GT35r spoolup answers here
Aug 8, 2005, 12:20 PM
#151
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Originally Posted by bdiddy
Whoa. That must have been first gear for your grammar check too, that thing never spooled up! 
Spell check was a bit laggy as well.
Please keep us informed, and don't worry about bringing the "don't hate me because I'm beautiful" responses. There may be a few jealous Evo owners in the crowd and with your car it's bound to happen.
I'm going to be .3 liters larger soon and really would like to see your progress, with accomplishments and failures. I think your car is very well set up and you seem to have some longevity too. Good job, and thanks for any "useful" updates.
Spell check was a bit laggy as well. Please keep us informed, and don't worry about bringing the "don't hate me because I'm beautiful" responses. There may be a few jealous Evo owners in the crowd and with your car it's bound to happen.
I'm going to be .3 liters larger soon and really would like to see your progress, with accomplishments and failures. I think your car is very well set up and you seem to have some longevity too. Good job, and thanks for any "useful" updates.
thanks again
chris
Aug 8, 2005, 12:40 PM
#152
Originally Posted by TrinaBabe
Here is what a GT35r spool-up looks like. This should help anyone that ever wonders how laggy a turbo it truly is. I find it perfectly streetable but by that I mean it drives on the street.... it doesnt spool on the street unless I know I am going to race it. Here are the important mods:
Stock Motor, Stock head aside from 272/272 Cams, Magnus Sheetmetal Intake, Buschurs Intercooler, Equal Length Header, GT35R (.63 AR with the small E-Cover), Full turbo-back exhaust (No cat, tubular O2 housing), normalish timing (Not diving timing tremendously trying to help it spool earlier), and obviously all other support mods.
The car will BARELY hit full boost in 1st gear roll-on (Hits full boost at around 7.1-7.3k) This log is from a second gear roll. Anyways, hope this will help people decide if they want to go to the dark side of large turbos or not
Personally i dont mind it but you will not be autocrossing the car.
Now dont let this mislead you too badly... third gear will spool quicker and 4th even more so (Quicker meaning lower RPM) and the does start to pull very hard before full boost but none-the-less... this is the true spoolup. I wish I would have had this equipment when I still had the stocker to display the difference... oh well.
Stock Motor, Stock head aside from 272/272 Cams, Magnus Sheetmetal Intake, Buschurs Intercooler, Equal Length Header, GT35R (.63 AR with the small E-Cover), Full turbo-back exhaust (No cat, tubular O2 housing), normalish timing (Not diving timing tremendously trying to help it spool earlier), and obviously all other support mods.
The car will BARELY hit full boost in 1st gear roll-on (Hits full boost at around 7.1-7.3k) This log is from a second gear roll. Anyways, hope this will help people decide if they want to go to the dark side of large turbos or not
Personally i dont mind it but you will not be autocrossing the car.Now dont let this mislead you too badly... third gear will spool quicker and 4th even more so (Quicker meaning lower RPM) and the does start to pull very hard before full boost but none-the-less... this is the true spoolup. I wish I would have had this equipment when I still had the stocker to display the difference... oh well.
I can see the GT35R on a stroker but not on a stock block. Ask Ray(rraulston), he couldn't handle the turbo lag no m,ore on his GT35R so he went back to stock turbo with 10.5, he actually runs faster with the stocker turbo.
What is the fun if you are getting the full boost at 7200rpm?, yeah, I understand that the gt35R puts some good horsepower at lower psi and that the boost is not equal but still the turbo lag I could not live with it..
I hit 25psi plus below 3000rpm on my MR, shift up and you get 25psi plus instantly, I can hold 22psi to the red line, I can get full boost in 6th gear on the highway at just over 65mph.
I could afford to beat a Mustang Cobra with over 480hp by mistakingly shifting from 1st to 2nd to 5th gear and still got a 13.2@105 on the 1/4 mile last week at SIR(Tucson on Midnight Madness).
If I would have had the GT35R I would probably have ran a 15 sec 1/4 shifting from 1st,2nd and 5th.
My car was able to hit aboslutely full boost inmediately picking up speed and boost rapidly when I shifted to 5th from 2nd at 60mph plus.
