AC questions, Stalling issues, and RPMs dropping problems, need feedback please read
Jul 26, 2003, 01:20 AM
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AC questions, Stalling issues, and RPMs dropping problems, need feedback please read
OK, no doubt some of you hvae read my post in the troubleshooting section of the evo technical forum, about my evo stalling, and rpms falling etc.....
Well, the dealer is giving me the runaround (so is mitsu corporate), and i want to turn to all of you evo owners out there for some information to help me combat my troubles with mitsu. (for specifics on my issue please refer to my post in troubleshooting forum). Modorators, please don't move this to a less viewed forum, i'm just trying to get some info to back my side up.
Ok here we go. My evo keeps having the RPMs drop when coming to a stop, (such as inching up in heavy traffic, or inching up while in a driveway, etc....), when the clutch is pushed in suddenly. Now, for some reason, the car only does this with the AC turned on (possibly putting a lot of electrical draw on the system). The car is stock now (and was when this first began happening, prior to slight modifications), and continues to do this. Sometimes, the car stalls, the RPMs just drop smoothly to 0, and never return. But for the most part, the RPMs fall say to 0 or 100, and then bounce back to normal idle, not fluctuating up and down at all, just that one drop, then back to normal, or stall.
What i need to ask of all you evo owners out there is to help me perform a test that my freind and i discovered. I know that a lot of you have talked to me or replied to my post about this issue, who have the same or similar issues (maybe not as extreme as stalling). My freind and i noticed that for some reason, the car will not have this problem with the AC turned OFF, or in numbers 1, or 2. However, it WILL have the problem on a constant basis turned ON to numbers 3 or 4. We are curious as to how many people have these same issues in these AC modes. The reason i am wanting to know, is because the dealer is trying to tell me that this "near stalling" or RPMs falling issue is normal for the evo, while i think that is shouldn't be considered normal for ANY car, whatsoever. The dealership has a brand new evo, and during their inspections prior to sale, noted that it does the exact same thing my car does, just minus the stalling issue.
THE TEST:
what i need people to do if they wish to help submit information, is to drive their evo, Let the car warm up fully, and probably drive around in it (like on your nomral day), for about 10-20 minutes. THe issues don't occur unless the motor is warmed up, and driven for some period of time, no matter what for some reason. Turn your AC on full blast level 4, and see if you have any problems with RPMS falling when coming to a stop. Also, see about levels 3, 2, 1, then AC OFF.
The reason i'm doing this post, is so that the dealership can see what other people throughout the country/world have similar issues, or don't have similar issues with their evos. (only evo 8s by the way). It seems that the regional reps have visited here, and a few other online sites looking for information pertaining to my problem, and i am hoping that they can see this, and everyone
s replies. THe test can be done while driving your car normally on your normal day, it's nothing out of the ordinary. Stock, modded, doesn't matter, (but if you are modded, please list mods pertaiing to motor).
My hypothesis:
I am putting a logical guess to this test, and i'm thinking that not many of you have these issues, or even have them that bad. I'm thinking that this is not normal for an evo nor any car for that matter.
I do understand that while the AC is on, that the idle on some cars may drop below regular idle, say 100-200 rpms lower, then smooth out back to normal. Many cars have this occur, nothing wrong with that. BUT, when the rpms drop into the 100-200 range, this is an issue, because IMO this is not normal for any car. By the way, when this occurs, all the dash lights may turn on, and then turn off, as the RPMs bounce back up. THis occurs with me quite frequently.
I'm very sorry for the long reads, and long posts that i put up, but i'm just really trying to get some feedback from people other than the dealership, and who might have or might not have this problem.
If you don't have this problem, please post that you don't, more, the better.
I do hope that this isn't a common problem or desing flaw with the evo, and that i'm just either a lemon car, or that it's something they have overlooked and can fix. THe car is so sweet other than this.
thanks everyone!
