Well, the gt-35 is in, UTEC tuning time..
Well, the gt-35 is in, UTEC tuning time..
Well its in. Idle real rough. AFR keep bouncing from 11-16 to 1. It will steady out for a few seconds but will randomly flux again. Not sure what i can do about it. When ime cruising at 3-4000k i get a consistent 14.7. When ime stopped and rev it up to 2K it runs 17 to 1, 3K=16 to 1, how can you adjust AFR in loadsite 0?? Before when you would be decelerating i would get 3 --- (dashes) i think it was because it went lean out of the range of the gauge. Now when i decel, i get about 10 to 1. The opposite. What would cause the richness decel from 4K?? God, ime confused. Any pointers would be great.. Ray 
I'm not sure about the decel issue.
What i did to help my idle, (It was hunting around like you are describing), is add 20 deg advance in 0 column from 500-2000rpms, then add 30% fuel in same column (in open loop fuel).
I'm not really sure if the fuel did anything, since it's technically still in closed loop until the TPS get > 35%.
I think the main thing was adding the timing to smooth things out.
Good luck.
What i did to help my idle, (It was hunting around like you are describing), is add 20 deg advance in 0 column from 500-2000rpms, then add 30% fuel in same column (in open loop fuel).
I'm not really sure if the fuel did anything, since it's technically still in closed loop until the TPS get > 35%.
I think the main thing was adding the timing to smooth things out.
Good luck.
Evolving Member
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 184
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To adjust afr in loadsite zero, you will tune this like you tune all other columns. Except your goal is to get it close to 14.7 under cruise conditions.
The way I tune the 0 percent column is, I use a scan tool that has the ability to check long and short fuel trims. When I am cruising my goal is to get the sum of those two values within +/- 10. This way the stock ecu can make all compensations from there.
Thanks,
Jermaine~
The way I tune the 0 percent column is, I use a scan tool that has the ability to check long and short fuel trims. When I am cruising my goal is to get the sum of those two values within +/- 10. This way the stock ecu can make all compensations from there.
Thanks,
Jermaine~
Originally Posted by Imprezd
To adjust afr in loadsite zero, you will tune this like you tune all other columns. Except your goal is to get it close to 14.7 under cruise conditions.
The way I tune the 0 percent column is, I use a scan tool that has the ability to check long and short fuel trims. When I am cruising my goal is to get the sum of those two values within +/- 10. This way the stock ecu can make all compensations from there.
Thanks,
Jermaine~
The way I tune the 0 percent column is, I use a scan tool that has the ability to check long and short fuel trims. When I am cruising my goal is to get the sum of those two values within +/- 10. This way the stock ecu can make all compensations from there.
Thanks,
Jermaine~
r
Well, still having issues. To put it bluntly, i just dont know WTF ime doing. Before all i did was play with AFR's and such. I think i have compressor surge. Sounds like a fluttering BOV, but i know my BOV holds at 20 PSI. Made an appointment with Clark Turner in phoenix. Says he knows the scan tool stuff. Anyways i did a log. It runs o.k. when your driving, but when your stopped and just rev it, forget it. 18-1 AFR just reving. Cuts out, misses ect...ect....I need the MAP conversion i guess. RRR
Code:
Load Knock Mod Mod Mod WB
RPM MAP MAF TPS Site Count Ign#1 Inj#1 Ign Fuel Boost MAF AFR
psia Hz % deg duty deg % (OL) Hz
1045 27.4 38 0 0 0 4.3 2 20 8 ECU. 44 13.47
1053 27.4 38 0 0 0 6.1 2 20 8 ECU. 41 13.47
1013 27.6 38 0 0 0 7.9 1.3 20 10 ECU. 46 13.62
1034 27.6 38 0 0 0 6.1 1.4 20 9 ECU. 45 13.33
1028 27.6 38 0 0 0 5.2 1.3 20 9 ECU. 40 13.25
2844 27.4 300 38 10 0 27.7 10.9 ECU. -9 ECU. 248 12.34
2888 27.4 318 39 10 0 28.4 11.5 ECU. -9 ECU. 289 12.17
2942 27.4 358 74 10 0 27.7 13 ECU. -9 ECU. 445 12.11
2984 27.4 372 100 10 0 25.6 13.4 ECU. -9 ECU. 237 12.17
3103 27.4 403 100 10 0 25.7 14.5 ECU. -9 ECU. 457 11.92
3126 27.4 415 100 10 0 23.2 15 ECU. -9 ECU. 623 11.58
3214 27.4 443 100 10 0 23.2 15.5 ECU. -9 ECU. 686 11.56
3271 27.4 431 100 10 0 24.2 15.6 ECU. -9.1 ECU. 277 11.62
