Boost Characteristics of A Large Turbo
Kyle, the wastegate is a 38mm and there are two springs in there that should equate to about 22 pounds (pretty sure). I was running it off of spring pressure for quite a while until I got the boost control working properly.
Ummm, this is what you said in your original post:
With my car, if I set the MBC to 24 psi, it goes to 24 psi and stays there until redline.... it does NOT go to spring pressure, creep up a bit, jump to MBC set pressure and THEN maintain until redline like you are talking about. If I set my MBC to a low pressure, I get boost creep. This means that if I set it to spring pressure on a 1 bar spring the wastegate opens up at 14.5 psi and pressure gradualy creeps up beyoned 14.5 psi as the RPM's go towards redline.
So if I want a maximum of 22 psi I will adjust the MBC so that the wastegate starts opening at some pressure below 22 psi (19 or 20 psi for example). In that example, the turbo spools up to 19 psi and the wastegate starts to open, and then boost creeps up to 22 psi by redline. No sudden jump in pressure like you were talking about.
Keith
Keith
Originally Posted by KOEvo
With the MBC on and set; the turbo SEEMS to first spool in an identical fashion to how it does with the MBC off (just wastegate controlled); meaning it quickly spools to 18-19 psi and then creeps up to 20-20.5 shortly there after (still no spike). Now with the MBC on, after it creeps up to the 20-20.5 mark it quickly jumps up at where the MBC is set (where ever i set it at, but lets use 23 for example) and holds that psi to redline.
So if I want a maximum of 22 psi I will adjust the MBC so that the wastegate starts opening at some pressure below 22 psi (19 or 20 psi for example). In that example, the turbo spools up to 19 psi and the wastegate starts to open, and then boost creeps up to 22 psi by redline. No sudden jump in pressure like you were talking about.
Keith
Keith
DeadBeatrice, Koevo8 have you guys tried your mbc's this way on your atp's yet? I havent tried this way as I havent had the time to put on my atp kit on yet. 
1- run a boost line straight from the lower ic pipe to the bottom on the wastegate.
2- put a tee fitting somewhere in that line.
3- run the line off of the tee fitting to the inlet side of your bleed style controller.
4- then run a line from the outlet side of the controller to the top of the wastegate.
now, turn the contoller knob all the way out till you cant blow through it.
note: you will always be able to blow through the outlet side of the controller. this is normal. but you should not be able to blow through the inlet side!
then all you got to do is turn the knob in and it will add boost.
only turn it a little bit at a time to keep from having and accident!!
this setup works on a different principal than the way you have yours hooked up.
your way, the spring holds pressure till it overcomes the spring.
this way it is like putting a stiffer spring in the WG as this way the boost bleeds onto the top of the WG and holds the valve down. and you can vary this amount by bleeding more pressure to the top of the WG.
hope this helps.... i have already been there scratching my head too !!
-derek
1- run a boost line straight from the lower ic pipe to the bottom on the wastegate.
2- put a tee fitting somewhere in that line.
3- run the line off of the tee fitting to the inlet side of your bleed style controller.
4- then run a line from the outlet side of the controller to the top of the wastegate.
now, turn the contoller knob all the way out till you cant blow through it.
note: you will always be able to blow through the outlet side of the controller. this is normal. but you should not be able to blow through the inlet side!
then all you got to do is turn the knob in and it will add boost.
only turn it a little bit at a time to keep from having and accident!!
this setup works on a different principal than the way you have yours hooked up.
your way, the spring holds pressure till it overcomes the spring.
this way it is like putting a stiffer spring in the WG as this way the boost bleeds onto the top of the WG and holds the valve down. and you can vary this amount by bleeding more pressure to the top of the WG.
hope this helps.... i have already been there scratching my head too !!
-derek
its deadbeatrec and no. im getting it installed next week. it will be dynoed and tuned as well. and what way are u talking about? u hook it up the same way as u would any other turbo/turbo kit.
im a little confused, so im assuming that u sold ur kit to KOevo correct? the my next question is, did u add a spring to the wastegate or does the ATP kit come with 2 springs in there?
Yeah he sold me his kit. I believe he got 2 custom springs put in it, the wastegate had a problem at first...
ok so u have a 38mm with 2 spings in it. if u go on tial.com u can see the different combos of springs and pressures. i wish i knew what was in it right now, and im too lazy to take it apart.
i have a peak boost 3076 kit and it did the same thing when i put the kit on with a ball and spring (hallman) type controller. so i called tim and PB and he told me that this controller wont work. it will NOT control the boost from a big turbo.
i used this controller on my stock turbo and it worked great! in my case i have an aem ems so i hook up a GM boost sol. and run it with the ems. NO more problems!
if you dont have an electronic controller then you can use a bleed style controller like turbonetics. i dont like them but they work. BUT, it needs to be hooked up differently than your hallman. do the following....
1- run a boost line straight from the lower ic pipe to the bottom on the wastegate.
2- put a tee fitting somewhere in that line.
3- run the line off of the tee fitting to the inlet side of your bleed style controller.
