First 09 Ralliart Review
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The WRX and the STI are both bargains for what you get. Before I bought my car, I considered a MS3, GTI and an SI but none of those offers what the WRX does for the cost. A lot of people I know bought their cars (mainly STIs) because for the price, nothing else comes close to the level of performance that the car has. That to me is a bargain and "cheap".
2008 Evo X GSR = Starting at $32,990
Judging by past and current iterations the Evo has been and is now the highest bang for the buck when it comes to performance among the two. The Evo wins most of the time when it comes to magazine reviews in stock configuration. The Evo almost always beats the STI in time attacks in both the US and Japan. I don't even recall the STI beating the Evo in time attack. The CT9A Evo is king of time attacks in Japan. The HKS CT230R is number one right now and the Cyber Evo is number two in Tsukuba. Time attack STIs in Japan are usually one to two seconds behind the Evos in Tsukuba. AMS TA1 is also the fastest American time attack car last time I checked. It has set records all over the place here.
Except that we never got the evo 8 or 9 in Canada and currently local dealerships are selling the GSR for 5000$ over MSRP with a crappy finance rate (something like 8%) and they require a 5000$ deposit just to test drive. A few people in the Subaru club thought about getting an evo but didn't want to have to write a cheque for 5k$ just to take the damn thing around the block.
It's debatable whether the new evo outperforms the new STI (since the reviews seem to be more evenly split on which is the better car) and time attack results speak nothing about the street car since both the HKS and the Cyber Evo are so heavily modified that they only really resemble the car in chassis only (and even that's not completely true). For the average person, the difference between the evo and the STI will be so minor that they'd have to try very hard to notice performance wise.
It's debatable whether the new evo outperforms the new STI (since the reviews seem to be more evenly split on which is the better car) and time attack results speak nothing about the street car since both the HKS and the Cyber Evo are so heavily modified that they only really resemble the car in chassis only (and even that's not completely true). For the average person, the difference between the evo and the STI will be so minor that they'd have to try very hard to notice performance wise.
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updated test with test numbers and a video
0-60 in 6.6 sec
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do...ticleId=127586
0-60 in 6.6 sec
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do...ticleId=127586
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won't matter. It also has no launch control, so it takes off like any other automatic...so all things considered its really not too bad. Not sure why everyone thought it would be faster, it 3500lbs and 237hp, that power to weight ratio is a smidge worse than a honda civic si, so the AWD is helping it NOT hit the 7 second mark.
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Except that we never got the evo 8 or 9 in Canada
I guess what I said does not apply for the most part because of that.
and currently local dealerships are selling the GSR for 5000$ over MSRP with a crappy finance rate (something like 8%) and they require a 5000$ deposit just to test drive. A few people in the Subaru club thought about getting an evo but didn't want to have to write a cheque for 5k$ just to take the damn thing around the block.
Just because of that the Evo X cost more? That sucks. Then what I said does not apply at all in Canada.
It's debatable whether the new evo outperforms the new STI (since the reviews seem to be more evenly split on which is the better car)
Straight line numbers, yes. Hardcore Evo and STI fans that know the true purpose of these machines don't care about that. Skidpad and on the track the Evo X GSR and MR have consistently been the winner.
and time attack results speak nothing about the street car since both the HKS and the Cyber Evo are so heavily modified that they only really resemble the car in chassis only (and even that's not completely true).
Then that means the Evo's chassis is superior. It has a stronger block (which is retained in both the HKS CT230R and Cyber Evo. Last time I checked the the center differential (ACD) are retained in both Evos, which is better than the STIs center differential when it comes to torque biasing for optimum handling.
The chassis, the AWD system, and 4G63t block is what makes a CT9A Evo an Evo in my opinion. A modified Evo simply magnifies the difference between it and the STI.
Yes, time attack results do speak something about both the Evo and STI in any level of modification. What these time attack results say is that the Evo is a better platform it terms of performance when modified. The HKS CT230R is just a supreme example of the CT9A Evo's prowess when you have an unlimited budget. This Evo humiliated what the US had to offer when it came over here to compete in time attack including AMS TA1.