Aug 8, 2005, 02:18 PM
#153
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Originally Posted by fromWRXtoEVO
<snip>
I hit 25psi plus below 3000rpm on my MR, shift up and you get 25psi plus instantly, I can hold 22psi to the red line, I can get full boost in 6th gear on the highway at just over 65mph.
<snip>
I hit 25psi plus below 3000rpm on my MR, shift up and you get 25psi plus instantly, I can hold 22psi to the red line, I can get full boost in 6th gear on the highway at just over 65mph.
<snip>
Aug 8, 2005, 03:17 PM
#156
I do have a dyno vid in which you can pause it right about 4100-4200 rpms and see that the boost hits 35psi at that point. I'm sure the dyno vid is still floating around the forums here. The dyno was in 4th though. As soon as we get Chris' car back together we will be sure to post up some logs of each gear so you can judge for yourself the spoolup in that gear.
Barry
Barry
Aug 8, 2005, 06:21 PM
#157
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Okay, I'll stir the pot a little with some real world log data.
Notes:
2.3L stroker (2,298 CC) (Jackson Auto Machine)
8.5:1 CR pistons (8.63:1 effective CR)
Ported & polished head (Jackson Auto Machine)
1mm oversized valves
264/264 HKS
Full Race tubular manifold & downpipe
Buschur Racing 3" Cat-back
Buschur Racing FMIC
Buschur Racing UICP
GT35R - .63A/R w/ PTE surge ported .70A/R compressor cover
TiAL 44 WG w/ "little blue" .5 bar spring
AEM EMS (Brad Brooks tuned)
FIC 850s
Hallman MBC
>>>>Edit - More notes:
1.) I'm not yet running the full boost on the street. The motor is not broken in yet. My goal is to run 21-22psi on 93 octane.
2.) To derive the values below I used the EMS log data and SUBTRACTED the 1.8 psi the MAP sensor has been reading when the motor is not running.
2nd gear pull
Time-----RPM------Boost(psi)--(Comments)
0.00-----2000-----0.00 (mash throttle)
---------2100-----0.00
---------2200-----0.20
---------2300-----0.30
---------2400-----0.35
---------2500-----0.53
---------2600-----0.83
---------2700-----1.10
1.00-----2800-----1.38
---------2900-----1.72
---------3000-----2.07
---------3100-----2.33
---------3200-----2.79
---------3300-----3.12
---------3400-----3.28
---------3500-----3.74
---------3600-----4.37
2.00-----3700-----4.66 (umm, stuff starts to happen right about here)
---------3800-----5.16
---------3900-----6.88
---------4000-----7.80
2.35-----4100-----8.50
---------4200-----9.70
---------4300-----11.00
---------4400-----11.75
---------4500-----13.75
2.70-----4600-----14.33
---------4700-----16.00 (wastegate begins to open)
---------4800-----16.50
---------4900-----16.90
---------5000-----17.20
3.00-----5100-----17.35
---------5200-----17.27
---------5300-----17.35
---------5400-----17.40
---------5500-----17.45
---------5600-----17.75 (boost creep sets in)
---------5700-----18.00
---------5800-----17.50
---------5900-----18.26
---------6000-----18.00
---------6100-----18.50
---------6200-----19.00
---------6300-----19.25
---------6400-----19.75
---------6500-----20.00
---------6600-----20.00
---------6700-----19.76
---------6800-----19.65
4.00-----6900-----19.70
---------7000-----19.80
---------7100-----19.75
---------7200-----20.81
---------7300-----20.50
---------7400-----20.50
---------7500-----20.50
4.50-----7600-----20.50
Notes:
2.3L stroker (2,298 CC) (Jackson Auto Machine)
8.5:1 CR pistons (8.63:1 effective CR)
Ported & polished head (Jackson Auto Machine)
1mm oversized valves
264/264 HKS
Full Race tubular manifold & downpipe
Buschur Racing 3" Cat-back
Buschur Racing FMIC
Buschur Racing UICP
GT35R - .63A/R w/ PTE surge ported .70A/R compressor cover
TiAL 44 WG w/ "little blue" .5 bar spring
AEM EMS (Brad Brooks tuned)
FIC 850s
Hallman MBC
>>>>Edit - More notes:
1.) I'm not yet running the full boost on the street. The motor is not broken in yet. My goal is to run 21-22psi on 93 octane.
