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Old Dec 7, 2005 | 01:24 PM
  #46  
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Focus on school first, do everything on the side, set your priorities straight.
The key to success.
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Old Dec 7, 2005 | 01:38 PM
  #47  
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may i offer one other solution?

first off, finishing college was the best thing i ever did with my time. i have a mechanical engineering degree and work at Lockheed Martin in dallas. additionally, i am pursuing my masters degree in ME at the univeristy of texas at arlington. and here is where i think i might have a solution for you.

at my undergrad school, i did what one other guy mentioned... college was kinda like high school. i input equations and output answers. very little hands on learning.

at UTA we have a formula SAE team. i would HIGHLY recommend finding a school with a formula SAE team and join and helping as much as humanly possible on it. in the 1 year i have been involved, i have learned more then i could ever dream about on a car. and that includes design, fabrication, testing, analyzing, and driving the race cars. our school has one of the more premier programs which certainly helps. but from what i have learned, i'm sure that more then 90% of the people on these boards don't truely understand the engineering behind race cars. The Best feeling you get is when you order something from a vendor and then say, wow, i could build this better then they did!

as an example, here at UTA we build our own carbon fiber undertray with tunnels, carbon fiber wheels (13in wheels weigh only 3.x pounds), we make our own carbon 4 element wings, build and tune our engine with a stand alone ECU, and we even have our own home built ECU's as well. going to a school that has a program like this makes your resume unbeatable in the eyes of an employer. you also get contacts at nearly every major automotive company in the world, so when you are done with school, you can pick and choose what you want to do. best of all, it is totally free!!!!! the teams all find sponsors to fund the club and supply parts (thats not to say some smaller programs do have funding problems and end up paying out of pocket for something they love). and last you get to drive a car that an evo could never touch on an autocross course. our car has recorded over 2 G's of lateral acceration in a slalom, and can do 0-50mph in 3 secs (our new car will be quicker).

i doubt UTA would be your first choice for a school, but if your interested in finding out more about this, let me know! our school has competed in detroit, england, australia and japan. this year we are going to detroit, california, and have considered germany.
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Old Dec 7, 2005 | 04:59 PM
  #48  
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I can't help but think what a mistake you guys are advocating with this guy. Sure it's easy to get all teary eyed and shout 'Go for it' from the sidelines as this guy pursues his dream, but would you take your car to a shop run by a lone guy with no experience and from what it sounds like no tools? You've got a lot of preparation to do from the sounds of it, and I think you'll be doing yourself a huge favor by doing the preparation while you're also finish up your college education.

It's not that I doubt your skills or talent, as I have no reason to at this point, but you're setting yourself up for a big failure that is certainly avoidable. 10 years ago you might have been able to do something like this on your own and get by with it in the import market with a near endless amount of personal drive and a good solid startup capital, equipment, and location. But now? You're going to bang heads with the big shops with proven reputations and an established customer base. Unless you like the idea of living out of your parents basement for the next 5 years while you contend with a steep learning curve, you're in for a hard time. Keep in mind that you've not only got to be mechanically experienced, you've also got to possess the business sense to keep things running in the black. You're going to meet up with all the problems first time business owners face as well as the technical hurdles of running a car shop. That's not easy, not for a second.

I may seem negative, but that's only because I'm trying to save you from a lot of trouble in the end. I've had multiple friends strike out on their own with a twinkle in their eyes and a dream of owning a shop with a headlining sick import and they've all failed. One has 250K in debt (and he's 22 and his parents backed him up all the way with cash and loans), the other is currently barely treading water after a 'business partner' left him high and dry, and the third closed the business and is back to turning wrenches out of his parents garage (this guy was a master mechanic to start out with and went the longest stretch of 5 years before realizing it wasn't as he imagined it). These are just 3 guys that never hit the radar map beyond the local scenes. So again, for every self-made success you can point out, I'm sure there are dozens and dozens of failed attempts from ill-prepared dreamers hoping to follow in their footsteps.
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Old Dec 7, 2005 | 05:11 PM
  #49  
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Good insightful thread!
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Old Dec 7, 2005 | 06:36 PM
  #50  
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i reiterate my point. joining a formula SAE team like UTA, we have access and use all the time, a TIG welder, CNC mill, CNC lathe, manual mills, manual lathes, access to an autoclave, a full design lab with all the software you could imagine, and all the tools you could ever need. if you don't care about learning about designing parts, you can get your hands dirty making them. as soon as i am done with this year of competition, my friend and i are going to start fabbing tuned intake and exhuast manifolds for the evo. we can even make it polished to have the bling, but it will have the resonances to make your evo go faster
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Old Dec 8, 2005 | 11:44 AM
  #51  
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This is a dead thread so now let's move ahead please.
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Old Dec 8, 2005 | 12:12 PM
  #52  
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huh? i thought it was really insightful lots of people telling real world stories offering the kid advice.