Well, the dealer is giving me the runaround (so is mitsu corporate), and i want to turn to all of you evo owners out there for some information to help me combat my troubles with mitsu. (for specifics on my issue please refer to my post in troubleshooting forum). Modorators, please don't move this to a less viewed forum, i'm just trying to get some info to back my side up.
Ok here we go. My evo keeps having the RPMs drop when coming to a stop, (such as inching up in heavy traffic, or inching up while in a driveway, etc....), when the clutch is pushed in suddenly. Now, for some reason, the car only does this with the AC turned on (possibly putting a lot of electrical draw on the system). The car is stock now (and was when this first began happening, prior to slight modifications), and continues to do this. Sometimes, the car stalls, the RPMs just drop smoothly to 0, and never return. But for the most part, the RPMs fall say to 0 or 100, and then bounce back to normal idle, not fluctuating up and down at all, just that one drop, then back to normal, or stall.
What i need to ask of all you evo owners out there is to help me perform a test that my freind and i discovered. I know that a lot of you have talked to me or replied to my post about this issue, who have the same or similar issues (maybe not as extreme as stalling). My freind and i noticed that for some reason, the car will not have this problem with the AC turned OFF, or in numbers 1, or 2. However, it WILL have the problem on a constant basis turned ON to numbers 3 or 4. We are curious as to how many people have these same issues in these AC modes. The reason i am wanting to know, is because the dealer is trying to tell me that this "near stalling" or RPMs falling issue is normal for the evo, while i think that is shouldn't be considered normal for ANY car, whatsoever. The dealership has a brand new evo, and during their inspections prior to sale, noted that it does the exact same thing my car does, just minus the stalling issue.
THE TEST:
what i need people to do if they wish to help submit information, is to drive their evo, Let the car warm up fully, and probably drive around in it (like on your nomral day), for about 10-20 minutes. THe issues don't occur unless the motor is warmed up, and driven for some period of time, no matter what for some reason. Turn your AC on full blast level 4, and see if you have any problems with RPMS falling when coming to a stop. Also, see about levels 3, 2, 1, then AC OFF.
The reason i'm doing this post, is so that the dealership can see what other people throughout the country/world have similar issues, or don't have similar issues with their evos. (only evo 8s by the way). It seems that the regional reps have visited here, and a few other online sites looking for information pertaining to my problem, and i am hoping that they can see this, and everyone
s replies. THe test can be done while driving your car normally on your normal day, it's nothing out of the ordinary. Stock, modded, doesn't matter, (but if you are modded, please list mods pertaiing to motor).
My hypothesis:
I am putting a logical guess to this test, and i'm thinking that not many of you have these issues, or even have them that bad. I'm thinking that this is not normal for an evo nor any car for that matter.
I do understand that while the AC is on, that the idle on some cars may drop below regular idle, say 100-200 rpms lower, then smooth out back to normal. Many cars have this occur, nothing wrong with that. BUT, when the rpms drop into the 100-200 range, this is an issue, because IMO this is not normal for any car. By the way, when this occurs, all the dash lights may turn on, and then turn off, as the RPMs bounce back up. THis occurs with me quite frequently.
I'm very sorry for the long reads, and long posts that i put up, but i'm just really trying to get some feedback from people other than the dealership, and who might have or might not have this problem.
If you don't have this problem, please post that you don't, more, the better.
I do hope that this isn't a common problem or desing flaw with the evo, and that i'm just either a lemon car, or that it's something they have overlooked and can fix. THe car is so sweet other than this.
thanks everyone!
Jul 26, 2003, 01:23 AM
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oh, one last thing. If any of you guys have volts gauges hooked up, or possibly turbo timers or other devices that read voltage, please post what your normal readings are for AC off, and AC full blast are. Low voltage is a re-occuring problem with my issues as well, and the dealership has been lame not to look too much into this. Any info about voltage etc... on your rides will be very helpful as well!
Aug 13, 2003, 05:02 AM
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Sounds like a bad relay. There should be a relay that tells the EcU the load is increasing so raise the engine speed aprox 10%. This apparently is not happening and when the clutch engages it dies. Your dealer is full of BS.
