Knock and Boost Creep
Knock and Boost Creep
Took some log earlier and saw some knocking and boost creep.
Knock
Boost Creep
Knock
Code:
EXT Load Knock Mod Mod Mod
RPM MAP MAF TPS Site Count Ign#1 Inj#1 Ign Fuel Boost MAF
3627 +25.5 976 100 30 00 +4.1 43.0 +7.0 +0.0 100.00 1106
3711 +25.5 1070 100 30 00 +5.4 44.0 +7.0 +0.0 100.00 728
3813 +25.5 1116 100 30 00 +5.1 46.0 +7.0 +0.0 100.00 883
3858 +25.5 1091 100 40 10 +3.6 47.0 +3.0 -1.0 100.00 1131
3977 +25.3 1037 100 40 00 +3.5 49.0 +3.0 -1.0 100.00 988
4025 +25.3 831 100 50 00 +3.9 50.0 +3.0 -1.0 100.00 1243
4120 +25.3 883 100 50 00 +2.8 52.0 +3.0 -1.0 100.00 1106
Code:
6082 +25.5 1510 100 80 00 +12.5 75.0 +10.2 -11.8 100.00 1552
6150 +25.5 1582 100 80 00 +13.0 75.0 +10.6 -12.0 100.00 1533
6195 +25.3 1612 100 90 00 +14.9 75.0 +10.8 -12.0 100.00 1552
6265 +25.5 1712 100 90 03 +12.9 77.0 +7.0 -12.1 100.00 1396
6301 +25.5 1602 100 90 00 +12.9 78.0 +7.2 -12.1 100.00 1461
6373 +25.5 1538 100 90 00 +13.8 77.0 +11.5 -12.2 100.00 1336
Code:
5837 +25.3 1602 100 80 00 +11.9 69.0 +9.4 -11.1 100.00 1436 5984 +25.3 1592 100 80 00 +13.1 71.0 +9.9 -11.7 100.00 1231 6116 +25.3 1557 100 80 00 +13.2 71.0 +10.4 -11.9 100.00 1572 6230 +25.3 1552 100 90 06 +11.1 74.0 +7.0 -12.1 100.00 1470 6361 +25.3 1607 100 90 00 +12.6 75.0 +7.4 -12.1 100.00 1582 6497 +25.3 1618 100 90 00 +14.2 75.0 +11.9 -12.2 100.00 1396 6574 +25.5 1672 100 90 00 +15.4 75.0 +12.3 -12.7 100.00 1515 6666 +25.5 1623 100 100 00 +15.4 76.0 +11.8 -10.8 100.00 1453 6802 +25.3 1694 100 90 00 +17.8 76.0 +13.6 -13.3 100.00 1344 6887 +25.5 1655 100 100 00 +19.0 76.0 +13.2 -11.0 100.00 1488 7002 +25.3 1644 100 90 00 +20.8 78.0 +15.3 -13.3 100.00 1381 7092 +25.5 1712 100 90 00 +20.6 77.0 +16.2 -13.3 100.00 1358 7183 +25.7 1519 100 90 00 +21.2 76.0 +17.7 -13.3 100.00 1404 7293 +25.5 1666 100 90 00 +21.1 77.0 +18.0 -13.3 100.00 1461 7407 +25.5 1661 100 90 00 +21.4 78.0 +18.0 -13.3 100.00 1351 7541 +25.3 1639 100 90 00 +21.2 78.0 +18.0 -13.3 100.00 1396 7575 +25.3 1677 100 90 00 +21.8 78.0 +18.0 -13.3 100.00 1412 7473 +25.3 1501 100 90 04 +20.1 79.0 +14.0 -13.3 100.00 1388 7593 +25.3 199 45 90 00 +31.0 2.0 +14.0 -13.3 65.00 71 7122 +25.5 59 2 00 00 +38.9 7.0 +2.0 +0.0 ECU. 189 6561 +25.5 106 2 00 00 +38.5 7.0 ECU. +0.0 ECU. 46
Code:
865 +25.5 33 1 00 00 +6.2 1.0 ECU. +0.0 ECU. 35
860 +25.5 34 1 00 00 +5.2 1.0 ECU. +0.0 ECU. 35
862 +25.7 35 2 00 00 +4.2 1.0 ECU. +0.0 ECU. 37
1010 +25.5 148 40 10 00 +5.2 8.0 ECU. +0.0 60.00 159
1551 +25.5 44 1 00 00 +14.3 2.0 ECU. +0.0 ECU. 44
1406 +25.5 179 24 00 00 +25.3 5.0 ECU. +0.0 ECU. 162
1451 +25.5 131 24 00 00 +17.2 6.0 ECU. +0.0 ECU. 138
Code:
2973 +25.5 35 1 00 00 +16.5 3.0 ECU. +0.0 ECU. 36