rodger. the thread is dead (for a whole 17 hours woooh thats a long time). so why did you need to dig it up to say that? i'm befuddled.
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Old Dec 8, 2005 | 05:54 PM
  #53  
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I'll chime in with some quick insights. I've been in the business now for 9 years. My family has always been in business for itself, with my father owning, at one point in time, nearly 20 retail clothing stores up and down the east coast. I grew up in the retail environment from the time I was 10. I learned 2 basic things. 1 was that I really loved certain aspects of it, and 2, that I absolutely had zero desire to be in the family business. Fast forward to when I graduated college 10 years ago. My fathers business took a turn for the worse, and he was faced, at 45 years old, with having to close the company he helped to build and essentially start over. He took some time, gave it though, and became a financial planner. He is now more successful than ever, and more importantly, is happy.

Cars have always been a passion of mine, since I was in diapers. I played with tonka trucks till it was dark out, I played with R/C cars from the day I could turn a screwdriver, and I poured over car magazines till I had every stat memorized. All throughout college, I worked to support my modding, as meager as it was, on my Datsun. Through the ownership of that car, I was introduced to Z1. At first I was just an occassional customer. As my income grew, and my car passion/collection grew, I became a better customer of Z1. Now am an owner.

I can certainly understand and appreciate where guys like DSMotorsport come from. I also was on the other side of the fence at first. Made good money in a totally unrelated field, but my passion has always been cars..and remains so to this day. The business side of the industry is a blessing and a curse all at once - it is not an easy business to be in, but then again, anytime you are in business for yourself, it is not an easy or quick endeavor - it takes alot of alot of things...time, money, patience, time, money, sweat. You get the idea. About 5 years ago I made the transition to the industry full time, as a hands on prinicpal - I have personally never looked back. With as much aggrivation as there can be in this industry, it's is tons of fun for me day in and day out. If I was not in the business, I'd still be doing exactly the same thing in my off time - pouring over my monthly subscriptions to the Japanese magazines, talking to the contacts I have made over the years around the world about new parts, new trends, hanging out with friends and their modded cars. I live, east sleep and breathe this culture, and am lucky I can make my living at it.

To those who say you have to service cars to make money, it's simply not true. It certainly helps, but it's not necessary. We were heavily into installs at one time, but not anymore. For the last 5 years or so, we hardly do any, and that is by choice. I found myself losing the passion by working on others cars. It was not "fun". So we revamped, focused more on the parts side of things, and, for the most part, the only cars that we work on, are our own. Personal cars, and 2 race cars takes alot of time and dedication to do, but we can do so at our leisure, and the fun is there.

My suggestion is to somehow find a way to spend time in the industry - an apprenticeship, an internship - something. When you are on the outside looking in, things can look rosey. When you are the inside the fishtank, the view often changes. But if you can spend time in it and still, at the end of the day, enjoy where you are and what you are doing, then go for it. Despite what others might say, passion does not equal success - but it always helps.


Good luck, and have fun

Adam

Last edited by Z1 Performance; Dec 8, 2005 at 05:59 PM.
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Old Dec 8, 2005 | 06:59 PM
  #54  
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Originally Posted by Z1 Performance
I'll chime in with some quick insights. I've been in the business now for 9 years. My family has always been in business for itself, with my father owning, at one point in time, nearly 20 retail clothing stores up and down the east coast. I grew up in the retail environment from the time I was 10. I learned 2 basic things. 1 was that I really loved certain aspects of it, and 2, that I absolutely had zero desire to be in the family business. Fast forward to when I graduated college 10 years ago. My fathers business took a turn for the worse, and he was faced, at 45 years old, with having to close the company he helped to build and essentially start over. He took some time, gave it though, and became a financial planner. He is now more successful than ever, and more importantly, is happy.

Cars have always been a passion of mine, since I was in diapers. I played with tonka trucks till it was dark out, I played with R/C cars from the day I could turn a screwdriver, and I poured over car magazines till I had every stat memorized. All throughout college, I worked to support my modding, as meager as it was, on my Datsun. Through the ownership of that car, I was introduced to Z1. At first I was just an occassional customer. As my income grew, and my car passion/collection grew, I became a better customer of Z1. Now am an owner.

