Due to the fact that I am still restricted from posting in some areas of the forums . . . . I wanted to respond here to some comments that are being made regarding Evo8powers new 1/4 mile times

- First - a Buschur Turbo equiped car has already gone 11.3 in the 1.4 and there was a lot more left in that car - it only ran 23 psi ! Look at who is #3 on this list.

http://www.dsmtimes.org/evo.htm


The Buschur turbos can get you into the 9's with the right mods

Look at who is # 6 on this list and what kind of turbo he runs

http://www.dsmtimes.org/awd.htm

Buschur has been playing this 4G63 game for a while and trust me when I tell you that his stuff has a lot of potential

As for the stupid comments being made by the same know it all arm chair quarterbacks about evo8power's times - please keep in mind that he was not yet running fulll boost AND he was gaining 29 mph in the back 1/8th which is a fairly reliable indication of the power he is making - compared to my car which has been licking up between 31 - 32 mph in the 1/8 th when tuned to the edge I think Evo8power's perfeormance is very good indeed considering he is still on the stock intake manifold and head

 

 

Still, with some coaching, that car should dip into the 11's.

 

With 28 psi and a hard shifting driver - its a mid 11 second car - I know, I drove it on the road

Much to his credit, however, Evo8power is smart enough to shift easy and take it easy on his machinery - thus keeping his daily driver on the road and out of the shop

 

Al,
That 11.3 was a BR580, not a BR500. I'm sure it was running low boost as you say because it's trap speed was not even close to your's (122.8mph) with your 3037 (130mph).
11.312 122.87 7.265 99.27 1.702 03 EVO VIII BR580 NO Matt Smith Buschur Racing Inc
I'm just curious why you pimp the BR kits so hard but don't use one yourself? If you re-read the posts on the other thread, no-one is attacking you or Buschur Racing. For that matter, I for one, am not attacking anybody here or there.

Botom line is this Al: We know that Kev like to talk and make predictions. So some of us are polite and patient enough to keep our mouths shut until he posts results; as opposed to just flaming him on the spot when he makes a prediction. You might have been referring to others besides me about armchair quarterbacks (Az3ar comes to mind because I have never heard of him actually racing) but I do race my Evo often, as does Evotomig, and IE Evo. Nothing armchair about us: Kevin has called all of us out in the past to say how he was going to crush us once this or that mod is completed. Now he finally gets his car together running great and his times and mph are just barely better than mildly modified cars like ours and worse than a couple of stock turbo cars you have tuned. A stand-alone ecu will help him as he can have a custom tuned map for race gas and one for pump. Of course, now we are looking at another 2+ grand plus tuning. This is what I keep hearing over and over: he needs an AEM EMS. So, am I to understand that the Buschur kits can only be maximized on stand-alones? Doesn't that take you out of the picture, or are you also custom tuning AEMs now?

 

Evo8power does not NEED a AEM or any other engine magagement.

Engine management is like a screw driver - its simply a TOOL to adjust something. Some tools work better than others of course and are better suited to certain kinds of applications

I think the results of Robi's car back when he had the Dyno Flash speak volumes for to potential of a reflash on race fuel. For those who were not familiarwith that car - it was propably the festest stock turbo evo of all time.

Back in April 2003 when the evo was only a few weeks old, I was able to run a 11.80 on my stock turbo car using only a SAFC.

In the cas of evo8power's car - he requested and recieved a MILD street tune as he is mostly concerned about the durability and reliability of his car.

Right now - he is at about 380 whp with this mild street tune - about 60 whp lower than where he COULD be if he wanted to turn up the wick and take a few chances

Basically - the bottom line is that it is really not a prudent idea to go over 400 whp on the stock bottom end if you want your evo engine to be reliable. Sure, some shop evos out there have made more power - (mine made 557 whp) - but my recomendation is to tune the aftermarket turbos for 380 - 400 whp on pump gas.

The funny thing about all of this conversation about the AEM is that when Robi's car was tested for the ultimate street car challenege in LA (dyno jet) he made slightly less whp that I made on our Dyno Jet with the same BR 500 turbo and my reflash (444) and the car I was tuning had a stock head !

You can make power with any tuning platform - IF you know what you are doing and know how the softwear works.

The AEM is great - it gives you more adjustability and options (which most people will never use) and gets rid of your MAF sesnor, however, it is important to realize that there are disadvntages also. No AEM set up is going to give you the feel and driveability quaility of a stock ecu when it comes to cold starting, idel etc. And the AEM is not OBDII emissions compliant.


