Hi just wondering on everyone thought/experiance on cams on stock valve springs was thinking i would just go for the hks stage 1 272's not sure who has the best price for them at the moment but i have no intention in changing springs at all and im unsure what other manufacturers make lower lift cams for stock valve train but any people experience and info would be much appreciated thanks

 

I have Kelford's and they are giving me really sick top end

 

have you had any problems with floating valves tho, as kelford recommend spring replacement , I was going to go with kelfords as i live in the same city here in new zealand where they make them but due to earthquake kelford have been out of action and had to relocate not sure if they are back into business fully yet

 

i drive 272 HKS cams for over 30.000miles on stock valve springs without any problems!

 

Same^^^^, Just install and go--there have never been VS issues with those.

 

Good thread. I want to know as well. Bump!

 

I been driving with 280 hks over a yr now and no problem.

 

OP, I forgot to mention that Alfred (he's an awesome tuner) at Tuning Technologies here in So Cal told me that the stock valve train kicks *** and that he ran Kelford 272 cams to 8000 RPM all the time on his personal car with no problems whatsoever. Take that for what it's worth but coming from Alfred I'd say that's good info. I plan on running the stock valve train with Kelford 272s to between 7500 and 8000 rpms on my car. If you want to rev past 8000 then I'd say upgrade the valve train. But, personally, I have yet to see many cars making power above 7500 rpm anyway, and David Buscher himself said that at 9000 rpm the cylinder walls can begin to crack on a 4g63 motor. So again, take that as you will. I personally wouldn't go higher than 8000 rpm on a stock block, at least not regularly. The rod bolts are a weak point in my humble opinion. The stock valve train can handle a lot more than people think. Remember, shops want to make money, they'll tell you to upgrade the valve train with any cam upgrade, it's more money in their pockets.

 

s2 for 9 months stock springs runs like a bat out of hell

 

if you want to play safe HKS 272 are ideal, S2 and Kelfords 272 are really good cams but require springs and retainers, most of the people ignore the fact because its possible not to upgrade the vlave train as long as you dont over do it. The catch is that with S2 or Kelf 272 if you go past 7400 or so you will def get valve floating, with HKS i hit 7800-8000 on oem head with no problem.

 

had hks 272s on my 03 from 2004 to when I sold the car in 2008 with lot of drag races (hence revving to 8k) no problem. Have Buddy Club 272s in my 05 MR since 2007 with occasionally rev to 7800 no problem (no drag race so). All on stock valves and springs.

 

OEM Evo springs have a MAX lift of 11mm. Sure you can throw Kelfords, or S2's (11.2MM Intake) in with stock springs, and sure people are going to be on the internet saying its fine and their car runs great on stock springs and they went this many RPM's for this many miles without issue.

BUT when it comes to reality, and you break a spring or bust something in your head up and your motor takes a dive because you avoided a couple hundred dollar set of springs and retainers (that enhance the performance of the cams as well) just because you were trying to be cheap...who are you going to be mad at? Can't blame the people on here, you'll hear crickets when you try to point the finger.

If the manufacturer recommends upgraded springs with their product, it's to ensure maximum performance of said product. And when shops tell you to get springs, it's because they don't want to deal with the issues when you break something and come back to them mad. Comp 272's, HKS 272's, BC272 all will work with stock springs. Because they're lift stays below what the stock spring can handle. Stock spring = Stock results.

Do it right the first time or don't do it. These aren't Honda Civics.

/the end

 

Oh, wow. I disagree with this info on so many levels. One, the manufacturer will obviously tell you to buy their springs with the cam purchase. Wonder why. They want your money. Is this news? Second, shops don't want to deal with you when you've blown your motor? Uh huh, they are a business right? The goal of a business is to make money. Thus, if you break your motor, believe me they want to deal with you. Blown motor translates into big bucks for the shop. Third, upgraded springs have nothing to do with the performance of the cam. The stiffer springs do one thing, prevent valve float at high rpm's and when using aggressive cam profiles. Kelford 272 cams work FINE and WELL with the stock valve train up to 7500 to 8000 rpm. Period. Do it, you will not have a problem and you'll save money. AGAIN, if you use a more aggressive cam or rev higher than 8000 rpm's, you should upgrade the springs. But, you should also upgrade the rod bolts at the same time because you are risking throwing a rod if you're revving past 8000 rpm's regularly.

 

i have 272 hks cams, didnt change valve train and no problems yet, the lift on it is too small so it shouldnt hurt anything

 

Yes sir!
It's America bro you can disagree all you want...but sorry your wrong .....springs help performance not just alleviate valve float. By the way upgrading rod bolts is a poor mans built engine...and not to mention moronic to do...but what would you know about bearing crush and clearances

To the OP if you get cams that SAY springs/retain required or recommended...then squeeze your wallet a lil more and get them...your engine will be happy.

$.02