madfast

all else being similar, more power never sold less cars...

why cant you have the size of the outlander sport with the "power" of the regular outlander?

if the outlander sport is the crossover equivalent to the lancer, then where is my crossover version of the RA/evo? you cant say get an outlander, because its in a different size class... you cant say get a RA sportback because its not a suv with a suv driving position...

imo its a missed opportunity... what other crossover/suv would be comparable to an Outlander sport with RA engine/drivetrain?

cmon mitsu, make it happen...

Shahul X

iTrader: (3)

I'll actually be looking at one of these this week... Honestly I like mitsu over Kia or Hyundai... And I think it looks good over the others and I have a sports car already... $25k for a car with keyless, hid, switchable 4wd, fuse, navi, backup camera, Bluetooth, panoramic roof, USB, paddle shifters, 29-31 hwy mpg, a decent chassis, nice color guages, room for my kid and dog, etc etc... Is a good deal... The lease deal is great as well which is what I'm doing.... Can I get a rouge or crv or rav4? Sure ... But what's the fun of being cookie cutter?

If I wanted a Ralliart I'd buy the sportback

blue4uevo8

iTrader: (3)

My wife and I drove the sport, she loved the size and looks but couldn't get over the lack of power. She's coming from a VW R32 (2008) and finds it hard to have less power. She also looked at the RA sportback but isn't really crazy about the look of the car.

madfast

this really seems to be the common theme among ALL reviews ive read. both formal (magazines, websites, etc.) and informal (forum posts, internet blogs, etc)...

you really cant compare a RA sportback to the Outtie sport simply because people like SUVs for their ground clearance and the driving position/view it gives you. also the sportback is kinda ugly in the back. from the funky rear lights to the hunchback, it doesnt appeal to most people.

the outtie sport on the other hand is very good looking from all angles. aggressive, muscular, but not over the top. very attractive and basically one of its top selling points. but its all a sham as it is one of the weakest cars in the segment.

the car needs at LEAST the 2.4L engine from the GTS/outlander just to be on even ground. and of course the RA's turbo engine would do wonders for its image...

the car is selling well, but i cant help but think how a little more power would help it out even more...

Boston_eagle

Well said, but more power takes away one of its points: MPG. My wife has a 37 mile each way commute and wanted a capable and top 4wd system, loads of tech, and mpg. Our Outlander Sport SE AWD has 29 MPG, navi, heated seats, rockford fosgate, panoramic moonroof. If we want performance we can take out my evo but it is literally everything else she needs and all the tech she wants. A quality car, seats are legit, and we got ours fully loaded for less than a base cr-v with only heated seats. We like ours, and if you guys have any questions feel free to pm me!

Besides as others have said, in Mitsu's mind this car is (to quote their own marketing) "different for a reason". If someone walks into a showroom looking for turbo and a hatch, they will be lead to the ralliart sportback.

If they want all out performance that matches or beats some supercars, then an evo it is.
If you want a 4wd with performance, Outlander GT or XLS.

If a bigger crossover with better mpg, Outlander 2.4.

If a crossover with 4wd looking for outstanding MPG and a ton of tech, Outlander sport is the choice. The engineers that made the made the EVO what it is did their work on this car:

-lower drag coefficient than a civic and corvette
-400 lbs lighter than a base 2.4 outlander
-HIDs also project on the sides and light up 80 degrees, more than a Lexus LS (and they work well in snow and at night!)
-regenerative brakes for an extra mpg or two.

Small touches like that lead us to this car!

madfast

power and mpg doesnt need to be mutually exclusive. you can detune a powerful engine but you cant make a weak engine stronger. for example you can have an "eco mode" that bypasses the turbo completely around town and when you want to have fun in the twisties go into "normal mode". want full boost? go into "sport mode", etc.

also lets not forget gearing plays a big role in hwy mpg. give it a 6 speed with tall 5th and 6th gears, etc. all im saying is that there are ways to improve mpg without having to have a weak engine.

and like i always say. the RA Outtie sport is like the goldilocks of compact crossovers. the RA sportback is too low to the ground. the outlander is too big. the RA outtie would be juuuust right

another way to look at it is, look at the nissan juke. right now it has class leading "fun" with its turbo engine and tq vectoring awd. but its small and looks weird. the sportage SX is going to have a 270 hp turbo 4, possibly with active suspension. but that car is gonna be $35k+... if they made the RA outtie? it would AGAIN be juuust right in terms of size, performance, and price. its a no brainer in my book. with such a weak engine juke buyers wouldnt even consider it. mini countryman buyers wouldnt look. sportage sx buyers, tiguan buyers, etc.

with such a glaringly obvious "flaw" only the gas sippers would want one. i say make it turbo, and detune it enough to have pretty good performance and still return pretty good mpg. it can be done. its just up to mitsu to take the leap of faith to do it and market the hell outta it... WRC and Paris-Dakar wins have gone to waste since they dont market that angle at ALL in the states... sure most americans dont even know where dakar is, but when you run old film of your rally car? it excites you.

madfast

on another note, mitsu just announced that the outtie sport with be made in america starting in 2012...

http://media.mitsubishicars.com/

http://media.mitsubishicars.com/rele...f-de8c4d4b5856

imo, the chances of another engine option probably just went up. as they phase out the eclipse and galant models, they will use that plant for global export of the outtie sport as well. the chances of a japanese built 4B11T making its way into the outtie sport? most likely none...