3280 +25.5 42 1 00 00 +17.7 3.0 ECU. +0.0 ECU. 44
2986 +25.5 53 1 00 00 +19.9 26.0 ECU. +0.0 ECU. 197
3703 +25.5 372 55 10 00 +26.9 17.0 ECU. +0.0 75.00 357
4020 +25.5 39 2 00 00 +34.9 4.0 ECU. +0.0 ECU. 43
3671 +25.5 33 2 00 00 +35.9 3.0 ECU. +0.0 ECU. 34
3353 +25.5 53 1 00 00 +35.8 4.0 ECU. +0.0 ECU. 28
Code:
2846 +25.5 49 2 00 00 +20.7 4.0 ECU. +0.0 ECU. 50
2834 +25.5 50 2 00 00 +20.8 4.0 ECU. +0.0 ECU. 48
2712 +25.5 49 1 00 00 +19.7 4.0 ECU. +0.0 ECU. 47
2337 +25.5 359 52 10 00 +31.6 8.0 ECU. +0.0 72.00 271
3313 +25.5 97 18 00 00 +20.8 8.0 ECU. +0.0 ECU. 51
3323 +25.5 47 1 00 00 +34.6 3.0 ECU. +0.0 ECU. 47
3019 +25.5 39 1 00 00 +36.6 3.0 ECU. +0.0 ECU. 38
Newbie
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 27
Likes: 0
First, the second issue boost creep. This is not boost creep. Boost creep is at higher rpms and is when the wastegate is unable to bypass enough exhaust gas thus the boost continues to rise. What you have it not boost creep.
Notice your logs. Each time you highlight what you thought was boost creep is actually when the UTEC takes control of the boost control system. Notice the second from last column. The UTEC is in open loop boost control mode. That number is boost control solenoid duty cycle. 60%, 75%, 72%
You will see these figures in the boost map.
What's the problem with them? You you feel a lurch at these points? If so you can do two things. The first is to lower the values in the lower load columns. Less duty cycle means less boost. The second is to change the lower values to ECU and continue to let the ECU control boost in those areas. Looking at the logs it looks like you have a value of 60 in the 40% load column and then 75 in the 50% load column. The value of 72 is an interpolation between the 2 values.
I suggest if you don't like the lurch you just decrease these numbers a little. By 5 maybe.
In this boost control mode their is no feedback. All you are doing is changing the duty cycle as a guess as to how much boost that will make at each rpm. Basic but robust.
As for your knock...... Without seeing any AFR values you are just going to have to remove a couple of points of timing in the knock areas.
This is what caused the knock in this case:
3813 +25.5 1116 100 30 00 +5.1 46.0 +7.0 +0.0 100.00 883
Knock here
3858 +25.5 1091 100 40 10 +3.6 47.0 +3.0 -1.0 100.00 1131
3750-4000 30,40 and 50% load columns. It was trying to run 7 degress, but really did not like that, try 5. You don't gain any power by being that close to knock, trust me, I have tried it on the dyno. At knock you are already a couple of degrees away from minimum base timing.
It's also hard to guess what else is going on without boost in the log.