Evo8power does not need a AEM to run mid 11's - - - he needs a tank of c-16 and my race gas map for the BR500 turbo and 28 psi of boost - that will get him into the mid 440 - 450 whp range and more than enough power to do the job

You can't expect him to go much faster than he is going with a pump gas tune and low boost that he is runing with 380 whp

 

Al,

Your Dynoflash is as useful to Kev as **** are to a bore. To realize the full potential of the BR500 he HAS TO HAVE THE EMS OR A PIGGY BACK AT LEAST.

Thats the general consensus-even Buschur's the last time I spoke with him.


BTW is 26.5 lbs. low boost to you?? That's what he ran last time.

 

I love analogies, but I just don't get this one

 

Did an Al, sorry.

Should have been: as useless as **** on a BOAR....

 

What you are saying is just more internet garbage from yet another Vishnu arm chair quarter back

The FACTS are that I made 444 whp with the flash on a stock head, block and intake manifold evo in AWD dyno - - which is almost as much as Buschur made on a 2wd dyno with the head mods - 500

As for piggy backs - despite the BS being spewed by Visshnu cheer leaders about the merrits of piggy backs - I really have no use what so ever for them. At this point I have opened up virtually all asepcts of the stock ecu mapping and I can produce a better and more repeatable result with the reflash alone than you can get with any piggy back. In EVERY case it is more accurate and more functional to directly manipulate the mapping INSIDE the ECU than to intercept the signals going into the ecu in an attempt to effect tuning.

While the AEM EMS is a very decent product and has its real advantages in racing situations, for a street driving car the reflash stock ecu also has its advantages.

Its simply retarded to say that one is better than the other. They are just different. Each has its own particular pluses and minuses. Saying he needs a AEM to make power is like saying you need a Corvete to go 90 mph when we all know that a Hummer can also go 90 - AND do it with 10 people in there and towing a trailer.

The MAIN advantage of the stock ecu - IMHO lies in the super PROTECTIVE knock sensor protection and the other ecu controlled saftey enrichments and protections which combine to work as a very SAFE engine management system. Please remember that spent millions of dollars over 10 years perfecting the Evo ecu and it does an amazing job of keeping your engine safe and in one piece. While these saftey features do sometimes stand in the way of ultimate power - they do protect you from blowing up your engine under hard driving conditions and also when you get a bad load of fuel.

It should be noted that we have 760 plus Dyno Flashes out there at this point and NO REPORTED engine failures.

I find that automotive tuning is about a series of trade offs - where you draw the line is going to tell how fast your car runs and HOW LONG it runs that way. To me its ridiculous to be having this debate about evo8power's drag performance as his TUNE is a very conservative and safe tune designed to maximize durability AT THE EXPENSE of about 50 - 60 lost whp left on the table.

Sure - he could add a AEM - turn OFF the knock ptotection - rul 12.00 a/f's and agressive timing and make more whp. He would also compromise his driveability and smoothness, start up and without a doubt the saftey margin of his vehicle.

Also - he could get the AEM - tune it for the same conservative a/f settings, ign timing and leave the knock protection active. In that event - I feel the advantage of removing the MAF sensor and going speed density would be approx 10 - 15 whp.

 

Al, how much does a stock ecu unit cost?

 

My cost is about $650 for the ecu - then you need to get the codes for the imobilizer and keys programed in and your good to go

An interesting option - which none of my customers have tried yet - is having two seperate ecus - one with street pump gas settings and the other with race gas settings and switch them back and forth

We are continuing to work on the so called "dual stage flash" which will have both settings in the same ecu - however that will ONLY work on bigger turbos which can hold a very steady and consistant boost level

 

You read my mind. Definitely worth considering. I share your feelings on the stock ecu. It is a great piece of work.

 

Al I was wondering from the pics of the engine in Buschur's car, it has no a/c and is missing a few other parts. Were these done for weight reduction?

 

I am not sure if Robi's car ever hit the road - BUT - I am fairly confident he was running the stock turbo / reflash combo at the OTC race and at the SCC time attack where he placed very well in bost events. Also - I drove the car myself and it was exceedingly fast for a stock turbo car. I know that a lot of www.socalevo.net members checked out Robi's car in that level of trim - basically Buschur Flash stage 4 with the Buschur head. With the very agressive race tune that Robi requested it was very quick.