Here is a scaled down version of my origional post:

Hey guys, my EVO just died

Feb 8, 2004 06:55 PM

Started up and ran fine. Got 50 ft and it just up and died. There were no indications that anything was wrong. It cranks just fine and sounds like it wants to run but thats about it. end.

Well, I got my car back from the dealer today. The tech said the spark plugs were fouled. Not only that but my oil wreaked of gasoline. Explanation: during cold weather starts the engine makes the air/fule mixture super rich. The car must be run for an extended period of time to burn all the extra gas from startup or the engine will become flooded or "loaded" as he called it. Repair work done: took spark plugs out, wiped them off, put them back it and chainged the oil. None of which was covered under the warantee. The car has 4500 miles, oil had 1500 miles and the car has only been driven 200 miles in cold weather. Get this. As part of the techs explanation, he tells me the other 3 EVOs on the lot have the same probem and one has already gone through three sets of spark plugs/oil changes. He says they let the EVOs run for two hours after they move them to burn all of the excess fuel. What do you guys think of this? I think this is ridiculous.

 

Definitely sounds extremely shaky. You should not have had to pay anything for that repair, or the tow for that matter if you did.

 

???

That does seem wacked. I do think this car runs super rich, esp in very cold weather, and that can be quite a PITA and cause weird behavior. I had to turn my boost way down to avoid fuel cut when it was super cold over the past few weeks. Also, I've been getting some throttle sticking which may be due to deposits gumming up the throttle (there's another thread on this).

On a side note, if you let the car idle (I assume?) for 2 hours, isn't that going to really promote deposits and whatnot? I've seen the issue of extended idling discussed on several internet forums, with people on both side of the argument...

FB

 

I think letting the car idle for two hours would really cause it to load up. 2 HOURS???

 

LOL crazy *** techs. I let my car warm up till the temp gauge needle starts to move up. After that I roll, ussually equals about 3-5 minutes depending on weather. Even if the car ran super rich , no reason to run the car for no 2 hrs LOL they are just insane with there answers. Thats why I never take anything mitsu says for granted cause it is mostly BS

 

There is NO need to allow a car to "warm up" before driving it. Either the oil flows or it doesn't. If it's not flowing and up to pressure after about 3 to 5 seconds, you've already hosed the rod bearings anyway. Allowing a car to idle until it warms up doesn't warm up the rest of the drivetrain very much and only serves to waste fuel.

However, it's probably alot more comfortable to drive once it's warm and on that level I can sympathize. Really a cool idea if you're concerned about warm up time and run rich conditions is to install a block heater. It will keep nearly the entire drivetrain warm.

Bear in mind, I'm not suggesting that anyone crank the engine up and proceed to drive the car at full boost the minute you hit the street.

Not tryin' to hate, just giving my post ***** $0.02 worth.

 

So if your not an advocate of warming up a car before you drive and you say that you shouldn't drive like a bat out of hell just after start up, what are you saying?? Do you go into boost while cold?

Warming a car up isn't really for the "drivetrain"...

I bet the minute you get to your place of work, you don't start to actually "work" right away, right??

Don't athletes warm up before competing???

 

Pat Goss of Goss's garage on Motorweek when asked a question about warming a car up on cold days said that extended warm up, although nice to get the heat working inside the car, is actually harmful. he said let the car run for about a minute or so and then drive easily until temp comes up. he indicated that excessive warmup promotes condensation, water, in the oil and is not recommended.
just passing that on.

 

While, generally, I think too many on this forum are warranty happy, here's a case where most of the repair should be covered.

An argument could be made that since the oil change is a maintenance item, it wouldn't be covered, but it could also be argued that it was consequential damage and thus should be.

The part about letting it run for two hours is pure hogwash. Look in your owners manual - what does it say about cold start-up procedure. You were doing nothing wrong. My thoughts are that they may not have discovered the true cause of your problem, and it'll come back to bite you in the *** down the road. regarding your immediate concern, contact either Mitsu directly, or the dealer and request an audience with the zone rep. This should be taken care of and you want to be on record with your problem.

My Evo is a daily driver and I have never let it warm up - even all through what was the coldest January in umpteen years, and I've had absolutely no problems.

Above applies if the Evo is pure stock - any mods that could be tied to fuel mixture will pretty much negate any chance of a warranty claim. Hope this helps.

Adios,

Fusoguy

 

its not about pumping oil.. its about warming ur oil up so it can easily get into all the groves... if u got a really cold start.. all the engine parts are warming up at different rates and u get alot of friction because ur oil aint there... i dont know where u get off saying u dont need to warm up ur engine, warming up ur engine and cooling down ur turbo before shutting down is two major things to do religiously to prolong ur engine life.

 

All I know is since 5,500mi my 90 GSX has been warmed up till the needle moves then I drive it, no boost of course, till it reaches opp temp. Then it’s on! It now has 218,000mi on it, never been rebuilt, does not smoke and still running 19psi! It’s had over $2,300 in oil changes since new. No doubt these motors are tough! But it’s all about preventive maintenance!

 

For the first 2-3 miles or 15 minutes of driving, you're supposed to take it easy and not go above 40mph, after that it's smooth sailing.

 

These are some of the downsides of "excessive" idling that I was referring to, as well as the increased deposits I mentioned.

I generally let the car idle for 20-30 seconds, then drive very gently, not exceeding 2500-3000 rpm for awhile. I even wait a little longer than coolant temp at "normal", since my last car (Audi A4 1.8T had a factory oil temp gauge and it would take quite a bit longer for the oil to come up to "normal" temps.

I think almost everyone agrees not to boost until the car is semi-warm, but rather than just idle for too long I try to drive gently instead...

Take care,

FB

 

I get in my car in the morning, start it up, set the heater controls, turn on my favorite radio station or CD and then I back out of my driveway and drive. I don't beat on the car & I don't go into boost until the vehicle is up to operating temperature. It's as simple as that. On cold mornings (15 to 20deg F) my coolant temp is starting to hit the half way point to normal operating temperature by the time I'm at the traffic light a mile from my house. When I finally can find the right oil temperature gauge, I'll be able to use that to determine operating temperature readiness.

What I don't do is go out, start the car up and then go back inside to drink my morning beverage or whatnot for five, ten or fifteen minutes. It's not necessary. I don't run 90W oil in my crankcase. I run a modern synthetic oil that flows quite easily in cold temperatures, especially at 100psi of pressure.

What "grooves" are there for the oil to flow in to? I've never seen rod bearings, crank bearings, cam bearings or cam lobes with grooves that need to be filled before the engine can be used. If the oil does not sufficiently cover these bearing surfaces very, very quickly after start up, you're ****ed regardless of how long you let your engine run before you drive it.

Now if the temperature was -15deg F, then I might let the car warm up so I can at least get the transmission into gear. ****, I'm not superhuman or a glutton for punishment.

Call me crazy or whatever you want but my practices haven't yet contributed to the advanced demise of ANY of the engines I've owned over the last 20 years, turbocharged or otherwise. My warm up and cool down procedures, while important, are the least of my concerns when it comes to engine longevity.

 

well said, propellerhead! Same approach I use, common sense on easy driving until warmed up.