3336 27.4 459 100 10 0 23.6 16.9 ECU. -9.4 ECU. 657 11.62
3394 27.4 474 100 10 0 22.6 19.2 ECU. -9.6 ECU. 273 11.53
3486 27.6 574 100 10 0 22.6 19.2 ECU. -10 ECU. 231 11.49
3584 27.6 515 100 10 0 22.6 22.1 ECU. -10 ECU. 716 11.42
3654 27.6 541 100 10 0 21.5 22.3 ECU. -10 ECU. 570 11.18
3736 27.6 611 100 10 0 22.4 23.2 ECU. -10 ECU. 769 10.9
3844 27.6 603 100 10 0 22.3 23.4 ECU. -10 ECU. 644 10.73
3903 27.4 669 100 10 0 22.4 24.7 ECU. -10 ECU. 645 10.74
4020 27.4 638 100 10 0 22.7 24.4 ECU. -10 ECU. 512 10.81
4100 27.4 654 100 10 0 21.5 26.3 ECU. -9.7 ECU. 480 10.86
4182 27.4 728 100 10 0 21 27.6 ECU. -9.3 ECU. 663 10.96
4317 27.6 747 100 10 0 20 30.6 ECU. -9 ECU. 641 10.93
4432 27.4 837 100 20 0 18.9 33 ECU. -9 ECU. 753 10.89
4492 27.4 919 100 20 0 16.8 35 ECU. -9 ECU. 748 10.86
4636 27.4 1070 100 30 0 15.7 39.7 ECU. -9 ECU. 1041 10.83
4768 27.4 1136 100 30 0 12.9 43.9 ECU. -9 ECU. 1024 10.83
4938 27.6 1340 100 40 0 12 53 ECU. -11.2 ECU. 1190 10.73
5065 27.4 1453 100 50 0 10 58 ECU. -11.6 ECU. 1213 10.49
5224 27.4 1449 100 60 0 10.1 59.7 ECU. -11.8 ECU. 1344 10.2
5367 27.4 1650 100 70 0 10.1 66.8 ECU. -12 ECU. 1524 10.09
5555 27.4 1552 100 80 0 10.1 61.2 ECU. -12 ECU. 1677 10.33
5717 27.4 1730 100 80 0 12.2 66.2 ECU. -12 ECU. 1445 10.58
5889 27.4 1766 100 90 0 13.3 68.1 ECU. -12 ECU. 1461 10.65
6060 27.4 1748 100 100 0 14.4 67.7 ECU. -12.5 ECU. 1506 10.68
6242 27.4 1724 100 100 0 16.2 68.8 ECU. -12.5 ECU. 1644 10.71
6397 27.4 1893 100 100 0 17.3 71.7 ECU. -12.5 ECU. 1515 10.81
6497 27.4 1937 100 100 0 18.5 75.4 ECU. -12.5 ECU. 1666 10.86
6666 27.4 1945 100 100 0 19.4 76.3 ECU. -12.5 ECU. 1666 10.86
6830 27.4 1992 100 100 0 21.6 78.1 ECU. -12.5 ECU. 1543 10.9
6973 27.4 1901 100 100 0 22.4 76.4 ECU. -12.5 ECU. 1655 10.93
Originally Posted by rraulston
Well, still having issues. To put it bluntly, i just dont know WTF ime doing. Before all i did was play with AFR's and such. I think i have compressor surge. Sounds like a fluttering BOV, but i know my BOV holds at 20 PSI. Made an appointment with Clark Turner in phoenix. Says he knows the scan tool stuff. Anyways i did a log. It runs o.k. when your driving, but when your stopped and just rev it, forget it. 18-1 AFR just reving. Cuts out, misses ect...ect....I need the MAP conversion i guess. RRR
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You'll have to bump your idle slightly also, part of the problem is the "Lag in airflow" caused by the turbo being a restriction at idle so you have a low airflow through the maf, but higher air demand into the intake manifold, so it tends to run lean.
I get basically the same thing with my blowthrough setup, the best things I did to help it were exactly what Imprezd recommended..
First, raise your idle speed to 1100rpm if possible
second, use a scantool to see what your trims are, try to tune your 0% column so your fuel trims are as close to 0 as possible, like Imprezd said, it will allow the ECU to be in its comfort zone, and less prone to hunt..
you shouldn't have to play with the timing too much unless your getting very poor idle due to cams, but you may have to come back later and alter your timing slightly..
Think of it this way, at idle, the heavier internals if the turbo are acting a little like a restriction, so you need to raise the idle a bit to increase the exhaust volume.. Its kinda like drinking a shake through a straw, the pipe is there, but the engine is now sucking against it..
On the stock turbo, there's always a small amount of positive air pressure in the upper intercooler pipe.. when the turbo spins down a bit you begin to get less airflow and the engine is sucking hard against the turbo, then the idle goes lean, the idle speed bumps and it kicks rich, then it starts over again as the turbine spins down again..
I get basically the same thing with my blowthrough setup, the best things I did to help it were exactly what Imprezd recommended..
First, raise your idle speed to 1100rpm if possible
second, use a scantool to see what your trims are, try to tune your 0% column so your fuel trims are as close to 0 as possible, like Imprezd said, it will allow the ECU to be in its comfort zone, and less prone to hunt..
you shouldn't have to play with the timing too much unless your getting very poor idle due to cams, but you may have to come back later and alter your timing slightly..