I can certainly understand and appreciate where guys like DSMotorsport come from. I also was on the other side of the fence at first. Made good money in a totally unrelated field, but my passion has always been cars..and remains so to this day. The business side of the industry is a blessing and a curse all at once - it is not an easy business to be in, but then again, anytime you are in business for yourself, it is not an easy or quick endeavor - it takes alot of alot of things...time, money, patience, time, money, sweat. You get the idea. About 5 years ago I made the transition to the industry full time, as a hands on prinicpal - I have personally never looked back. With as much aggrivation as there can be in this industry, it's is tons of fun for me day in and day out. If I was not in the business, I'd still be doing exactly the same thing in my off time - pouring over my monthly subscriptions to the Japanese magazines, talking to the contacts I have made over the years around the world about new parts, new trends, hanging out with friends and their modded cars. I live, east sleep and breathe this culture, and am lucky I can make my living at it.

To those who say you have to service cars to make money, it's simply not true. It certainly helps, but it's not necessary. We were heavily into installs at one time, but not anymore. For the last 5 years or so, we hardly do any, and that is by choice. I found myself losing the passion by working on others cars. It was not "fun". So we revamped, focused more on the parts side of things, and, for the most part, the only cars that we work on, are our own. Personal cars, and 2 race cars takes alot of time and dedication to do, but we can do so at our leisure, and the fun is there.

My suggestion is to somehow find a way to spend time in the industry - an apprenticeship, an internship - something. When you are on the outside looking in, things can look rosey. When you are the inside the fishtank, the view often changes. But if you can spend time in it and still, at the end of the day, enjoy where you are and what you are doing, then go for it. Despite what others might say, passion does not equal success - but it always helps.


Good luck, and have fun

Adam
Adam,

well said and thanks for sharing. I too used to work for a speed shop and have gone to events to promote the company and even worked at the Jacob Javits auto show to represent the shop as well. Working there for a couple of years while I was in college taught me a lot of things as well. The rewards can be there but you sure have to sweat to make it happen. as far as parts go, you really have to decide what kinda parts you wanna carry and what kind of clientele you want to cater to. sadly the shop I used to work for mainly catered to ricers and wannabes. We mainly sold low-profit accessories and other items, where my heart really wanted to deal with the real JDM go-fast stuff and parts.

Ohh well...what can I say, I still dream of doing this as well, but I do realize that there is a lot of competition out there, but for me to do well I probably need to start small and work my way from there and let my experience and others peoples experiences help me out along the way.

Bottom line, I already have a business plan outlined but I have really never put it to practice... well, maybe one day soon ..
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Old Dec 8, 2005 | 07:15 PM
  #55  
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Originally Posted by get faster
This is a really good thread indeed.

While its important to have dreams and goals, its also important to listen to others that already 'walk the walk'. Reading your posts I conclude that you're a mature guy and I have full confidence that you shall make some smart choices concerning your future.

God Bless! Keep us infomed.
Hey, thanks! Thats much appreciated. In the past three weeks since a little twinge of the idea (and this post) started Ive made many changes. Ive looked into UTI, multiple schools, my 401K program (which will finance school for a while).

I have given notice of my intentions to my boss, and they, surprisngly have wished me the best and supported me. Again, to my surprise, they are trying to convince me to stay......but I told them I have bigger dreams than working for Costco for the rest of my life. My boss wonders why the change of heart, and I told him with complete confidence that I am smarter than I make myself seem, I am more capable and I have finally realized that I am selling myself short. I also told him that it seems that most of my depression and lack of motivation is for those reasons exactly.


SO thanks for all the great responses, and for the ones with reality checks also.

Keeping a real idea about what life has to offer is good, and I appreciate that...

I figure without trying, I'll never be able look back and say I did and tried. Not even trying scares me to death.....


So Im going to try and take the right steps....UTI, try to find a job at a performance shop, learn the trade...and see if its what I want to do. Also considering that I may decide that I dont want to do this for a living, Im going to continue to school myself, and get my engineering degree, so I can explore other options, or combine the two and start a business focusing on parts, tuning, innovating...or whatever it might be. So...one by one...Im going to tackle them. Thanks for the input!
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Old Dec 8, 2005 | 07:15 PM
  #56  
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Keep dreaming. It's the people that stand in line and don't take risks that will hold you back. The best time to follow a dream is when there's nobody else to fall with you (i.e. family). You're in the right possition to make it happen. Good luck!
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Old Dec 8, 2005 | 11:07 PM
  #57  
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Originally Posted by Blue Evo 8
Thats good advice as well from someone who is experienced. I have worked my college years at a speed shop and got to see and experience first hand how everything is done. But one thing I can guarantee is that, nothing beats owning your own business and being your own boss.

true that employees may bring headaches, but I have plans on working with or partnering up with my siblings and childhood friends who have the same passion for cars as I do. In other words work with people you know and trust.