6265 +25.5 1712 100 90 03 +12.9 77.0 +7.0 -12.1 100.00 1396
6230 +25.3 1552 100 90 06 +11.1 74.0 +7.0 -12.1 100.00 1470
Very consistant knock in this area.
5984 +25.3 1592 100 80 00 +13.1 71.0 +9.9 -11.7 100.00 1231
6116 +25.3 1557 100 80 00 +13.2 71.0 +10.4 -11.9 100.00 1572
Car seemed happy at 10 degrees but did not like ramping up to 11. Remove one degree of timing.
Make sure you remove timing around these areas as well. Timing is interpolated between cells. The next run will put you in a slightly different load zone so make sure you account for that. Always make sure the cell above it like the 100% cell next to the 90% cell has some timing removed as well.
Have fun
Notice your logs. Each time you highlight what you thought was boost creep is actually when the UTEC takes control of the boost control system. Notice the second from last column. The UTEC is in open loop boost control mode. That number is boost control solenoid duty cycle. 60%, 75%, 72%
You will see these figures in the boost map.
What's the problem with them? You you feel a lurch at these points? If so you can do two things. The first is to lower the values in the lower load columns. Less duty cycle means less boost. The second is to change the lower values to ECU and continue to let the ECU control boost in those areas. Looking at the logs it looks like you have a value of 60 in the 40% load column and then 75 in the 50% load column. The value of 72 is an interpolation between the 2 values.
I suggest if you don't like the lurch you just decrease these numbers a little. By 5 maybe.
In this boost control mode their is no feedback. All you are doing is changing the duty cycle as a guess as to how much boost that will make at each rpm. Basic but robust.
As for your knock...... Without seeing any AFR values you are just going to have to remove a couple of points of timing in the knock areas.
This is what caused the knock in this case:
3813 +25.5 1116 100 30 00 +5.1 46.0 +7.0 +0.0 100.00 883
Knock here
3858 +25.5 1091 100 40 10 +3.6 47.0 +3.0 -1.0 100.00 1131
3750-4000 30,40 and 50% load columns. It was trying to run 7 degress, but really did not like that, try 5. You don't gain any power by being that close to knock, trust me, I have tried it on the dyno. At knock you are already a couple of degrees away from minimum base timing.
It's also hard to guess what else is going on without boost in the log.
6265 +25.5 1712 100 90 03 +12.9 77.0 +7.0 -12.1 100.00 1396
6230 +25.3 1552 100 90 06 +11.1 74.0 +7.0 -12.1 100.00 1470
Very consistant knock in this area.
5984 +25.3 1592 100 80 00 +13.1 71.0 +9.9 -11.7 100.00 1231
6116 +25.3 1557 100 80 00 +13.2 71.0 +10.4 -11.9 100.00 1572
Car seemed happy at 10 degrees but did not like ramping up to 11. Remove one degree of timing.
Make sure you remove timing around these areas as well. Timing is interpolated between cells. The next run will put you in a slightly different load zone so make sure you account for that. Always make sure the cell above it like the 100% cell next to the 90% cell has some timing removed as well.
Have fun
Originally Posted by mick_the_ginge
First, the second issue boost creep. This is not boost creep. Boost creep is at higher rpms and is when the wastegate is unable to bypass enough exhaust gas thus the boost continues to rise. What you have it not boost creep.
Notice your logs. Each time you highlight what you thought was boost creep is actually when the UTEC takes control of the boost control system. Notice the second from last column. The UTEC is in open loop boost control mode. That number is boost control solenoid duty cycle. 60%, 75%, 72%
You will see these figures in the boost map.
What's the problem with them? You you feel a lurch at these points? If so you can do two things. The first is to lower the values in the lower load columns. Less duty cycle means less boost. The second is to change the lower values to ECU and continue to let the ECU control boost in those areas. Looking at the logs it looks like you have a value of 60 in the 40% load column and then 75 in the 50% load column. The value of 72 is an interpolation between the 2 values.
I suggest if you don't like the lurch you just decrease these numbers a little. By 5 maybe.
In this boost control mode their is no feedback. All you are doing is changing the duty cycle as a guess as to how much boost that will make at each rpm. Basic but robust.
