i got an idea of what kinds of temp drops you will see with the various fuels.

methanol you are looking at about 200 degrees C temp drop at 5.9:1 a/f ratio. that is a huge temp drop.

100% ethanol is about 100 degrees C at 9:1 a/f ratio.

E-85 is about 100 degrees C at 8:1 a/f.

and gasoline is about 30 degrees C at 12:1 ratio


one thing to take into consideration, this is not actually the temperature that air is going to drop too. reason being is you are injecting it right before the head and that gives the fuel little time to fully vaporize. once it is in the cylinder and begins getting squished, then it will vaporize and cool the air as it rapidly tries to heat up due to pressure increase. it might be best to just state the amount of energy being removed from the air. it can also be compared to an air to air intercooler that way as well. if you are using a fuel as a charge cooler like a 5th injector upsteam of the throttle body then it will have time to vaporize most likely.

 

ok good deal, those figures sound alot like what I came up with also. Thanks!

I dont really need to know what the drops specifically are.. just an idea of what I theorize I could do without an intercooler

Well I went out and did a little more beating on the pos... Im at around 21psi or so now, still no intercooler, intake temps are now hitting ~250-255. I pushed the timing about 2 degrees more than my old pump gas tune... still no knock.... still on pump E-85.

 

Perhaps I will run another injector directly after the throttlebody or something like that just to help things out... should give me a little more fuel to play with also. Duty cycles are still OK on the little 780s I got in there... running ~80% at 21psi. I am guessing, if the car doesnt knock, I could run around 28-30 psi or so before the injectors are a limitation on E-85. Methanol is probably only going to get to 24psi or so before the injectors cant squirt enough. I must say its very strange looking at the front of the car with no intercooler!

 

Well I guess the A-1000 isn't supposed to be used with Methanol so I will be switching most likely to a mechanical driven pump.. 2500 lbs/hr and methanol safe. It should work for me.. it will take some fabrication to make the pulleys work and get the pump mounted but will be nice once finished. I love how little simple ideas start turning into big projects.. oh wells its something to do

 

I also did some Math for the normal people... the results are pretty nice.

E-85 Stoich is around 10.025:1 compared to Gas at 14.7

Assuming you drive 3,000 miles and get 25 mpg you would spend $360 if it cost $3.00 a gallon. If you use E-85 it would cost you $378.30 if it costs $2.00 a gallon... normally people spend more than $3.00 a gallon for 93 octane so it would probably end up being a wash price wise... the only difference being you can now run upwards of 30+ psi of boost with more timing and never worry about it. Pretty damned nice if you ask me. On top of that you never need to switch to race gas

Another note about the E-85... it doesnt seem to do anything at all to the Aluminum parts. My whole fuel cell is Aluminum.. still looks perfect. The fuel rail is still looking brand new and nothing bad has happened yet. Cold start does take a whole bunch of extra fuel as opposed to gas. I think running warmer plugs would help this out alot but Im too lazy to find out until I get the Methanol in it.

I also talked more in detail with Aeromotive about thier A-1000 and using it to run Alcohol... they said E-85 is most likely perfectly fine. Methanol apparently conducts electricity (And Gas doesnt??) and that could lead to the stuff attacking the brushes. I took apart the A-1000 to take a peek inside to see what may fail by running Methanol. It doesnt appear to be anything. All the seals in it are some Viton seal that can take the Alchohol perfectly fine. It has no troubles with the 4th tank of E-85 I ran through it. Aeromotive also said there are alot of people running it with Methanol and they say thier pumps dont usually fail, they just replace the pumps every 2 seasons or so on general principle.

Lastly, I will be switching for sure to a mechanical fuel pump. I am getting a spindle machined that will bolt on to the crank pulley. The Gilmer pulleys are around $10 and you just underdrive the pump so its max speed is around 5,500 RPMs. Ill just make it 2:1. The pump will be mounted off the block using the stock Air Conditioning brackets. Aeromotive said there is no problem with the pump being up front and the cell being in the rear... I guess it can suck it perfectly fine

Ill take some pictures once its all done with both rails and the new pump.

 

You want to run 9's on stock block??

 

Quote "I also did some Math for the normal people... the results are pretty nice.

E-85 Stoich is around 10.025:1 compared to Gas at 14.7

Assuming you drive 3,000 miles and get 25 mpg you would spend $360 if it cost $3.00 a gallon. If you use E-85 it would cost you $378.30 if it costs $2.00 a gallon... normally people spend more than $3.00 a gallon for 93 octane so it would probably end up being a wash price wise... the only difference being you can now run upwards of 30+ psi of boost with more timing and never worry about it. Pretty damned nice if you ask me. On top of that you never need to switch to race gas

Another note about the E-85... it doesnt seem to do anything at all to the Aluminum parts. My whole fuel cell is Aluminum.. still looks perfect. The fuel rail is still looking brand new and nothing bad has happened yet. Cold start does take a whole bunch of extra fuel as opposed to gas. I think running warmer plugs would help this out alot but Im too lazy to find out until I get the Methanol in it.

I also talked more in detail with Aeromotive about thier A-1000 and using it to run Alcohol... they said E-85 is most likely perfectly fine. Methanol apparently conducts electricity (And Gas doesnt??) and that could lead to the stuff attacking the brushes. I took apart the A-1000 to take a peek inside to see what may fail by running Methanol. It doesnt appear to be anything. All the seals in it are some Viton seal that can take the Alchohol perfectly fine. It has no troubles with the 4th tank of E-85 I ran through it. Aeromotive also said there are alot of people running it with Methanol and they say thier pumps dont usually fail, they just replace the pumps every 2 seasons or so on general principle.

Lastly, I will be switching for sure to a mechanical fuel pump. I am getting a spindle machined that will bolt on to the crank pulley. The Gilmer pulleys are around $10 and you just underdrive the pump so its max speed is around 5,500 RPMs. Ill just make it 2:1. The pump will be mounted off the block using the stock Air Conditioning brackets. Aeromotive said there is no problem with the pump being up front and the cell being in the rear... I guess it can suck it perfectly fine

Ill take some pictures once its all done with both rails and the new pump."

We have a winner...

Its about time more people wise up to E85's performance potential!!

But dont tell too many people, I dont want this to get out.

 

Wow...

 

I think I may run the car once more this year and shoot for the retarded 10. After that I believe this winter I will pull the block and build the head and motor. High compression, ready to run on Methanol. Strip the car and redo all the wiring my way, swap the headers and turbo, etc, etc.... I will be shooting for mid 9s the first day it comes out again.

 

You can run 10.6@135MPH on current setup with good tire.Put Curt Brown,...........

 

Yes I could run a mid to low 10 with the exact car sitting downstairs right now... but instead I can spend some more time and money and go faster Ill take the faster choice.

 

What is the plan??Go out and smack stock block record ,then build it!!

 

e85 is fine on your fuel system

if you have a car that is newer which the evo is

i have been running e85 in my honda for 4 years now and it has been fine.