MAn that really sucks, Get the motor taken apart to have a better look.

My motor spun a bearing the day i got it.
But it didnt snap a rod like that.

Went with a Jackson Auto Mechine 2.3 Stroker and while i was at it.
I got the head worked on as well.

Good luck, and let us know more once you find out.

 

I have been recently looking/researching meth injection. After talking with chemist at work and looking at TSB manuals I am iffy about it.
#1 Mitsu says in their TSB do not put methonal in with fuel because it will cause fuel compoents failure. (yes meth injection is not in fuel but intake but still its corrosive nevertheless.
#2 its chemically a known fact that methonal is very corrosive to aluminum, it destroys layer that protects it from being oxidized.
since our heads are alluminum well my thinking is the methonal is creating those hot spots and causing that detonation.
Now a lot of guys say well the methonal is not inside the combustion chamber long enough to make the chemical reaction. BUT we all know combustion is not perfect by all means and im sure some of that methonal is still left inside especially when you have been boosting a lot and then let the car sit for a few days before driving it again. Also chemically its very easy for methonal to "grab" water from the atmoshpere and get in that intermediate state of liquid to vapor where it can plug up small gaps such as at the spray nozzle and even get in the vapor state in enough time to actually cool the air causing detonation of course.

I still think their is nothing wrong using the techology,but isnt their some kind of coating to put on to stop the chemical reaction taking place.
Real drag and race guys using meth injection make a habit of flushing the whole system after each day of use, but who wants to do that to a daily driver.
Coating is the answer i think, what can be used?

 

I would look at the tune, look at the FPR vacuum lines, then look at the meth injection system.

You CAN run 30-34psi on stock motor safely as many of my local cars do it. Difference is that my cars run the TTP-Engineering meth injection system complete with 1000cc injector, superior Shurflo pump, full safeguards with boost cut based on lean AFR and or high EGT.

Before someone rains in and states that we have 93oct in FL, I will say that we have tuned CA bound meth injected Evo's also by mixing 50% 87oct and 50% 93oct to achieve 90oct to tune for 91oct in CA. We tune those cars to 30psi as well.

I currently run over the max readout on my MAP sensor of 35.5psi+ with the Evogreen and my meth injection system. The only difference in my system is that I also use the MAFTPro piggyback fuel controller to switch maps to pump gas and drop boost to 20psi (pump gas map) if the programmed alarms are set off by the conditions in the engine.

 

34 on stock motor, is that including stock head studs?

 

I ran 34psi for a few months on stock HG. I eventually got real **** and upgraded them.

My tech ran 34psi for a few months also, finally lifted the head just a little and then replaced the HG and added studs within a few hours.

 

aw ok gotcha, hey what are your thoughts on my comment about chemical nature of meth with aluminum?

 

yes i lifted the head during a 4th gear pull and replace the headgasket and the studs in the same day. my car since is still running 34psi on the stock bottom end and continue to run very well with no problems at all.

 

I am on my 3rd year of methanol in the Evolution MR purchased in Oct 2004. There are ZERO signs of any corrosion or deterioration from use of methanol. In all actuality I believe it is actually much better for the car as it steam cleans the pistons, combustion chamber and plugs when in use. Carbon buildup on piston tops is a thing of the past.

 

a few things i see from the pics are:

your missing rod bolt = broken bolt? how high have you spun your engine in the past..........honestly.

no color on the big end = really dont think it was a spun bearing.

 

if the rod is can sit outside of the block i really dought the bolt would be missing whatever is left of it is sitting in the oil pan or broken into the rod itself.

 

rod bolt.......i found it resting on the undertray...mangled. pretty sure the rest of the pieces are in the pan.

i have yet to rip the motor apart and actually see the extent of the damage. im just hoping that none of the vavletrain components/pistons had shot up through the head after the rod broke loose...more so, im hoping no head damage in general at all.

man this sucks

 

glad you found the bolt.

so how high have you rev'd your engine?

 

You can get away with 3o plus PSI on some stock short blocks with alchy and pump gas

However, as I suggested above it is NOT something I recomend or encourage to my customers as it is a very agreesive way of tuning which leaves little margin for error and saftey in the event of bad gas

BTW mixing gas to approximate fuel in Cali and being in Cali , HI or Ak tuning are totally different things. I have been to Cali dozens of times and I realize that the fuel there sucks really badly and requires very special tuning to make the engine run happy.

I will say this, this is what I tell my customers who want to run 30 psi on pump gas with alchy

"What will you do if the engine throws a rod or splits a piston and the entire long block is runined?"

Some customers have said "No problem, in that case I will just call Buschur and get a new built motor" - THOSE are the customers who should consider being very agreessive with boost levels and tuning.

Other customers have said "Man if my engine blew I would have no way to get to work and I am totally broke after maxing out my credit cards on mods for my Evo and cant afford to spend any more money" - IMHO Those customers should run more conservative boost levels of 24 - 26 psi - enjoy 90% of the benefit of alchy and run with a huge margin of saftey to provide a very safe and long term reliable set up.

As I have suggested - to ME alchol injection is a tuning aide and allows you to run a moderatly higher boost level and slightly more agresive tuning safely on pump gas.

Alcohol injection is NOT a substitute for C16 and should not be used as such.

In the end it all comes down to tuning style, how you set up the timing and boost levels and how comfortable the tuner and the customer are with a given level of risk.

IMHO running over 30 psi with pump gas and alchy is not a set up I am comfortable to recoemend that my customers use on a long term basis - with or without a fail safe. The pump gas fuel quality varies greatly on a daily basis and it is way too risky IMHO to realy on the injection of some alchy to supress all knock that may occur at those very high boost levels - particularly on stock turbo cars which generate huge intake charge temps and a lot of back pressure in the cylinder.

It all comes down to the style of tuner and this is why I am taking this opportunity to highlight the dangers of running agressive tunes and boost levels with pumop and alcky.

Al

 

well step one is to pull the head off and take a look at the piston. If there is excessive detonation Signs would point towards a sudden loss in fuel/methanol.

If the pistons look clean you could of just overstressed the stock internals but the first step is getting that head off to check its condition and to check the pistons.

Eric

 

Yes, the tuner would have to be very experienced in methanol injection tuning. Have a proven track record to follow. Be well versed in managing knock thresholds through competant tuning. This is not the place for block ignition timing tuning and anyone using a tuner with a history of "block ignition timing" tuning SHOULD NOT boost higher than 26-28psi, because the motor could be under risk of imminent danger under that tuning style.

TTP-Engineering runs ALL their meth tuned Evo's over 30psi and there is no long term reliability issues as a result of this practice with proper tuning and TTP meth injection kit (or another kit of sufficient components).

TTP-Engineering does not seem to experience any of the "bad gas" situation that seem to happen so frequently elsewhere. The fuel must be specially made for our market or something. Crazy...
I would like to take this oppportunity to mirror Al's warning of danger. If your injection system and reflash tuning is not optimized for the conditions in which is safe for 30-34psi on factory turbocharger boost, then your engine health may be in grave danger.

Luckily there are meth injection systems and tuners with experience enough to run safely at these power, torque and boost levels on pump + meth injection. Its your job to choose the most competant system and tuner to insure the longevity of your motor.