4- then run a line from the outlet side of the controller to the top of the wastegate.
now, turn the contoller knob all the way out till you cant blow through it.
note: you will always be able to blow through the outlet side of the controller. this is normal. but you should not be able to blow through the inlet side!
then all you got to do is turn the knob in and it will add boost.
only turn it a little bit at a time to keep from having and accident!!
this setup works on a different principal than the way you have yours hooked up.
your way, the spring holds pressure till it overcomes the spring.
this way it is like putting a stiffer spring in the WG as this way the boost bleeds onto the top of the WG and holds the valve down. and you can vary this amount by bleeding more pressure to the top of the WG.
hope this helps.... i have already been there scratching my head too !!
-derek
i used this controller on my stock turbo and it worked great! in my case i have an aem ems so i hook up a GM boost sol. and run it with the ems. NO more problems!
if you dont have an electronic controller then you can use a bleed style controller like turbonetics. i dont like them but they work. BUT, it needs to be hooked up differently than your hallman. do the following....
1- run a boost line straight from the lower ic pipe to the bottom on the wastegate.
2- put a tee fitting somewhere in that line.
3- run the line off of the tee fitting to the inlet side of your bleed style controller.
4- then run a line from the outlet side of the controller to the top of the wastegate.
now, turn the contoller knob all the way out till you cant blow through it.
note: you will always be able to blow through the outlet side of the controller. this is normal. but you should not be able to blow through the inlet side!
then all you got to do is turn the knob in and it will add boost.
only turn it a little bit at a time to keep from having and accident!!
this setup works on a different principal than the way you have yours hooked up.
your way, the spring holds pressure till it overcomes the spring.
this way it is like putting a stiffer spring in the WG as this way the boost bleeds onto the top of the WG and holds the valve down. and you can vary this amount by bleeding more pressure to the top of the WG.
hope this helps.... i have already been there scratching my head too !!
-derek
Suscribed:
I bought my car with the ATP GT3076R kit on it already. The car was very strong untill I removed the EBC, Greddy E-01 (I wanted something with no learning curve) So I put a Forge UNOS (Recirc), I installed it off the BOV line due to a popular tuners advice. But it seems when the WG opes (Tial 38 or 44mm?????? not sure) It is like I lose a ton of power. I assume (my first turbo car) the bov opens partially due to the vaccume as if I have a 1 inch hole in my upper ICP. Also under any light loads I have severe bucking of the car and fluttering of the bov. Now I just recently read about tapping the LICP or using a ATP Quick Tap to get a vac line for the MBC, I will install the Quick Tap at work on Friday and see how this works.
Now if I am correct and the BOV is opening with the WG will I need a re-tune for the diffrent amounts of air re-circing back into the MAF?? Sorry I dont want to hijack but I feel my problem is kinda relitive!
I bought my car with the ATP GT3076R kit on it already. The car was very strong untill I removed the EBC, Greddy E-01 (I wanted something with no learning curve) So I put a Forge UNOS (Recirc), I installed it off the BOV line due to a popular tuners advice. But it seems when the WG opes (Tial 38 or 44mm?????? not sure) It is like I lose a ton of power. I assume (my first turbo car) the bov opens partially due to the vaccume as if I have a 1 inch hole in my upper ICP. Also under any light loads I have severe bucking of the car and fluttering of the bov. Now I just recently read about tapping the LICP or using a ATP Quick Tap to get a vac line for the MBC, I will install the Quick Tap at work on Friday and see how this works.
Now if I am correct and the BOV is opening with the WG will I need a re-tune for the diffrent amounts of air re-circing back into the MAF?? Sorry I dont want to hijack but I feel my problem is kinda relitive!
Deadbeatrec , im referring to what that other guy said to do for the numbered steps on hooking up some other mbc from the atp licp in my quote
Originally Posted by browningderek:
1- run a boost line straight from the lower ic pipe to the bottom on the wastegate.
2- put a tee fitting somewhere in that line.
3- run the line off of the tee fitting to the inlet side of your bleed style controller.
4- then run a line from the outlet side of the controller to the top of the wastegate.
^^^^^ this is what i was referring to for you guys
1- run a boost line straight from the lower ic pipe to the bottom on the wastegate.
2- put a tee fitting somewhere in that line.
3- run the line off of the tee fitting to the inlet side of your bleed style controller.
4- then run a line from the outlet side of the controller to the top of the wastegate.
^^^^^ this is what i was referring to for you guys
Originally Posted by browningderek:
1- run a boost line straight from the lower ic pipe to the bottom on the wastegate.
2- put a tee fitting somewhere in that line.
3- run the line off of the tee fitting to the inlet side of your bleed style controller.
4- then run a line from the outlet side of the controller to the top of the wastegate.
1- run a boost line straight from the lower ic pipe to the bottom on the wastegate.
2- put a tee fitting somewhere in that line.
3- run the line off of the tee fitting to the inlet side of your bleed style controller.
4- then run a line from the outlet side of the controller to the top of the wastegate.