Hey guys I tried posting on the general forum but didn't get much help. I'm in the process of buying a '03 Evo with the following mods:

Buscher intake, RMR downpipe, cat delete, HKS exhaust, MBC, Cusco clutch/flywheel, and Walboro fuel pump.

Now I'm looking at a flash or S-AFC for my next mod and am wondering what your suggestion would be. I live in Idaho so I can't do a custom flash or even get dyno tuned. What kind of power am I looking at with one of your flashes? I want to continue to mod but it won't be very soon (no $ ) Thanks for your time and help.

 

Continue to mod - like what? Wanting like cams and/or a turbo upgrade? If you're looking that hardcore, you'll need a standalone and probably professional tuning. That is your first question. It sounds odd, but you need to think backwards or else you'll be rebuying stuff to take the place of stuff you've already bought but can't do the job.

Does the car have a piggback or flash in it now? I would think so having both the MBC and Fuel Pump. Sounds like a dynocrap combo.

Oh, and what's the mileage on it? Wondering because the clutch has been replaced, so wondering if it's been abused.

 

We suggest the P2 flash with boost control.
Piggybacks, like an SAFC, can't control ignition timing and can cause issues in EVO ECUs where the logic gets confused from being lied to by the piggyback.

 

Can you elaborate more on the implications of piggybacks, and ECU logic getting "confused" by them?

From a purist perspective, I can completely appreciate your philosophies: why you consider an aftermarket fuel pump to be a kind of "band aid" to work around a tuner's inability to control the fuel pump voltage; why the ECU logic cannot function as intended when its inputs have been modified by an external piggyback; the advantages of modifying injector pulse widths in ECU maps versus modifying MAF sensor values to get the ECU to do what you want with fueling. It is just "cleaner".

From a practical perspective, however, it cannot be ignored that there are a lot of Evos out there running just fine or better with properly tuned S-AFC2's, XEDE's, eManage, UTEC, and who knows what else.

Yes, their ECU's are being "misled". But in cases when the net tune is otherwise solid (at WOT and in transition), and appropriate workarounds/"band aids" are in place, what is the differential value that a pure reflash is adding? What doom is it protecting against?

You have pointed out time and again that WORKS has decoded many more maps in the Evo ECU than any other tuner (an accomplishment that as an engineer I have much respect for). In the same breath though you are quick to point out that so-called proper tuning of all maps and all possible points of performance is too time-consuming and cost-prohibitive for all but the most bankrolled customers or racing teams. So what good is this knowledge practically? By definition, your through-the-mail tunes can only take so much advantage - clearly a mail flash must be safe for the lowest common denominator of Evo - and "complete" custom tunes cost many thousands of dollars (at which point one really has to ask whether an interactive standalone ECU might be a better investment)? And what is the solution when boost levels rise above what the ECU's logic can adequately handle (without compromising stock resolution)? Doesn't a properly tuned full-featured piggyback really complement a reflash by providing a good compromise between a mail flash and an all-out cell-by-cell custom tune?

My point in a nutshell is that "confusion" is relative, and that sometimes a lie is as good as (or better than) the truth, for practical purposes.

At a traffic intersection, if you slow down for a yellow light that turns red, and then not a second later inexplicably turns green again (such as is common when you arrive at a stop light when the traffic program is changing), you might be confused momentarily, you might burn a little more fuel, but the net effect on safety and your ability to get from one place to another is relatively minor, even over the course of a lifetime. Contrast this with two lights at a 90-degree angle being green at the same time for 3 seconds once every 3 years. Which scenario would someone lose sleep over? Like I said, I have yet to see this latter kind of disaster-begging situation happen in practice, when tuning is otherwise competent. So who or what is really being misled?

 

Thats why I went with WORKS. There are lots of instances in life where half-assing, and jerry rigging will still get the job done. I prefer doing it the right way.