At the speed shop i worked at, employees would steal parts from my boss all the time and use it on their cars and even sell it on the side, where as I am honest and have never stole from my boss. I have always worked hard for my parts and paid for it with my own money.

Its true that building the same parts over and over again may be boring after a while, and dealing with the same ol' EVO customers may get boring, but to make it fun I think its cool if you were able to have a shop car and travel around the USA, attending track events, competing against other shops, and at the same time promoting your own shop and services.....
friends/family and business are hard to mix....
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Old Dec 8, 2005 | 11:08 PM
  #58  
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Since it seems appropriate in this thread, I will post my story of where I've gotten to where I'm at today. Feldguy could use it as his inspiration or nightmare, however he looks at it.

Lets start early. As one guy said, I was always a car freak since I could remember. I did the R/C car racing thing alot when I was 14-16. I raced with alot of cool people at an early age, I even held off Jeff Green (now a BGN/Nextel Cup driver) for quite a few laps with a very inferior car, and got my name posted in a few R/C car mags.

I finished HS but feel a credit short of graduating, so I got Uncle GED. I absolutly hated school and had NO desire to go right back into one. So at the age of 19 or so, I got my own place and got a full time job at the now defunct Service Merchandise. I struggled along through 3-4 full time jobs and was absolutly broke the whole time. I think I "grew up" too fast and wasent ready for it.

I was always interested in cars but it wasent really a hobby of mine, UNTIL I went looking for a nice daily car with low miles and a decent payment in 1998. Thats when I found my first DSM, an automatic 1993 Eclipse GS non turbo. It was perfect, almost 5 years old and 28k miles and not a scratch, ding, nothing. I didnt even know people modified them until I started looking around on the internet and found Club DSM. I was hooked from this point on.

I got rid of that thing and moved away from Florida back home to where I'm from, Louisville, KY. I then found my first "fast" car. A 1989 Mirage Turbo. This sparked the start of my first car I really started to modify. From 2000 to about 2003, I never really held a steady job. I mostly got by on working on cars on the side for people. I really had a big reputation as being the go-to guy around that area when it came to having your Mitsubishi worked on if you didnt want to go to a shop (there were really no good shops for DSMs anyway). I did quite a few crazy motor swaps on sleeper cars that people loved. This is where I gained almost all of my experience.

In 2003 a small "performance shop" gave me a job as a mechanic. I worked there for about a year until it got to the point where the shop owner was really slacking, and things were getting bad there, reputation and financially wise. I knew I had to get away from that place.

During the later parts of my stay there, I was put in contact with Martin at AMS about a posistion they had in Chicago. It came down to the crossroads of moving everything I had to a huge city thats very expensive and leaving family and friends to work for a very well known and established company, or staying and helping my friend establish the new shop we opened up. I decided to make the career move and go to AMS. I would never look back, the shop we started didn't last 6 months after I left.

This puts me at where I'm at today. I've been here about a year and a half now and I'm happier than I've ever been in my life. I have a good paying job doing what I love that has great hours, I work for great people, I get to drive the worlds fastest Evo 8 (it was always my dream as a kid to be a race car driver, and now I get to drive one), go to Vegas, go to races, travel, and meet lots of great people. Plus I don't ever have to get up and dred going to work, I enjoy every single day.

I struggled for so many years and made so many bad decisions, but considering where I have ended up, I wouldn't change a thing because if I did, I might not be where I'm at today.

Use this as you may. I'm not saying to do what I did, most people probably wouldn't have ended up where I did. But let it be an inspiration that at least one dumb uneducated redneck made it (outside the world of NASCAR)!
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Old Dec 9, 2005 | 09:07 AM
  #59  
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Hey Feldguy,

Have you checked out EFI 101 for tuning classes? I heard they are pretty top notch.

And to DSMotorsports, Z1, and gsnt; those are some incredible and inspiring stories

Thanks,

Terry S
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Old Dec 9, 2005 | 09:31 AM
  #60  
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Why don't people ever listen to their parents, when they tell their kids to go to school? You're not a teenager anymore. If your parents still feel the need to tell you to go back to school, listen to them.
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