As for the Cyber Evo team that built it they have a much smaller budget comparable to the other STI teams and the STI still loses consistently. The same logic applies here in the US.
Mod for mod the Evo has always been faster.
For the average person, the difference between the evo and the STI will be so minor that they'd have to try very hard to notice performance wise.
I guess what I said does not apply for the most part because of that.
and currently local dealerships are selling the GSR for 5000$ over MSRP with a crappy finance rate (something like 8%) and they require a 5000$ deposit just to test drive. A few people in the Subaru club thought about getting an evo but didn't want to have to write a cheque for 5k$ just to take the damn thing around the block.
Just because of that the Evo X cost more? That sucks. Then what I said does not apply at all in Canada.
It's debatable whether the new evo outperforms the new STI (since the reviews seem to be more evenly split on which is the better car)
Straight line numbers, yes. Hardcore Evo and STI fans that know the true purpose of these machines don't care about that. Skidpad and on the track the Evo X GSR and MR have consistently been the winner.
and time attack results speak nothing about the street car since both the HKS and the Cyber Evo are so heavily modified that they only really resemble the car in chassis only (and even that's not completely true).
Then that means the Evo's chassis is superior. It has a stronger block (which is retained in both the HKS CT230R and Cyber Evo. Last time I checked the the center differential (ACD) are retained in both Evos, which is better than the STIs center differential when it comes to torque biasing for optimum handling.
The chassis, the AWD system, and 4G63t block is what makes a CT9A Evo an Evo in my opinion. A modified Evo simply magnifies the difference between it and the STI.
Yes, time attack results do speak something about both the Evo and STI in any level of modification. What these time attack results say is that the Evo is a better platform it terms of performance when modified. The HKS CT230R is just a supreme example of the CT9A Evo's prowess when you have an unlimited budget. This Evo humiliated what the US had to offer when it came over here to compete in time attack including AMS TA1.
As for the Cyber Evo team that built it they have a much smaller budget comparable to the other STI teams and the STI still loses consistently. The same logic applies here in the US.
Mod for mod the Evo has always been faster.
For the average person, the difference between the evo and the STI will be so minor that they'd have to try very hard to notice performance wise.
Last edited by VincentX; Jun 23, 2008 at 09:50 AM.
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I think I need to read the article again if they turned ASC off for the performance test. If they did, that could be the cause for the bad numbers. People often have this misconception that they are better than a computer that saves your *** when you are ****ing up. Only a true pro should turn ASC off or if the system was designed to intervene when you are not ****ing up.
How many people will truly mod there car to the max though? Sure the evo block is a bit stronger than the STI block but you'd have to be pushing huge power to even notice that/run into that problem. The STI transmission is extremely strong and even the Cosworth STI uses a stock STI transmission.
I don't think time attack cars are at all applicable since they're pure racing cars, that's it. They don't need to be streetable, they don't need to be comfortable, they're about simple speed and handling. Moreover, part of why the evo is so great is the aftermarket support, the 4G63 has been around substantially longer than the EJ257 in the STI and thus more parts are available. That's beginning to change however with even Evo-friendly companies (like Buschur or AMS) turning to the STI/WRX as the new thing.
I don't think time attack cars are at all applicable since they're pure racing cars, that's it. They don't need to be streetable, they don't need to be comfortable, they're about simple speed and handling. Moreover, part of why the evo is so great is the aftermarket support, the 4G63 has been around substantially longer than the EJ257 in the STI and thus more parts are available. That's beginning to change however with even Evo-friendly companies (like Buschur or AMS) turning to the STI/WRX as the new thing.
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I think I need to read the article again if they turned ASC off for the performance test. If they did, that could be the cause for the bad numbers. People often have this misconception that they are better than a computer that saves your *** when you are ****ing up. Only a true pro should turn ASC off or if the system was designed to intervene when you are not ****ing up.
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How many people will truly mod there car to the max though?
Not very many. I guess one percent of them.
Sure the evo block is a bit stronger than the STI block but you'd have to be pushing huge power to even notice that/run into that problem.
I know.
