leave the fuel tuning mostly to a flash or piggyback because each car can vary, and an intake system might run 11.5 on one car might run low 12's on another. There are slight differences in our parts but I would guess they would produce very similar power gains.
Hopefully that explains everything a little better. The purpose of this thread was to show that a 3" downpipe made no more power than the stock downpipe. Just trying to save the readers from spending money on a part that might not make any more power.
Keith
Before this goes any further I just wanted to step in and say a few things.
Here are some graphs of our stock EVO X. It varied from 227whp to 240whp. After a bunch of runs with proper cool down period the hp stabilized at 237-240whp.
Someone asked why is Turbotrix making so much more power than we are. Their base numbers do seem low, even the same or lower than some mustang dyno #'s. Why I don't know, maybe the car has very low miles onit and the fuel trim's, timing, ect is still adjusting. Maybe it had 91 oct and now it has 93 oct, I don't know. Maybe their car is just a low power car and their parts unlocked it's potential, again could be anything.
I don't want to accuse anyone of anything and say that our power gains where done to be as realistic and representative of real world results. I'm not saying that their's wouldn't be, so make of it what you will. If you look at our parts they are very similiar. Our exhaust is very straight with only two slight bends. We made two version of the UICP's one with a quick transition from turbo outlet to pipe and one with a smooth transition, which made no difference in horsepower. Our inlet pipe leans the car out to 11.2 at redline but still runs low 10's in the middle. I'm not sure what their pipe does so it may lean the car out even further, hence the horsepower gains. We could have leaned it our further but want to leave the fuel tuning mostly to a flash or piggyback because each car can vary, and an intake system might run 11.5 on one car might run low 12's on another. There are slight differences in our parts but I would guess they would produce very similar power gains.
Hopefully that explains everything a little better. The purpose of this thread was to show that a 3" downpipe made no more power than the stock downpipe. Just trying to save the readers from spending money on a part that might not make any more power.
Here are some graphs of our stock EVO X. It varied from 227whp to 240whp. After a bunch of runs with proper cool down period the hp stabilized at 237-240whp.
Someone asked why is Turbotrix making so much more power than we are. Their base numbers do seem low, even the same or lower than some mustang dyno #'s. Why I don't know, maybe the car has very low miles onit and the fuel trim's, timing, ect is still adjusting. Maybe it had 91 oct and now it has 93 oct, I don't know. Maybe their car is just a low power car and their parts unlocked it's potential, again could be anything.
I don't want to accuse anyone of anything and say that our power gains where done to be as realistic and representative of real world results. I'm not saying that their's wouldn't be, so make of it what you will. If you look at our parts they are very similiar. Our exhaust is very straight with only two slight bends. We made two version of the UICP's one with a quick transition from turbo outlet to pipe and one with a smooth transition, which made no difference in horsepower. Our inlet pipe leans the car out to 11.2 at redline but still runs low 10's in the middle. I'm not sure what their pipe does so it may lean the car out even further, hence the horsepower gains. We could have leaned it our further but want to leave the fuel tuning mostly to a flash or piggyback because each car can vary, and an intake system might run 11.5 on one car might run low 12's on another. There are slight differences in our parts but I would guess they would produce very similar power gains.
Hopefully that explains everything a little better. The purpose of this thread was to show that a 3" downpipe made no more power than the stock downpipe. Just trying to save the readers from spending money on a part that might not make any more power.
Thank you for clearing that up Martin. Maybe I just got a factory turd.
Keith
I forgot what SAE exactly targets, but it's something like 70* F @ sealevel, so when the airtemp is above the SAE target, then it is a positive multiplier, to give you an estimate of what the performance would be like in cooler temps.
l8r)
STi2EvoX,
Dude, you have GOT to chill with your crusade man! I chilled awhile back.. why can't you?
Lud/NoTec - thanks for the education. That makes perfect sense!
Here's another question. Why does CA use STD while the east coast (and anyone using 93 oct) use SAE?
-M
Dude, you have GOT to chill with your crusade man! I chilled awhile back.. why can't you?
Lud/NoTec - thanks for the education. That makes perfect sense!
Here's another question. Why does CA use STD while the east coast (and anyone using 93 oct) use SAE?
-M