Boston_eagle

Actually the 4b11 is used in the outlander sport, and a reinfoced but detuned version form the evo is used in the ralliart for 237 hp and the full 4b11 is used for our 291hp in the evo. And in the evo you have normal and sport (and in the MR, super sport mode).

So Mitsu knows all about the detuning. But it knows that higher costs would ruin this car.

The Outlander sport is not about straightline performance and anyone who thinks otherwise is kidding themselves. Period.

I like the car. My wife and I bought one. But the reality is they already have models for peroformance (Ralliart and EVO trims) and performance with some utility (Ralliart sportback).

Again Mitsu's tagline of "different for a reason" rings true on this model:
-It is a solid crossover that offers 4wd, tech, and utility with the best warranty and cheaper (lower price) than anything in its class. To add different modes or a turbo would increase the cost to near/exceeding the ralliart trims, thus begging the question (why not get a ralliart?) Besides, the Outlander sport already comes with an "ECO" mode when you drive.

As to getting three modes with a mix of power and mpg, you can; it is the Nissan Juke. It has all three modes you describe.

But it is smaller inside, its hatch is small, its 4wd/awd system is not as good as the outlander sport, and it requires premium fuel in order to get 30 mpg.

But you can't fully 'bypass the turbo' it will still be used, but run at lower boost or different/(read: not as aggressive) shift points.

All great offers; I am just glad to see Mitsu develop and bring to market a solid performer that brings and does so much for so little. Glad to hear it is doing well in sales too.

They may add a ralliart version of the car, but I don't know if they will as for the reasons above, especially cost.

However for the car it is, I bet if the Outlander Sport was badged as a Toyota, car review sites would be over it, but it has to (and is forging) its own identity. Go Mitsu!

madfast

i honestly dont think the higher cost of a performance model would kill it. instead it would make people more excited about it. and lets not act as if mitsu would need to design an all new engine, tranny, etc. its right there in the RA. the chassis is based on the lancer, so its not starting from scratch...

i have shopped both the outtie sport and juke. there is no way in hell the juke awd with tq vectoring is worse than the outtie sport. no way in hell. i would be driving a juke right now if it wasnt so small. i can take the funky looks but its just too small for me.

the outtie sport has an eco lamp, it doesnt have an eco mode. im talking about something that changes the ecu mapping so that you can run the car in a detuned state for mpg when you want, and unleash its full power when you dont... that is but one way i am suggesting that you can maybe get better mpg from a powerful engine. power and mpg doesnt have to be mutually exclusive. but it does take work. work mitsu doesnt care to do...

last but not least, nobody is saying we want to drag the outtie sport. what we want is to press the pedal down and have the thing move out of its own way. there is nothing FUN about an appliance, like you are making it sound. FUN can go a long way in terms of selling the car and improving your image... more power is FUN...

Boston_eagle

Toyota sold over 300,000 Corollas in 2009. 300,000. Excitement has different meaning to different buyers. You and I and many others reading this are here, bound by our mutual enjoyment of excitement for us: High hp, state of the art transmissions, amazing AWD grip and handling, etc.

To others, what is exciting is reliable transportation, performance in terms of MPG, simple and easy to use interfaces, a large cargo area for people/goods/roadtrip (not named explorer, suburban, etc). and some coll tech for one's ride. Sport tuned suspension and high hp did not lead 300,000 to buy Corollas. Warranty, mpg, ipod connections are other appealing factors that were exciting to SOME. While exciting can be subjective, it lead to 300,000 sales.

Mitsubishi already has performance models, and their flagship (EVO) is their best known car. In order to grow market share, they need something to sell in ADDITION to their performance lineup.

Hello Outlander Sport.

I will end by saying would it be cool if they made a ralliart trim? sure. Will they? possible, but not probable, as they would be over saturating their own market share, which is already around 1% of all new car sales, especially since they are looking to expand market share while retaining their strongest known characteristic: Performance.