As for your knock...... Without seeing any AFR values you are just going to have to remove a couple of points of timing in the knock areas.
This is what caused the knock in this case:
3813 +25.5 1116 100 30 00 +5.1 46.0 +7.0 +0.0 100.00 883
Knock here
3858 +25.5 1091 100 40 10 +3.6 47.0 +3.0 -1.0 100.00 1131
3750-4000 30,40 and 50% load columns. It was trying to run 7 degress, but really did not like that, try 5. You don't gain any power by being that close to knock, trust me, I have tried it on the dyno. At knock you are already a couple of degrees away from minimum base timing.
It's also hard to guess what else is going on without boost in the log.
6265 +25.5 1712 100 90 03 +12.9 77.0 +7.0 -12.1 100.00 1396
6230 +25.3 1552 100 90 06 +11.1 74.0 +7.0 -12.1 100.00 1470
Very consistant knock in this area.
5984 +25.3 1592 100 80 00 +13.1 71.0 +9.9 -11.7 100.00 1231
6116 +25.3 1557 100 80 00 +13.2 71.0 +10.4 -11.9 100.00 1572
Car seemed happy at 10 degrees but did not like ramping up to 11. Remove one degree of timing.
Make sure you remove timing around these areas as well. Timing is interpolated between cells. The next run will put you in a slightly different load zone so make sure you account for that. Always make sure the cell above it like the 100% cell next to the 90% cell has some timing removed as well.
Have fun
Notice your logs. Each time you highlight what you thought was boost creep is actually when the UTEC takes control of the boost control system. Notice the second from last column. The UTEC is in open loop boost control mode. That number is boost control solenoid duty cycle. 60%, 75%, 72%
You will see these figures in the boost map.
What's the problem with them? You you feel a lurch at these points? If so you can do two things. The first is to lower the values in the lower load columns. Less duty cycle means less boost. The second is to change the lower values to ECU and continue to let the ECU control boost in those areas. Looking at the logs it looks like you have a value of 60 in the 40% load column and then 75 in the 50% load column. The value of 72 is an interpolation between the 2 values.
I suggest if you don't like the lurch you just decrease these numbers a little. By 5 maybe.
In this boost control mode their is no feedback. All you are doing is changing the duty cycle as a guess as to how much boost that will make at each rpm. Basic but robust.
As for your knock...... Without seeing any AFR values you are just going to have to remove a couple of points of timing in the knock areas.
This is what caused the knock in this case:
3813 +25.5 1116 100 30 00 +5.1 46.0 +7.0 +0.0 100.00 883
Knock here
3858 +25.5 1091 100 40 10 +3.6 47.0 +3.0 -1.0 100.00 1131
3750-4000 30,40 and 50% load columns. It was trying to run 7 degress, but really did not like that, try 5. You don't gain any power by being that close to knock, trust me, I have tried it on the dyno. At knock you are already a couple of degrees away from minimum base timing.
It's also hard to guess what else is going on without boost in the log.
6265 +25.5 1712 100 90 03 +12.9 77.0 +7.0 -12.1 100.00 1396
6230 +25.3 1552 100 90 06 +11.1 74.0 +7.0 -12.1 100.00 1470
Very consistant knock in this area.
5984 +25.3 1592 100 80 00 +13.1 71.0 +9.9 -11.7 100.00 1231
6116 +25.3 1557 100 80 00 +13.2 71.0 +10.4 -11.9 100.00 1572
Car seemed happy at 10 degrees but did not like ramping up to 11. Remove one degree of timing.
Make sure you remove timing around these areas as well. Timing is interpolated between cells. The next run will put you in a slightly different load zone so make sure you account for that. Always make sure the cell above it like the 100% cell next to the 90% cell has some timing removed as well.
Have fun
I'll be installing my Tuner this weekend and I'll post new log with EGT temp.
Oh, I also ordered the GM 3bar MAP sensor. (Thanks to MalibuJack!) I should be able to get all the parts next week.