2.) To derive the values below I used the EMS log data and SUBTRACTED the 1.8 psi the MAP sensor has been reading when the motor is not running.
2nd gear pull
Time-----RPM------Boost(psi)--(Comments)
0.00-----2000-----0.00 (mash throttle)
---------2100-----0.00
---------2200-----0.20
---------2300-----0.30
---------2400-----0.35
---------2500-----0.53
---------2600-----0.83
---------2700-----1.10
1.00-----2800-----1.38
---------2900-----1.72
---------3000-----2.07
---------3100-----2.33
---------3200-----2.79
---------3300-----3.12
---------3400-----3.28
---------3500-----3.74
---------3600-----4.37
2.00-----3700-----4.66 (umm, stuff starts to happen right about here)
---------3800-----5.16
---------3900-----6.88
---------4000-----7.80
2.35-----4100-----8.50
---------4200-----9.70
---------4300-----11.00
---------4400-----11.75
---------4500-----13.75
2.70-----4600-----14.33
---------4700-----16.00 (wastegate begins to open)
---------4800-----16.50
---------4900-----16.90
---------5000-----17.20
3.00-----5100-----17.35
---------5200-----17.27
---------5300-----17.35
---------5400-----17.40
---------5500-----17.45
---------5600-----17.75 (boost creep sets in)
---------5700-----18.00
---------5800-----17.50
---------5900-----18.26
---------6000-----18.00
---------6100-----18.50
---------6200-----19.00
---------6300-----19.25
---------6400-----19.75
---------6500-----20.00
---------6600-----20.00
---------6700-----19.76
---------6800-----19.65
4.00-----6900-----19.70
---------7000-----19.80
---------7100-----19.75
---------7200-----20.81
---------7300-----20.50
---------7400-----20.50
---------7500-----20.50
4.50-----7600-----20.50
Last edited by propellerhead; Aug 10, 2005 at 03:07 PM.
Aug 8, 2005, 06:39 PM
#158
Originally Posted by fromWRXtoEVO
No thanks!! I stay with stock turbo. I learned my lesson when I did a FP18G ported and polished on my WRX, full boost at around 5100-5200rpm, no power waht so ever when driving from traffic light to traffic light, no power at all when the A/C was on, awfull acceleration from a roll in low gears. Awfull track times, the engine rev use to drop a lot then it will take a while for boost to come back alive, like I said pittyful experience.
I can see the GT35R on a stroker but not on a stock block. Ask Ray(rraulston), he couldn't handle the turbo lag no m,ore on his GT35R so he went back to stock turbo with 10.5, he actually runs faster with the stocker turbo.
What is the fun if you are getting the full boost at 7200rpm?, yeah, I understand that the gt35R puts some good horsepower at lower psi and that the boost is not equal but still the turbo lag I could not live with it..
I hit 25psi plus below 3000rpm on my MR, shift up and you get 25psi plus instantly, I can hold 22psi to the red line, I can get full boost in 6th gear on the highway at just over 65mph.
I could afford to beat a Mustang Cobra with over 480hp by mistakingly shifting from 1st to 2nd to 5th gear and still got a 13.2@105 on the 1/4 mile last week at SIR(Tucson on Midnight Madness).
If I would have had the GT35R I would probably have ran a 15 sec 1/4 shifting from 1st,2nd and 5th.
My car was able to hit aboslutely full boost inmediately picking up speed and boost rapidly when I shifted to 5th from 2nd at 60mph plus.
I can see the GT35R on a stroker but not on a stock block. Ask Ray(rraulston), he couldn't handle the turbo lag no m,ore on his GT35R so he went back to stock turbo with 10.5, he actually runs faster with the stocker turbo.
What is the fun if you are getting the full boost at 7200rpm?, yeah, I understand that the gt35R puts some good horsepower at lower psi and that the boost is not equal but still the turbo lag I could not live with it..
I hit 25psi plus below 3000rpm on my MR, shift up and you get 25psi plus instantly, I can hold 22psi to the red line, I can get full boost in 6th gear on the highway at just over 65mph.