Cheers!

libz

iTrader: (1)

ugly imo and i wouldnt :X get an x5 instead

GPTourer

I understand your point of view and appreciate your enthusiasm, but don't you find it ironic that you are arguing with a guy who actually bought one? We're basically discussing theoretical future sales against an actual sold unit when the market right now is telling us that inexpensive vehicles with good mpg is what is selling not higher horspower, higher cost and less fuel economy.

The bottom line is the people with the money in hand are excited about cars like the Outlander Sport. Mitsubishi needs to work on making their brand a palatable choice for more buyers - not worry about developing a faster OSport to impress the auto journos.

madfast

no not really ironic at all. the fact that the man owns an evo, explains why he bought the car.

if a regular joe on the street were to choose between the outtie sport, cr-v or rav4, he would most likely go with what he knows, the cr-v or rav4. so what mitsu has to do is cater to US, the enthusiast, and not try to appeal to the cr-v and rav4 buyers...

i honestly still believe in the "halo car" and in this day and age, the age of social media and the internets, i honestly do believe that the "halo car" is at its most effective right now!

look at what the GT-R has done for nissan! it has elevated its brand on a global level. they recently took over honda as japan's 2nd biggest auto maker. is it a coincidence that honda killed off the NSX and S2000 and now they're going down? while nissan made the GT-R a global car and is now on its way up?

mitsu HAS a halo car, the evo, and yet they do NOTHING with it. they should pimp the hell out of their 4B11T in various states of tune and there you go, no need for a V6. in the same breath you can say oh crap this car is now "rally inspired" be cause it has a detuned evo engine. they should offer AWD as an option on all of their cars. pimp the "AWC" and "S-AWC" branding (they have in the outlander gt) to make more connections to the evo and its rally heritage. etc etc etc... now im not saying kill off the economic car. im saying offer the high end racing car to keep the brand in the spotlight, on magazine covers, on car blogs, on facebook wall posts, in tweets, etc. they are fading into obscurity because nobody tweets about their appliances, but they do tweet about their sportscars...

how does mitsu make their brand more palatable when they have NO media coverage? how do they get media coverage, by making people moving appliances? mitsu isnt toyota. they cant pull it off. mitsu should use its best asset: the evo. and the more "evoness" a mitsu product has, the better it will look to the people. the corporate evo face isnt enough when it has no substance behind it. use the AWD tech like subaru has in its entire lineup. use turbos and DI like everyone else on the planet.

going back to the outlander sport this is an example of what im talking about:

http://blogs.insideline.com/roadtest...n-juke-sl-awd/

http://blogs.insideline.com/roadtest...tlander-sport/

anyone who reads those blogs above will come away hyped about the juke, and their trepidations on the outtie sport confirmed. its that simple. make a good all around car with a dash of excitement and the car sells itself... make a car with a glaringly obvious "flaw" and people will be quick to call it out...

when talking about print magazines, the juke has already beat a mini countryman in a comparo. the outtie sport? no coverage at all in a feature article. whats worse than losing a comparo? not even being worthy enough to be talked about.

and that's not the first time. there was a sporty hatchback comparo a while ago where the RA sportback was included, ranked, and in the pictures, but not a single word was written about it except a small blurb in the end. like... WOW.... this is what we're dealing with. mitsu doesnt give the press any reason to talk about them besides the evo...

GPTourer

No it doesn't. All it explains is he believes Mitsu makes a decent car and they are at least on the radar for his wife to consider. It is his wife that is driving it. If she didn't like it they most likely wouldn't own it. My wife likes the Lancer Sportback and we will also go look at a Outlander Sport. She trusts my judgment in that Mitsubishi makes a good car, but it isn't the only brand of vehicle she likes and what she is considering. In the end, it is her choice and I want her to pick the one the one she wants that will make her happy.

3/4's of the Mitsubishi and Nissan dealers in the country don't even have a Evo or GT-R in their showrooms. Average Jane going into look at an Altima today doesn't not give darn about the GT-R's existence nor is it a factor in encouraging her to buy it over a Galant. The fact that there might not even be a Mitsu dealer in her town, nor has she seen any commercials for it nor do any of her friends have one are more major factors in determining if she seeks one out - not because they make a weird little car with a big wing that costs a lot of money for reasons she doesn't understand why.

madfast

if you didnt exist, would your wife walk into a mitsu dealership and look at the outlander sport on her own accord? or would she walk into a toyota dealership like the rest of the masses?

would boston's wife had done the same without his input?

So while Jane may not give a crap about the evo or GT-R, her wife Joe may. and his input will influence her purchase. in fact there was a study sometime ago that showed the man has the most influence when buying a car. it all goes hand in hand. nissan makes the GT-R, the automotive press can't stop talking about it, nissan gets its name out there, and then joe reads about it online or in a magazine and his impression of the entire brand is improved just by that one car. and specifically, nissan isnt hedging all their bets on one car. they also have the leaf to appeal to the green crowd...