Think of it this way, at idle, the heavier internals if the turbo are acting a little like a restriction, so you need to raise the idle a bit to increase the exhaust volume.. Its kinda like drinking a shake through a straw, the pipe is there, but the engine is now sucking against it..
On the stock turbo, there's always a small amount of positive air pressure in the upper intercooler pipe.. when the turbo spins down a bit you begin to get less airflow and the engine is sucking hard against the turbo, then the idle goes lean, the idle speed bumps and it kicks rich, then it starts over again as the turbine spins down again..
Oh and the richness at decel is likely due to the turbo spinning down and drawing more air through the MAF than what is getting into the engine (bypassed back into the intake from the BOV) I don't have this issue because my meter is reading the actual airflow into the engine even when the DV is bypassing airflow.
o.k. Can anyone give the name and model number of a scan tool that reads trims??? Ill buy one and check it out. Did you see my log above??? Man, i stay in the 10% column for ever.... oh and i also ordered the gm 3 bar and molex plug. Should get it next week. One thing i noticed is with the stock turbo at 20 psi and this new turbo at 20 psi, the 35 has WAY more pull than the stocker @ the same psi. For some reason, i thought it would be the same. 
Last edited by rraulston; Mar 24, 2005 at 09:32 PM.
Evolving Member
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 184
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Ray,
We use this one http://www.obd2.com/. You stay in the 10% load site forever because the car is way rich. You will spool faster, slightly once you lean out the vehicle. The GT35r is a huge turbo. You should probably bump your max psi for mapping or max maf hz for mapping to like 2300. Cause honestly you'll need it. The areas of the map where you are in the 10 percent for a long time you should advance your ignition timing a bit so the car doesn't feel so dead. If you have a tuner and the ability to read the datalogs you don't need pay for a tuner. Start with the stage 1 timing map. but take out a few degrees of timing above 5k.
Thanks,
Jermaine
We use this one http://www.obd2.com/. You stay in the 10% load site forever because the car is way rich. You will spool faster, slightly once you lean out the vehicle. The GT35r is a huge turbo. You should probably bump your max psi for mapping or max maf hz for mapping to like 2300. Cause honestly you'll need it. The areas of the map where you are in the 10 percent for a long time you should advance your ignition timing a bit so the car doesn't feel so dead. If you have a tuner and the ability to read the datalogs you don't need pay for a tuner. Start with the stage 1 timing map. but take out a few degrees of timing above 5k.
Thanks,
Jermaine
Originally Posted by rraulston
o.k. Can anyone give the name and model number of a scan tool that reads trims??? Ill buy one and check it out. Did you see my log above??? Man, i stay in the 10% column for ever.... oh and i also ordered the gm 3 bar and molex plug. Should get it next week. One thing i noticed is with the stock turbo at 20 psi and this new turbo at 20 psi, the 35 has WAY more pull than the stocker @ the same psi. For some reason, i thought it would be the same.
I have been toying with the idea of abandoning my small turbo kick and moving to a GT35r kit, apparently I'm a good candidate for it because of my ability to tolerate drivability quirks.. I am concerned that the UTEC may be difficult to work with to control boost, I'd like to use a GM BCS more than the testing I had been doing and would like to hear some feedback from the guys at turboXS (In a new thread obviously)
Evolving Member
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 184
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Jack,
We have our own proprietary BCS coming out, that will work with the utec.
We typically stop using the utec's bcs when we go to larger turbos and just run one our hpbc models. It's hard to beat the performance of our cheap boost controller.
Thanks,
Jermaine~
We have our own proprietary BCS coming out, that will work with the utec.
We typically stop using the utec's bcs when we go to larger turbos and just run one our hpbc models. It's hard to beat the performance of our cheap boost controller.
Thanks,
Jermaine~
Originally Posted by Imprezd
Jack,
We have our own proprietary BCS coming out, that will work with the utec.
We typically stop using the utec's bcs when we go to larger turbos and just run one our hpbc models. It's hard to beat the performance of our cheap boost controller.
Thanks,
Jermaine~
We have our own proprietary BCS coming out, that will work with the utec.
We typically stop using the utec's bcs when we go to larger turbos and just run one our hpbc models. It's hard to beat the performance of our cheap boost controller.
Thanks,
Jermaine~
Originally Posted by rraulston
Well its in. Idle real rough. AFR keep bouncing from 11-16 to 1. It will steady out for a few seconds but will randomly flux again. Not sure what i can do about it. When ime cruising at 3-4000k i get a consistent 14.7. When ime stopped and rev it up to 2K it runs 17 to 1, 3K=16 to 1, how can you adjust AFR in loadsite 0?? Before when you would be decelerating i would get 3 --- (dashes) i think it was because it went lean out of the range of the gauge. Now when i decel, i get about 10 to 1. The opposite. What would cause the richness decel from 4K?? God, ime confused. Any pointers would be great.. Ray
By the way, the GM solenoid BUZZES INCESSENTLY if you bolt it up to a solid mounting point.. I had to mount mine on a rubber grommet so it wouldn't transmit the vibration sound through the frame and into the car.
Last edited by MalibuJack; Mar 25, 2005 at 07:16 AM.