I could afford to beat a Mustang Cobra with over 480hp by mistakingly shifting from 1st to 2nd to 5th gear and still got a 13.2@105 on the 1/4 mile last week at SIR(Tucson on Midnight Madness).
If I would have had the GT35R I would probably have ran a 15 sec 1/4 shifting from 1st,2nd and 5th.
My car was able to hit aboslutely full boost inmediately picking up speed and boost rapidly when I shifted to 5th from 2nd at 60mph plus.
I could be wrong though? Prove it to me Lag really isn't that bad as long as you are a competent driver and don't shift like a monkey (i.e. shifting from 2nd to 5th).
Last edited by fre; Aug 8, 2005 at 06:41 PM.
Aug 8, 2005, 06:54 PM
#159
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New updated chart. As you can see from real data that 2.3L stroker + GT35R is not automaticly = "stock like spool". Propellerheads car has all good supporting modifications. Excelent data, thanks for contributing.
on a side note, I think I might remove the SCM61 off my car and go for a GT3071 from precision. I can deal with spoolup similar to propellerheads. The BR440 was too small for the power I want, and the SCM61 is just too laggy to deal with every day. Unfortuanatly, Im restriciting myself to "bolt on dsm" turbine housing and internal wastegate. This limits the options a bit.
Last edited by DSMotorsport; Aug 8, 2005 at 07:02 PM.
Aug 8, 2005, 07:15 PM
#160
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Originally Posted by bpclements
I do have a dyno vid in which you can pause it right about 4100-4200 rpms and see that the boost hits 35psi at that point. I'm sure the dyno vid is still floating around the forums here. The dyno was in 4th though. As soon as we get Chris' car back together we will be sure to post up some logs of each gear so you can judge for yourself the spoolup in that gear.
Barry
Barry
I don't mean to come off as a ***** at all in regards to posting and I regret it now, it's just that what people seem to think about spoolup from looking at gauges and judging with thier eye seems to vary A LOT from what the ems actually records. Sorry that I got aggrivated by all the 2-3 pages of opionion and no usable data.
Aug 8, 2005, 08:16 PM
#161
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Originally Posted by DSMotorsport
New updated chart. As you can see from real data that 2.3L stroker + GT35R is not automaticly = "stock like spool". Propellerheads car has all good supporting modifications. Excelent data, thanks for contributing.
Also, as I noted above, the numbers I posted are compensated for the 1.8 psi the AEM MAP sensor was reading today when the motor was not running.
Aug 9, 2005, 07:03 AM
#163
Finally some more good data... sorry I havent been getting anything but I have WAY too many projects going on at once. Im trying to get a twin disk in before the shootout. Chances are that wont be happening 
Maybe someone wants to do it for me at the shootout the night before Im also trying to put a V8 in my RX7 and that is taking up a ton of my spare time all the while working long shifts so I dont need to take any vacation time for the 4 days off for the shootout. Ill get something sooner or later though I would really like to try screwing with the timing and get the turbo to spool as early as possible.
Maybe someone wants to do it for me at the shootout the night before Im also trying to put a V8 in my RX7 and that is taking up a ton of my spare time all the while working long shifts so I dont need to take any vacation time for the 4 days off for the shootout. Ill get something sooner or later though I would really like to try screwing with the timing and get the turbo to spool as early as possible.
Aug 9, 2005, 07:14 PM
#164
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Originally Posted by TrinaBabe
Finally some more good data... sorry I havent been getting anything but I have WAY too many projects going on at once. Im trying to get a twin disk in before the shootout. Chances are that wont be happening Maybe someone wants to do it for me at the shootout the night before Im also trying to put a V8 in my RX7 and that is taking up a ton of my spare time all the while working long shifts so I dont need to take any vacation time for the 4 days off for the shootout. Ill get something sooner or later though I would really like to try screwing with the timing and get the turbo to spool as early as possible.
Maybe someone wants to do it for me at the shootout the night before Im also trying to put a V8 in my RX7 and that is taking up a ton of my spare time all the while working long shifts so I dont need to take any vacation time for the 4 days off for the shootout. Ill get something sooner or later though I would really like to try screwing with the timing and get the turbo to spool as early as possible.RX7 with the V8....is that the LT1 kit? There was one of those at the USCC this year, that thing was pretty damned fast, and handled great too. Very cool....