It's not dying when cold because the IACV/AAC is already holding the engine at an extra 10% (aprox) giving it enough power to keep it running with accesories.
It's not dying when cold because the IACV/AAC is already holding the engine at an extra 10% (aprox) giving it enough power to keep it running with accesories.
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Aug 14, 2003, 09:38 AM
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I drive about 30 minutes every day each way from work and frequently use the AC. Both ends of that trip are stop and go city stuff, but the bulk of the trip is freeway.
I have none of the AC / idle issues you describe. In both pre-warm up and warmed up driving I can come to a stop without any stalling, and only a slight dip in idle speeds, down to about 750-800 rpm before stabilizing ant 850-900 rpms. The rpm ranges given are for warmed up driving - cold would be slightly higher rpms. I've got over 9k miles on my car, and its behavior has been consistant since new. As for voltage, my meter has always been either very slightly above 14v or very slightly below; depending on load.
I have none of the AC / idle issues you describe. In both pre-warm up and warmed up driving I can come to a stop without any stalling, and only a slight dip in idle speeds, down to about 750-800 rpm before stabilizing ant 850-900 rpms. The rpm ranges given are for warmed up driving - cold would be slightly higher rpms. I've got over 9k miles on my car, and its behavior has been consistant since new. As for voltage, my meter has always been either very slightly above 14v or very slightly below; depending on load.
Aug 14, 2003, 10:03 AM
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I have the same problem you described.
It has stalled only twice in 11000 miles but many times it
has stumbled like it wants to stall.
I waited a couple months to return the JD Powers survey to include concerns like this.
At least JD Powers knows.(for whatever that is worth)
It has stalled only twice in 11000 miles but many times it
has stumbled like it wants to stall.
I waited a couple months to return the JD Powers survey to include concerns like this.
At least JD Powers knows.(for whatever that is worth)
Aug 15, 2003, 12:18 AM
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Sorry for not being online to update my situation. I took everything off of the car, and drove to my freind's house, and the car still had the same problem. I was going to take it back to the dealership, but to a different dealer this time, but then, the car wouldn't do it. It's been about two weeks or so, and nothing. I re-installed the turbo timer, and boost gauge, still nothing. THe only thing i can think of that could have caused the problem was the grounding kit. The reason for this is because the dealer installed grounding kit is pretty faulty, and the design is pretty flawed. here is why:
The grounding kit is a "daisy chain" style, that connects to multiple points, then grounds out on factory grounding points. First off, these factory points have about a total of 12 or so wires on them, about 6 or so on each, which means that these grounds are already pretty maxed out. THe more you use a ground, the worse it gets. Also, with the cable connecting to both of these at each end of the chain, the voltage going to the ground, MAY flow thorugh the grounding cable, all the way to the other end of the chasis, thus making the ground double in length and the longer the ground, the worse it is as well. The kit actually can rob the factory cables of voltage, and send that voltage to the other end of the grounding strap, making the ground a bad ground in a sense. I have talked to a few mechanics, who agree with me on this, and if you take a look at any japanese magazine, or even the evo bible Hyper REV book, you will notice that almost 95% of the grounding kits available in japan are NOT this daisy chain style of kit, but instead use individual straps, or at the very least, use non-factory grounds. I'm sure the dealer's grounding kit is fine, if you don't use the two factory grounding points that the instructions say to use. Find two other bolts that are of the same size, in the same location, there are plenty around, and see what happens. My freind actually has the same mods as me on his evo, and he used the dealer grounding kit, but found different grounding points, and his car worked much better.
Its odd though, my voltage on my turbo timer is still the same, i'm thinking the battery is shot for some reason, but the stalling and idle issue seems to have been taken care of. I know it's not the intake as well, as i re-installed it as well, and stil had no trouble.
my voltage still reads in the mid 13s with no AC, and 12s-11s with AC, but the car runs perfect now. I'm just going to leave it alone, and continue on my project honda accord.