The STI transmission is extremely strong and even the Cosworth STI uses a stock STI transmission.
It has a stronger transmission than a Evo.
I don't think time attack cars are at all applicable since they're pure racing cars, that's it. They don't need to be streetable, they don't need to be comfortable, they're about simple speed and handling.
You can always put the comfortable stuff back into a time attack car when you done with time attacking. Suspension can be swapped back or re-calibrated to a comfortable level. Some private owners of time attack cars use the cars as a DD. There are different classifications in time attack. There is a street class in American time attack. Street class cars can easily be turned back into a comfortable street machine.
Moreover, part of why the evo is so great is the aftermarket support, the 4G63 has been around substantially longer than the EJ257 in the STI and thus more parts are available.
Another reason why the 4G63 is better than the EJ257, EJ20, and EJ22 is that it's much easier to extract power from it. That is why it's has a stronger aftermarket. Aftermarket companies had an easier time producing parts that produce lots of power for the 4g63. The EJ20 has been around almost as long as the 4G63. The EJ20 has been the motor for the STI for the majority of its lifespan, it's the most relevant motor when we are talking about comparing the performance of both the Evo and STI throughout their history. The EJ20 appeared in 1989. It was first used for the 1st generation Legacy. A turbocharged variant was also available at the time. The DOHC 4g63 appeared in 1987. It became turbocharged in 1988 with the introduction of the Galant VR4.
That's beginning to change however with even Evo-friendly companies (like Buschur or AMS) turning to the STI/WRX as the new thing.
Not very many. I guess one percent of them.
Sure the evo block is a bit stronger than the STI block but you'd have to be pushing huge power to even notice that/run into that problem.
I know.
The STI transmission is extremely strong and even the Cosworth STI uses a stock STI transmission.
It has a stronger transmission than a Evo.
I don't think time attack cars are at all applicable since they're pure racing cars, that's it. They don't need to be streetable, they don't need to be comfortable, they're about simple speed and handling.
You can always put the comfortable stuff back into a time attack car when you done with time attacking. Suspension can be swapped back or re-calibrated to a comfortable level. Some private owners of time attack cars use the cars as a DD. There are different classifications in time attack. There is a street class in American time attack. Street class cars can easily be turned back into a comfortable street machine.
Moreover, part of why the evo is so great is the aftermarket support, the 4G63 has been around substantially longer than the EJ257 in the STI and thus more parts are available.
Another reason why the 4G63 is better than the EJ257, EJ20, and EJ22 is that it's much easier to extract power from it. That is why it's has a stronger aftermarket. Aftermarket companies had an easier time producing parts that produce lots of power for the 4g63. The EJ20 has been around almost as long as the 4G63. The EJ20 has been the motor for the STI for the majority of its lifespan, it's the most relevant motor when we are talking about comparing the performance of both the Evo and STI throughout their history. The EJ20 appeared in 1989. It was first used for the 1st generation Legacy. A turbocharged variant was also available at the time. The DOHC 4g63 appeared in 1987. It became turbocharged in 1988 with the introduction of the Galant VR4.
That's beginning to change however with even Evo-friendly companies (like Buschur or AMS) turning to the STI/WRX as the new thing.
That's not completely true though, the newer STI motor (lets say from 04-present) makes very good power with relatively few mods (ie. a turboback and tune nets 40+ hp and tq) and, as you'll see if you read AMS' thread on the subject, more and more companies are realizing this and pushing the car even further. There's no denying that the evo is a fantastic car but I wouldn't be so fast to dismiss the STI since the two are practically brothers.
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I in no way meant to infer that ASC would help. I was wondering if it had a negative effect. Also, I recall one review mentioning the car WOULD break front tire traction under hard acceleration.
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That's not completely true though, the newer STI motor (lets say from 04-present) makes very good power with relatively few mods (ie. a turboback and tune nets 40+ hp and tq) and, as you'll see if you read AMS' thread on the subject, more and more companies are realizing this and pushing the car even further. There's no denying that the evo is a fantastic car but I wouldn't be so fast to dismiss the STI since the two are practically brothers.