The grounding kit is a "daisy chain" style, that connects to multiple points, then grounds out on factory grounding points. First off, these factory points have about a total of 12 or so wires on them, about 6 or so on each, which means that these grounds are already pretty maxed out. THe more you use a ground, the worse it gets. Also, with the cable connecting to both of these at each end of the chain, the voltage going to the ground, MAY flow thorugh the grounding cable, all the way to the other end of the chasis, thus making the ground double in length and the longer the ground, the worse it is as well. The kit actually can rob the factory cables of voltage, and send that voltage to the other end of the grounding strap, making the ground a bad ground in a sense. I have talked to a few mechanics, who agree with me on this, and if you take a look at any japanese magazine, or even the evo bible Hyper REV book, you will notice that almost 95% of the grounding kits available in japan are NOT this daisy chain style of kit, but instead use individual straps, or at the very least, use non-factory grounds. I'm sure the dealer's grounding kit is fine, if you don't use the two factory grounding points that the instructions say to use. Find two other bolts that are of the same size, in the same location, there are plenty around, and see what happens. My freind actually has the same mods as me on his evo, and he used the dealer grounding kit, but found different grounding points, and his car worked much better.
Its odd though, my voltage on my turbo timer is still the same, i'm thinking the battery is shot for some reason, but the stalling and idle issue seems to have been taken care of. I know it's not the intake as well, as i re-installed it as well, and stil had no trouble.
my voltage still reads in the mid 13s with no AC, and 12s-11s with AC, but the car runs perfect now. I'm just going to leave it alone, and continue on my project honda accord.
Aug 15, 2003, 12:27 AM
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Your Post
This sounds very strange, I agree that it sounds like an A/C relay in the engine compartment to me. Its sad that you are having trouble with your dealer, Mitsubishi has done nothing but kiss my *** since I bought my EVO. Its like I bought a new Benz or something. Serivice is top notch. I guess it depends on where you go like anything else. Take your car to Mitsubishi, have a tech drive with you, show them what it does, and it will get fixed. End of story.
Jun 11, 2010, 09:22 AM
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Hello guys I have a evo 8 fq 300 UK spec. And I have been trying to sort this problem for over a year. When I put my ac on, the cars revs just fall straight down. And you can't drive the car like that. When u take the ac off then its ok but still stalls when I put the clutch in when I am just about to stop. I had changed the bov and it was ok 85% but still not 100%. Now afta 2 months its Same thing again. Now I am fed up of it
Jun 11, 2010, 11:32 AM
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If the idle doesn't hold with the AC on and you haven't messed with the idle due to cams, then it is either the ISC, the compressor controller or the ECU (in order of most likely faulty first). The OP having problems with the blower on high probably has a faulty compressor controller. The compressor controller sends a signal to the ECU when the AC load is high.
Jun 11, 2010, 02:50 PM
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I have read a lot ppls answer to this question. Ur the first person saying its the ecu. I will try and look into it, thanks a lot but of anybody knows anything more then plzz let me know thanxxxxx guys
Jun 11, 2010, 03:03 PM
#15
Lots of people have the issue. Many different reasons for it.
Have you tried to adjust your idle up a tad?...easy to do......
My cars stalls in the same manner as yours but it is because I have Kelford 272 cams and my idle is set fairly low for a BADA$$ LOPE!
Mine usually only dies when warm, a/c on, clutch disengaged, and while turning a corner (adding additional load from the power steering). It can get annoying and scary if you happen to take a corner fast and improperly.
GL resolving the issue.
Have you tried to adjust your idle up a tad?...easy to do......
My cars stalls in the same manner as yours but it is because I have Kelford 272 cams and my idle is set fairly low for a BADA$$ LOPE!
Mine usually only dies when warm, a/c on, clutch disengaged, and while turning a corner (adding additional load from the power steering). It can get annoying and scary if you happen to take a corner fast and improperly.
GL resolving the issue.